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Carbon Race Wheelset Suggestions

Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Carbon Race Wheelset Suggestions

Old 12-05-14, 01:15 PM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by Rody211 View Post
I don't really want to race a very expensive wheelset as that's not something I want to have to worry about crashing when really focused on the race.
So a couple hundred is the determining factor between affordable wheels and expensive wheels? So 1000$ for 2quik's basic wheel is not expensive? but 1300$ for a major manufacturer is? Interesting.


Originally Posted by Rody211 View Post
Reynolds are way out of my budget, but I do like their assurance program.

I've actually raced in Europe as an elite without contract rider (you'll know what that means if you've raced there yourself) and in the U.S. as a cat.1. I still do, but more for fun and the sake of staying fit.

My focus is on technical questions around different affordable wheel options along with the builds that go with them. My level as a racer should be irrelevant. What's the difference between Boyd, Williams, and 2Quik team sarcasm? You seem to know something I don't.

So you claim you like onxy hubs, but you also claim reynolds are out of your budget. The basic rim w/a onxy hub (which 2quik conveniently sells) is just under 1500$. Of course you never said you would buy these hubs, but bringing them up out of the blue means you are interested in them and are almost willing to pay the 1500$ for them, assuming you are looking at the basic rim....which throws your claim that reynolds are too expensive out the window....

You say you race for the fun of it and to stay fit but you also say you have made it to cat 1. You must truly have a gift and I am EXTREMELY jealous . However, being so into racing you should know that wheels are expensive. For someone racing just for the fun of it, and to stay fit, why risk the "big W" on a wheel set that is potentially sub-par?

will open mold rims get the job done? yes. Will they be as good as reynolds/boyd/williams? no. Why? Because the last 3 have R&D and meticulously design their wheels where as the first contracts with a factory that pumps out the same rim for multiple companies.

Now, I am not saying anything is "wrong" with open mold, as I said, they will get the job done. But for the price you are about to pay, you might as well go with a known manufacturer, and you can find sweet deals with the holiday sales happening.

Shimano Dura-Ace 9000 C24 Carbon Road Wheelset - Clincher | Competitive Cyclist

Shimano Dura Ace 9000 C24 Wheels - Pair | Merlin Cycles

Same wheels w/different msrps ^ ?

Shimano Dura Ace 9000 C35 CL Wheels - Pair | Merlin Cycles

Mavic Ksyrium SLE Wheelset | Merlin Cycles

Zipp 60 Carbon/Alloy Clincher Wheels - Pair inc GP4000S Tyres | Merlin Cycles

Mavic Ksyrium SLS WTS Wheels Pair | Merlin Cycles

And if you are really on a budget \/

http://www.nashbar.com/bikes/Product...2_566773_-1___

Swap out the hub and spokes for some of your choice and call it a day ^




These seem right up your ally if you are on (what looks like a) 1000$ budget...

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Old 12-05-14, 01:15 PM
  #27  
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With a little digging, I found a cool blog post from November discussing aero testing and the use of open molds (which they apparently use): November Bicycles: Race smart. - November Bicycles Blog - Wind Tunnel Testing: Marketing Expense or*R&D?

Kind of kills the theory that just because something is an open mold, it is of no significant value. Again, I can see being weary of using just any open mold, but using a company that has a whole business based on selling their open mold rims, does give you some peace of mind since you have someone to go back to with any problems. Sorry if I ended up taking this down a rabbit hole, but I think it's kind of interesting when you really start diving into the wheel market and what the different options consist of at the various price points.
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Old 12-05-14, 01:19 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by Rody211 View Post
Sorry if I ended up taking this down a rabbit hole, but I think it's kind of interesting when you really start diving into the wheel market and what the different options consist of at the various price points.
You raced cat1 and your just starting to dive into the wheel market? That little tid bit aside, the bold and underlines is the story of MANY threads on here

But that is what discussions are all about, talking about one things which leads to relevant other things....and drilling holes in each others stories
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Old 12-05-14, 01:28 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by Rody211 View Post
With a little digging, I found a cool blog post from November discussing aero testing and the use of open molds (which they apparently use): November Bicycles: Race smart. - November Bicycles Blog - Wind Tunnel Testing: Marketing Expense or*R&D?

Kind of kills the theory that just because something is an open mold, it is of no significant value. Again, I can see being weary of using just any open mold, but using a company that has a whole business based on selling their open mold rims, does give you some peace of mind since you have someone to go back to with any problems. Sorry if I ended up taking this down a rabbit hole, but I think it's kind of interesting when you really start diving into the wheel market and what the different options consist of at the various price points.
November has it's own carbon rim design. The rail in 52 and in 34 is it's own design. BTW, they are really great wheels and if I was in the market I would be purchasing the Rail 34s with a Powertap hub.

I personally wouldn't buy wheels like 2quick (stupid name, btw).
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Old 12-05-14, 01:31 PM
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I thought November had a few open mold wheels? and they they had their house molds as well? I could be wrong. It has been some time since I looked into them (like 8 months )
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Old 12-05-14, 01:34 PM
  #31  
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They have the Rail in 34 and 52 and then a bunch of aluminium rims. Kinlin XC-279
Pacenti SL23
Stans ZTR Alpha 340
Stans ZTR Alpha 400
Stans ZTR Alpha 400 disc
Stans Arch EX
Stans Crest
Stans DTR Iron Cross
HED Belgium
HED Belgium tubular
HED


I was recently seriously thinking of getting a powertap Rail 34 set (until I bought a mountain bike) which is why I have been all over their site and I didn't see any open mold designs for sale.
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Old 12-05-14, 01:41 PM
  #32  
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Team Sarcasm: Reynolds advertises their Carbon Clinchers wheels around $2000, simple logic dictates that $1500 is cheaper than $2000...

So November isn't using an open mold even they state they do in their blog?

Don't get too hung up on my story... Regional Cat.1 races are significantly easier in the U.S. than post tour crits, UCI races, I actually get to spend time coasting and soft pedaling in regional races. It's all a matter of perspective and what you're body has adapted to. Sure, I've been around and have ridden many nice wheels. Frnakly, I don't get the wow factor out of Zipps, Enve's, etc... Yea, they're cool, but I never had to buy a set... Now, I'm racing for fun and I buy the majority of my own gear. Being financially cognoscente, I'm not interested in spending a ton on wheels as I know wheels get demolished from time to time and get used hard.

Since you seem to be in the know Team Sarcasm, can you tell me how you generalize your assumptions on all these companies? As far as I know, Novemebr says they use open molds (which I don't think is a bad thing), yet you say they do not (as if you know more than the individuals within November?). You also say 2Quik is a poor Chinese knock off open mold (how do you know this?), and I'm still waiting to hear some more thoughts on Williams? Can you please provide data to back your generalizations?
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Old 12-05-14, 01:46 PM
  #33  
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That November blog post you linked to is from 2012. They may have been using open mold rims at that time but they aren't now. Read their blog since then. They developed the Rail wheel that is their own design. They don't sell open mold carbon anymore.
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Old 12-05-14, 01:51 PM
  #34  
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Thanks RJM, I started seeing that as I started reading newer posts. Still puts an interesting spin on the use of open molds, obviously they eventually decided proprietary molds were the way to go though.
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Old 12-05-14, 02:15 PM
  #35  
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I'm not going to touch the open mold argument, other than to say if you go with it, go with a company that stands behind their product and QC's. November started out that way and I never had any problems with their wheels. In fact I got a much higher dollar amount when I sold them than I ever would have expected, mostly due to their reputation. I replaced them with the Rail 52's which have also been incredible and if you care about aero data simply go to their website and take a gander. They hold their own against the tops in the business at half the cost. Good crash replacement as well.

I know Boyd has their own proprietary hubs which have gotten great reviews, not sure if their carbon rims are open mold or not, but once again Coach Boyd is an active member on the forum, exemplary service, and quality build. I've never heard of a problem with their rims failing.

I had never heard of the 2quick's until now. But open mold or not, if they are involved and stand behind their stuff then that's how some of the above companies also got their starts. One area that always bothers me though is when a company says things like "we use aerospace technology" and usual marketing spin. 2quik does put some information about their carbon rims in there but it's mostly pablum, I want to know about the design choices. But that's just me.

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Old 12-05-14, 02:31 PM
  #36  
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I know the reason we went to our own designs and molds for both the rims and hubs was to be in better control and keep the quality consistent (not just higher, but consistent between all orders). We have contracts in place and BOM for our hubs. They HAVE to be made in a certain way to our spec.

With the open mold you can still get good stuff, but you don't have the say in the product and the next batch could be much lower in quality. This is a risk for a consumer as they don't really know what they are getting. Having service behind the product is a big plus, but if it just gets repaired with the same defective product that isn't helping anybody.
The other problem is that when everybody can sell the same rims or hubs, the only way to compete is on price. There is a new wheel company popping up every day now selling the dengfu or hongfu 40, 56, and 86mm super wide rims. If you are selling your set with them for 1400 and now company x starts selling them for 900, you have to lower your price to keep yourself competitive. Hongfu starts lowering their price and quality and now everybody is in a race to come out with the cheapest and lowest quality options. We're not interested in entering the race to the bottom. I believe people want higher quality options and ones that will last longer which is why we have placed ourselves in the market for that.

Sorry for any spelling errors, typed on a tiny screen.
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Old 12-05-14, 02:45 PM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by Rody211 View Post
Team Sarcasm: Reynolds advertises their Carbon Clinchers wheels around $2000, simple logic dictates that $1500 is cheaper than $2000...

So November isn't using an open mold even they state they do in their blog?

Don't get too hung up on my story... Regional Cat.1 races are significantly easier in the U.S. than post tour crits, UCI races, I actually get to spend time coasting and soft pedaling in regional races. It's all a matter of perspective and what you're body has adapted to. Sure, I've been around and have ridden many nice wheels. Frnakly, I don't get the wow factor out of Zipps, Enve's, etc... Yea, they're cool, but I never had to buy a set... Now, I'm racing for fun and I buy the majority of my own gear. Being financially cognoscente, I'm not interested in spending a ton on wheels as I know wheels get demolished from time to time and get used hard.

Since you seem to be in the know Team Sarcasm, can you tell me how you generalize your assumptions on all these companies? As far as I know, Novemebr says they use open molds (which I don't think is a bad thing), yet you say they do not (as if you know more than the individuals within November?). You also say 2Quik is a poor Chinese knock off open mold (how do you know this?), and I'm still waiting to hear some more thoughts on Williams? Can you please provide data to back your generalizations?
Reynolds Attack Carbon Clincher Wheelset 2015

As I said, I thought November had open mold sets in addition to their house molds. Yeah, I am not a fan of the "wow" factor either, but buying from a company such as enve add the bonus of actual R&D, and have improvements that come from in house.

Unless you are going to tell me 2quik develops/ed their own carbon layup, they are just another company who assembles wheels from parts they buy. Now the parts may be better quality than I give them credit for, but for the price of their stuff, might as well spend a little bit more and go with a known company that actually builds wheels. And as I said it is holiday sale time, which means you can find deals on wheels easy.

As far as Williams goes, they are one of the companies that have their own R&D departments and are constantly testing new things to better improve their product. And by testing they are not simply switching factories or product lines. So my thoughts on Williams? Thumbs up.

As far as data goes, I doubt there is any hard data, just personal testimonials. And 2quiks rims are most likely better quality than the ebay Chinese junk that is sold But non the less, this thread comes across as a spam/advertisement thread by a 2quik employee with a story and budget that contradict them selves in addition to a poster that is getting more defensive as the conversation about 2quik goes on.

Last edited by Team Sarcasm; 12-08-14 at 12:19 AM.
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Old 12-05-14, 02:52 PM
  #38  
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I have to admit, this guy is putting a lot of effort into his shilling.
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Old 12-05-14, 04:06 PM
  #39  
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Coach Boyd: Thanks for the insightful post! That pretty much clears the air on the topic of open molds vs. proprietary molds. With that in mind, it makes getting some wheels with their own proprietary mold more appealing. If I can jump into a wheelset with a proprietary mold at the same price point as a set of 2Quiks, I would now rather go down that path. In fact, I'm pretty much up in the air on either Boyd's or November now, I really appreciate your post and that definitely makes me lean towards Boyd.

Team Sarcasm: perhaps you should change your name to "Team Paranoia"... I only ever asked you for evidence backing up your generalizations for not just 2Quik, but every brand I inquired about. It took you quite a few posts to finally get it all down into a single post due to your determination to prove me being spam. You don't know my story outside of what I've given you, and if you think because I am an elite level rider that I am willing to drop $3G's on a wheelset, you're showing how naive you are. Top level racers rarely ever pay for equipment, so they have a hard time justifying paying retail on anything. That's the difference between career age groupers and category racers and the guys who have been at a decent level. We let our fitness do the talking, not our equipment. I do not work for 2Quik, and hence Boyd being present and constructive on this forum, I am more likely to buy from them. Now
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Old 12-05-14, 05:06 PM
  #40  
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If you should damage a wheel it's not like you have to buy a new wheel, maybe a new rim and a few spokes. I have had Boyd 58/50 with a PT for a little over 3 yrs now daily riding zero probs. They are stiff as **** and I love them.
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Old 12-05-14, 06:01 PM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by Rody211 View Post
Team Sarcasm: Reynolds advertises their Carbon Clinchers wheels around $2000, simple logic dictates that $1500 is cheaper than $2000...
you're right, IMO the criticism was unwarranted. most slippery slopes have a few footholds.
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Old 12-05-14, 06:04 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by Rody211 View Post
I actually raced what were supposed to be open mold rims in Europe and didn't have any issues or complaints with them. We had a local small shop sponsor that bought their rims from a manufacturer and built up the wheels on their end. Are there any known issues in riding a wheel that uses an open mold? Really, the designs look pretty similar between those 3 companies, so I'm wondering how to differentiate which ones are open molds and not and why wouldn't you want to use an open mold if one of them is?
Because you can buy Chinese open mold rims directly from Trading Compnies in China for much, much less.

Looking at a photo or a drawing of a rim tells you exactly nothing about material, construction or quality control.

Do some searches. This conversation has been had many, many times on this forum and elsewhere.
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Old 12-05-14, 06:54 PM
  #43  
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Chinese U-Shaped (copy of Zipp firecrest) 38mm carbon tubulars with 25mm width. Best value easily.
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Old 12-05-14, 11:49 PM
  #44  
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Check this out. Reynolds attack for under $1k

History of deals for Steep and Cheap, Whiskey Militia, Chainlove and second chance discounts

do a search for wheelsets.
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Old 12-06-14, 12:11 AM
  #45  
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I am going to have to explore this site!
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Old 12-06-14, 12:15 AM
  #46  
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Yea, and I'm the spammer ^??? Give me a break...
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Old 12-06-14, 12:36 AM
  #47  
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Going for something that can be replaced easily, so cheaper is better. I'm going to be critiqued for saying this, but Chinese wheel set is the way to go.
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Old 12-06-14, 12:51 AM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by Rody211 View Post
Coach Boyd: Thanks for the insightful post! That pretty much clears the air on the topic of open molds vs. proprietary molds. With that in mind, it makes getting some wheels with their own proprietary mold more appealing. If I can jump into a wheelset with a proprietary mold at the same price point as a set of 2Quiks, I would now rather go down that path. In fact, I'm pretty much up in the air on either Boyd's or November now, I really appreciate your post and that definitely makes me lean towards Boyd.

Team Sarcasm: perhaps you should change your name to "Team Paranoia"... I only ever asked you for evidence backing up your generalizations for not just 2Quik, but every brand I inquired about. It took you quite a few posts to finally get it all down into a single post due to your determination to prove me being spam. You don't know my story outside of what I've given you, and if you think because I am an elite level rider that I am willing to drop $3G's on a wheelset, you're showing how naive you are. Top level racers rarely ever pay for equipment, so they have a hard time justifying paying retail on anything. That's the difference between career age groupers and category racers and the guys who have been at a decent level. We let our fitness do the talking, not our equipment. I do not work for 2Quik, and hence Boyd being present and constructive on this forum, I am more likely to buy from them. Now


Wow what a great crowd tonight folks. We don't often search for chat in forums, but apparently there are some things that need to be said to clear the air. So for starters, thanks for the interest in our wheels Rody211, always feel free to reach out to us on our contact page if you have any questions about our molds or process.

Just to clear any air in this thread, we do currently use what is known as an open mold for our rims. However, we hired on professionals in the aerospace industry that specialize in composites to help create the mold we are currently using in conjunction with our manufacturer. As Boyd mentioned, one of the big problems with using just any open mold is quality control. As a start up, we found it more cost effective to work with our manufacturer to create what would be an open mold that allows for a consistent quality rim than to create a series of our own custom molds.

We would eventually like to go down the path of proprietary molds, however we've made it our mission to put the customer first. So, when we can afford to do that without negatively effecting the customers price point, we will. Right now, we have no reason to believe our rims wouldn't hold up to day to day riding as they have done so in all of our product testing. We are currently working on collecting some aero data, just to see how aero our wheels are in comparison to some of the other options out there. We're confident that our wheels are a great bang for your buck and also come with thousands of build variations available to you.
We have some great wheel builders, who have been building wheels for a combined 50+ years and love what they do. We do utilize them for all our builds, leaving all builds to be done here in the U.S. All of what we have put into the business gives us the confidence to provide the level of support that we do. We're here for our customers, and that will always be our driving force. We hope this helps answer some of the questions that have been posed on this thread, and certainly welcome further questions via info@2quikcarbon.com.
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Old 12-06-14, 12:51 AM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by Rody211 View Post
Yea, and I'm the spammer ^??? Give me a break...
Originally Posted by Rody211 View Post
Yea, and I'm the spammer ^??? Give me a break...
The difference is your OP sounds like a sales/advertising pitch for wheels that have a crash replacement. And this being your first, or one of your first, posts does not help that the spam-ish nature of the OP. If you would have said "I am thinking about 2quik wheels, anyone heard of or tried them?" that may have been a little better. But your post count still makes it seem like someone at the company made the account to put their 2quik's name on the board.

However:

1. The 1000$ range +/- a few hundred has A LOT of options. Buy a wheel set because you like them, not because of a crash replacement. (but in reality wheels and wheels). I think your mind was made before this thread (which is usually what happens with these kinds of threads ). If all other wheels come across as being equal (relative to weight to the weight/$/etc) and the crash replacement sets these wheels apart then go for it. I hope they live up to everything you hope they will amount to.

2. A new guy that doesnt loose their **** when drilled with a flurry of stupid remarks/questions? You are doing the internet correctly

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Old 12-06-14, 02:13 AM
  #50  
Rumpled
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OP, so you are a Cat 1?
Why don't you just use whatever your teams' wheel sponsor is?
If not, maybe a better team?
I have a few friends that are very good Cat 1's, they use the wheels they are given.
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