hhnngg1

Nope, even at your crazy discount Cytomax price, you're not even close to Maltodextrin.

For that $48.99 can (which you got for $12 - steal of the day, yes!) you get 4.5 pounds. So you're still paying over $2 per pound.

Bulk maltodextrin is shipped $60 for 50 pounds, which is about half the price you paid for your Cytomax.

danmc

Just wait until the squirrels get into it. They be hucking nuts like never before!

hhnngg1

I'm actually surprised, but those plastic big paint containers you get for $3 at Home Depot have been amazingly resistant to everything - mice, humidity, etc.

When I moved last year, I had to throw out about 20 pounds of maltodextrin that I hadn't gone through in 3 YEARS (I'd only used 30 pounds in that period) that was as good as new.

I'm back on the malto habit now again though, since I've been ramping up training for a half ironman and all my run/bike workouts are greater than 90 minutes, with weekend bikes of 5 hours at a time. I've been pounding down the malto at a really rapid rate, and it's been a fantastic fuel source. Every week I go through at least 6 cups of it or 24cups per month, so I'm glad it's not pricey stuff. (24 cups would approximately weigh 12 pounds of sugar, which would be nearly 3 Cytomax containers at the 4.5pound weight listed above.)

danmc

I just ordered some maltodextrin from Amazon and am waiting on it to be delivered. I also ordered some salt tablets that also have potassium and other electrolytes. I don't want to pay a lot for stuff that's filled with other crap that I don't want. Plus, I've gone about 1,600 miles on just water. But I realize that I need something to replenish the electrolytes when it's really hot, especially, and some extra fuel for the really long rides would be good.

canam73

So track down some electrolytes and add that to your cost. Then any other flavoring you are adding in. Then pay yourself for the the time wasted dicking around with it. You won't be ahead unless you think your time is worthless. Mine isn't.

As I said, I've been down that road. It gets old. Instead of paying $60 you could have paid the shipping for me to send you what I have left over that I probably won't ever use. But you still wouldn't be ahead.

hhnngg1

I'm all set. I don't need all the extra stuff that Cytoma claims to have an effect.

This is literally my maltodextrin protocol: 1 cup per bottle. The end. I bring salt tabs for rides over 3 hours, and start taking 1 per hour after the 2 hour mark. This is also my racing protocol for the bike leg of the HIM I'm training for.

Electrolytes - a simple salt tab suffices. You can get over a hundred from Saltstick for $20. Flavoring? Don't need it. Maltodextrin has a nice mellow sweet flavor that's perfect for me. This isn't a flavor contest - this is functional nutrition for training and racing.

Granted, if you absolutely NEED cytomax's formulation of electrolytes and flavoring, then of course, you're best off buying cytomax. (Duh.) But you're not losing any functionality by going with maltodextrin, which as I showed is 2x cheaper than even your discounted Cytomax. It's not even close, actually.

canam73

It's your life, do what you want. None of us (amateurs) NEED any of this. Normal food and water will give you energy and hydrate you.

But for me, having everything I would WANT in one easy to mix tub is easily worth the $1 pound you save. But maybe it's because I also consider my time worth something.

hhnngg1

None of us NEED this, yes, but you should train how you'd race. For my upcoming HIM, I want to have liquid nutrition - for convenience on the bike (which is the main place to keep the calorie load up) and for function. Also, if you don't take solid food, you don't get the need to pass a #2 on the race course. I don't want to train with normal food as well because I'm not going to have normal food available to me on the race course.

Given that the race will probably take me between 5hrs -5hrs:15 minutes, it's important to get the fuel right. Even Lance Armstrong, who recently raced a HIM, admitted that screwing up his nutrition made him race subpar, and that he was racing specifically to fine-tune his nutrition for the Kona Ironman (which he can't race anymore due to the doping charge.)

The maltodextrin I use was use by pros in many endurance sports for decades, well before they got paid to use custom mixes.

And as well, it is completely worth it financially to use maltodextrin if it works for you during testing. As I said, I consumed 24 cups worth of maltodextrin this month alone during training (between 14-18 hours per week.) At the typical Cytomax pricing, of $48 for 4.5 pounds, that's would be over $50 per MONTH for my nutrition. That's a lot.

If you're training casually and don't use much more than a few cups per month, then sure, go crazy - it really doesn't matter how expensive your fuel is because you use very little of it. But if you're putting up those big training hours, you can save a lot of money by going maltodextrin. On Slowtwitch, one guy switched from Perpetuem to maltodextrin and took his nutrition bill from $100 per month to close to zero.

And you're deluding yourself if you think I'm spending extra time making custom mixes. It's just like I said - 1 cup of bulk malto, no additives. It's as simple as your adding cytomax to water, no different.

canam73

Pure malto does not dissolve as easily as Cyto or any other sport drink i've used. There is also time spent with your salt tabs.

I don't always expect to get that price on Cytomax, but when I use it up I will shop around for the next good deal on whatever is similar.

Oh, and Lance and the other pro's don't mix their own stuff or even pay for it, so comparing what you do to them is silly.

hhnngg1

No problems dissolving malto. There might be a few tiny clumps, yes, at first, but they're all gone by the time I take my first swig.

I don't know how salt tabs take any extra time. Stash one in your bag or wherever, and you're good to go.

canam73

You're all set, then. Good luck in your event.

gregf83 

Dump it in your bottles the night before and leave them in the fridge. In the morning - no lumps. If you want the same maltodextrin cyto uses you can order 50 lbs of QD500 from a number of sources. QD is quick dissolving and is the stuff used by most commercial drink manufacturers.

canam73

I'm genuinely curious: did you read the thread before you posted?

Anyway, I've done overnight. I've sourced 2 different types of malto. I've also heated the water. It still always requires more time and/or effort than a mix. And if you do want electrolytes and or flavor and or other additives you still have work to do.

Happily, somebody else did for me so with no needing to pre-plan or pre-mix a thing I can dump a scoop in a bottle, add water/ice and go 1 minute before my ride. Cool.

Even at the $20-25 I typically pay for a can of drink of mix it is completely worth it.

Does QD go for $1/lb? Because otherwise it is irrelevant to the conversation.

redlude97

Why are you guys using just maltodextrin, why not just use sugar? Or a combination of maltodextrin and sugar?

canam73

You wouldn't understand.

hhnngg1

Substantially less sweet. Allegedly has a better absorption profile.

Its not just us - gels and the vast majority of calorie replacement drinks use maltodextrin as the main ingredient. Gels are 98% malto

dimachka

Because they are hardcore dude, obviously! Me? I personally stick to Milky Way bars and Mountain Dew while I ride.

redlude97

Really? Try me. You have read the scientific literature on glucose and fructose absorption pathways and the benefits of using both right? You guys do realize that cytomax has maltodextrin, fructose, and glucose right? Table Sugar ie sucrose=50/50 glucose/fructose.

canam73

Read a couple of my posts in this thread. Then take a wild guess at what I really think. (Hint: I'm the OP who just bought 14 pounds of cytomax.)

redlude97

It does have some osmolarity benefits, but you still don't get the benefits of the parallel fructose absorption pathways

redlude97

I read every post in the thread, they revolve around cost vs. convenience, not nutrition

Shimagnolo

Article about what he is talking about: https://www.outsideonline.com/fitness...sponsibly.html

Jeukendrup's hydration recipe:
0.5 cup maltodextrin
6.5 tsp fructose
0.25-0.5 tsp table salt
Combine in one liter of water, shake, and serve!

gregf83 

I think it's mainly just the lower sweetness. If you add some fructose to the maltodextrin you can optimize the absorption of carbs. Personally, I don't find much difference between sugar and malto. Neither bother my stomach.

canam73

So you feel correct in assuming things not mentioned because?

gregf83 

I read some of it. You said pure malto doesn't dissolve as well as cyto and I just let people, including yourself, know what type of malto to buy that dissolves as well as cyto. My apologies if I offended you.

I don't know the exact price but I'm fairly certain it's significantly less expensive than cyto and dissolves just as well.