I had a cheap mag trainer which I sold before getting the PM. I absolutely despised riding the thing. I understand that some people use them out of necessity and others enjoy the bang-for-the buck they allow if you only have limited time to train. But the weather is nice enough here that I can ride pretty ride every day outdoors if I wanted to. I just found a 20 minute climb I'd much rather use for testing. I already checked it out and gearing isn't a problem to climb it at my preferred cadence.

Talking when riding? Yes, its becomes more difficult the faster you go. In fact its kind of a litmus test. Beware of guys who want to carry on a conversation at 22mph. They be fast :)
But if you want real difficulty, try singing Opera when sprinting at 35mph. Now that's tough.

I'm not sure you do fully understand.

Try hitting NOTHING but z6 power for two minutes outside. Or z5 power for 4 minutes.

The following are from two different workouts, one on the trainer and one outside. The workouts were 4 minute z5 intervals with 4 minute rest intervals, to exhaustion.

Outside (and this was the BEST interval I had at keeping power in z5 - note the power spikes above and below z5, along with a couple of significant drops into z1):

http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment...3&d=1395093030

On the trainer, I nailed z5 easily:

http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment...4&d=1395093032

Of note, I did the outside workout last week, the trainer one the week before. So they're very recent.

On the trainer, I was barely able to get 4 intervals before my power dropped too much to hold z5. Outside? I got 11, and had more in me (there's a page in Coggan's book about when to stop intervals). I had to quit because I had run out of time for my workout. Those little breaks outside make for a completely different workout.

If you want a highly specific, extremely targeted workout, trainers are a great tool.

I dunno. I happen to know what color my dog's bark is. I know what my FTP is, too, and it's really high, but I get winded when I blow a snot rocket.

I don't disagree that if your goal is to put up very consistent numbers during an interval or test a trainer is superior. I just find them completely unenjoyable to use. I may buy one if I can find a good deal on a used fluid trainer. A lot depends on how good my options are for doing a 20 minute test outdoors.

You still haven't answered the simplest question:
1. Do you have more power files?
2. Have you done a 20 minute test with a power file to show your performance.
3. If not why have you not done one since the beginning of this thread and now. It takes 20 minutes.

As for the implications that we, those of us who have been using power for years with out athletes and ourselves, don't understand Coggan...I can drop him a line to come out here and check this thread and give you his input if you'd like. Him or Hunter Allen. Take your pick. Coggan is a member here and Allen is a friend on facebook. They wrote the book....

I can save you time and tell you the first thing they are going to say is "where are the rest of your files. you can't tell anything from this stuff..."

I'll do the test when I have the time. I doubt it will be a quick enough timeline to satisfy the armchair quarterbacks here. At that point it will probably be counterproductive to bump this thread...

Too many replies to read.

I find talking harder at 75%-80%
But I'm definitely breathing harder than normal even in zone 2. I see people chatting away up climbs at ~4.5w/kg and wonder if they are (A) extremely strong (B) trying to distract from the pain or (C) trying to give the impression that they aren't working. I once had a conversation climbing at ~90% just as a kind of game and to give the impression that it was easy for me haha!

Oh....I've been here since 2006....I'll be here.

Answer question #1 and 2. We're on page 7.

I do have more power files but none with intervals of more than ~15 minutes. I just found out about a local climb that allows you to go 20-25 minutes uninterrupted. I scouted it out Saturday and I think it should work. I managed 250w for 25 minutes going 85-90% RPE so I'm optimistic...

I'd think the test on pp. 309-310 of Training and Racing With a Power Meter (2nd Edition) would be a lot more accurate:

(assumes you have a good idea of what your FTP is already)
15 min warmup in z2
3x1x1 fast pedaling > 100 rpm
3 min easy riding
5 min all out
10 min z2
2x1 @ 125-150% FTP, 5 min rest interval
5 min recover, z1/2
3x20sec max effort, 3 min rest interval
10 min z2
20 min FTP test
15 min cooldown

Yeah, that takes a while but it's also a great workout to go along with being an FTP test. And it's going to produce a more accurate FTP estimate than a bare 20-minute interval.

If you're really pressed for time, Waterrockets posted a 3-min FTP test: Go ALL OUT for three minutes - every pedal stroke as hard as you possibly can. The power you can steadily hold at the end of the three minutes is your FTP.

So you were there, you rode it, but did not get the results you were hoping for so have to go back before you show it to the masses?

I think that's why he won't show us a normal ride data either...

First time up an unfamiliar climb in 90 degree heat so I decided just to scout it out. FTP tests only work if you're actually going hard...Haters gonna hate.

Doesnt matter. How is your accuracy?

Quite good with wattage less than 250.

Seriously, 7 pages of responses to a thread entitled "Talking while riding is hard" and nobody has yet said:



THAT'S WHAT SHE SAID!!!!!



:D:D

Good stuff. One needs to hit dogs and unruly motorists.

is the female Canadian in the front or back?

last month i was only a few seconds off one of my hill times on my 20lb rain bike with rear fender. you have a book of excuses ;)

It depends if it's a home or away game, n'est-ce pas?

Second attempt max avg 20 minute power 268w. I paced myself poorly though and faded for the last 3 minutes. I'm reminded how much I don't like climbing.

i'm a w/kg type person so i'm a fan of the uphill. no powermeter so i just ride and worry about staying with the group

Show your work for full marks.