Making the 3Rensho I can't afford
12-22-19, 11:32 PM
#26
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Thanks for the pic, and I hope it didn't come across that I didn't believe it was stamped as claimed; I genuinely wanted to see how it was executed. Just makes it all the more cool IMHO 
DD
DD
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12-23-19, 12:24 AM
#27
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Nice job, paint looks great. I certainly would've been fooled without a closer look. Good idea on the "replica" stamping as well.
As far as an actual 3rensho frame goes, you're mistaken if you think the cheapest you can get one is for $1400. On ebay, yeah, prices will be high, but you should look at the Japanese Yahoo Auctions page. For example I see a few 3rensho Super Record Export frames in really great condition for $375-700 on Yahoo Auctions now. There are sites like Jauce where you can purchase Yahoo Auctions bikes and they will automatically ship it internationally to you for about $200. So you're looking at about $600-900 for a frame. Not super cheap, but a lot better than $1400. Keep in mind that sites like Jauce will generally only ship frames, not complete bikes. I've used Jauce a couple times and they are very reliable and pack well.
https://www.jauce.com/auction/k429685458
https://www.jauce.com/auction/n390054251
https://www.jauce.com/auction/l548910914
OK, I'm done enabling
As far as an actual 3rensho frame goes, you're mistaken if you think the cheapest you can get one is for $1400. On ebay, yeah, prices will be high, but you should look at the Japanese Yahoo Auctions page. For example I see a few 3rensho Super Record Export frames in really great condition for $375-700 on Yahoo Auctions now. There are sites like Jauce where you can purchase Yahoo Auctions bikes and they will automatically ship it internationally to you for about $200. So you're looking at about $600-900 for a frame. Not super cheap, but a lot better than $1400. Keep in mind that sites like Jauce will generally only ship frames, not complete bikes. I've used Jauce a couple times and they are very reliable and pack well.
https://www.jauce.com/auction/k429685458
https://www.jauce.com/auction/n390054251
https://www.jauce.com/auction/l548910914
OK, I'm done enabling
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12-23-19, 12:59 AM
#28
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I often wonder what will happen when someone decades from now comes across a frame that's been Gugie-fied or received the René Hubris treatment. I know my Holdsworth/Claud is one of those modified frames from a bygone era, and it's rewarded me with hours of head-scratching amusement 
I think it's all a lot of good fun.
I think it's all a lot of good fun.
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Owner & co-founder, Cycles René Hubris. Unfortunately attaching questionable braze-ons to perfectly good frames since about 2015. With style.
Owner & co-founder, Cycles René Hubris. Unfortunately attaching questionable braze-ons to perfectly good frames since about 2015. With style.
12-23-19, 03:19 AM
#29
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Looks like the resident Spanish Inquisitors can put the pitchforks away now, seeing as the frame is carrying a permanent disclaimer.
I do find it fairly amusing that most upper mid-range Japanese/Taiwanese frames from the 1980's are built so nicely and consistently that they can pull off the look of a handbuilt grail bike from 10 feet away.
You can't do that with a 1970's Raleigh
-Kurt
I do find it fairly amusing that most upper mid-range Japanese/Taiwanese frames from the 1980's are built so nicely and consistently that they can pull off the look of a handbuilt grail bike from 10 feet away.
You can't do that with a 1970's Raleigh
-Kurt
12-23-19, 03:56 AM
#30
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Looks like the resident Spanish Inquisitors can put the pitchforks away now, seeing as the frame is carrying a permanent disclaimer.
I do find it fairly amusing that most upper mid-range Japanese/Taiwanese frames from the 1980's are built so nicely and consistently that they can pull off the look of a handbuilt grail bike from 10 feet away.
You can't do that with a 1970's Raleigh
-Kurt
I do find it fairly amusing that most upper mid-range Japanese/Taiwanese frames from the 1980's are built so nicely and consistently that they can pull off the look of a handbuilt grail bike from 10 feet away.
You can't do that with a 1970's Raleigh
-Kurt
As far as I'm concerned it already had the disclaimer, original S/N tells the tale plain and simple, and as CV-6 points out, anyone looking for a 3R should know exactly what they are looking at, there should be no confusion whatsoever.
The added stamping certainly adds another level to the equation.
Refering to Raleigh, aside from production "inconsistencies" they speak for themselves, very distinct and identifiable, even model to model were very different for the most part.
12-23-19, 08:51 AM
#31
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I know there will be haters, there always is no mater what the project. Look at how many fake muscle cars are out there, 6 cyl Mustangs turned into big block Shelby's, Base model Dodge Challengers turned into Hemi cars and sold for 100's of thousands of dollars. Some people try to profit from it while others are just having fun building something they otherwise would not be able to have.
It's relatively easy to oust a Ford fake, plus you have the Marti Report system to help verify inaccuracies - and honest clones don't have illegal VIN swaps. It's easier and more likely to get burned on a cheap respray that looks good, but has a rotted out cowl under the dash.
It is the Mopars that are absolutely ripe for hucksters executing body swaps, especially since a faked build sheet can't be verified with anyone other than Galen Govier - who doesn't advertise pricing. I can't speak for GMs.
That may not stop them although it doesn't seem to be ramping up as it has before, we shall see.
As far as I'm concerned it already had the disclaimer, original S/N tells the tale plain and simple, and as CV-6 points out, anyone looking for a 3R should know exactly what they are looking at, there should be no confusion whatsoever.
The added stamping certainly adds another level to the equation.
Refering to Raleigh, aside from production "inconsistencies" they speak for themselves, very distinct and identifiable, even model to model were very different for the most part.
As far as I'm concerned it already had the disclaimer, original S/N tells the tale plain and simple, and as CV-6 points out, anyone looking for a 3R should know exactly what they are looking at, there should be no confusion whatsoever.
The added stamping certainly adds another level to the equation.
Refering to Raleigh, aside from production "inconsistencies" they speak for themselves, very distinct and identifiable, even model to model were very different for the most part.
-Kurt
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12-23-19, 09:43 AM
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It does look great. Heck it is YOUR bike and do what you will. That disclaimer is a big warning to any future owner anyways.
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12-23-19, 09:53 AM
#34
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Thanks for the favorable comments. Hopefully I can get it together and rideable in January. I have all the parts I'm using but need to clean them and respoke the wheels since the spokes are dull and the nipples corroded.
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12-23-19, 12:22 PM
#35
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I went the other direction with a replica build. I moved to Chico for school in 1976 with the full Campy Raleigh Professional Mk II I had just ridden on Bikecentennial. I had repainted it orange after a criterium crash and related repairs a few years earlier. For Chico, I put on Schwinn Continental decals. I recall stopping at a bike shop there to pick up a small bit. A mechanic took a long, quizzical look at my bike and said, "Where did you find a Schwinn Continental with lugs?" I responded, of course, that I had created fake lugs by grinding away the tubing with a Dremel tool. The guy bought my explanation. At least one other shop employee had caught on to what I was doing and was quietly cracking up. That poor gullible mechanic probably caught ****e for weeks for being so magnificently pranked.
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12-23-19, 01:11 PM
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Make it so, looks great.You could clean spokes/nipples with careful cleaning using Brasso, Never Dull or Turtle Wax chrome polish/rust remover, steel/brass wool and fine brass bristle brush.
Often IME, most/all comes off pretty easy with patience.
12-23-19, 01:41 PM
#37
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I usually would but some spokes are a different "shade" than others, possibly replaced. The nipples are turning green and slightly fuzzy. I would rather get new ones and relace the wheels. The hubs and rims are good just dirty.
12-23-19, 01:53 PM
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Hmm, no one seemed to object when I turned this 1970s Raleigh Sports:
Into this 1930s Raleigh Sports for a VeloCheapo contest:
Into this 1930s Raleigh Sports for a VeloCheapo contest:
12-23-19, 02:03 PM
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12-23-19, 02:15 PM
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12-23-19, 02:28 PM
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Okay, then, how about this Campania
Campania_v1_4.jpg
that I turned into a Photiou?
Campania_v2_3.jpg
Campania_v2_4.jpg
Or this Raleigh Capri
VeloCheapo2010_1.jpg
That I turned into a Roberta?
VeloCheapo2010_Entry004_4.jpg
VeloCheapo2010_Entry004_7.jpg
Campania_v1_4.jpg that I turned into a Photiou?
Campania_v2_3.jpg Campania_v2_4.jpg Or this Raleigh Capri
VeloCheapo2010_1.jpgThat I turned into a Roberta?
VeloCheapo2010_Entry004_4.jpg VeloCheapo2010_Entry004_7.jpg
12-23-19, 02:38 PM
#43
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^^
Those are way neato builds. That said, long after we're all gone- no one will be able to come after you for making the bastids... YOU FRAUDsters. Lol
Those are way neato builds. That said, long after we're all gone- no one will be able to come after you for making the bastids... YOU FRAUDsters. Lol
12-23-19, 02:38 PM
#44
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Specialized put their name on Rensho frames to make the original Allez. Bianchi sold bikes made by someone in Japan. Giant built frames for many other companies. Many bicycle companies have some or all their frames made by other companies and put their name on them. Essentially what I did only on a very large scale. Even Chevrolet puts their name on foreign cars to market here in the USA.
12-23-19, 02:43 PM
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Specialized put their name on Rensho frames to make the original Allez. Bianchi sold bikes made by someone in Japan. Giant built frames for many other companies. Many bicycle companies have some or all their frames made by other companies and put their name on them. Essentially what I did only on a very large scale. Even Chevrolet puts their name on foreign cars to market here in the USA.
I'm not knocking your work, just not seeing your justification. And of course I know of cross polination of bike makers, just like millions of other products.
Cheers
12-23-19, 02:53 PM
#46
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We may have both misunderstood each other. I am not trying to act like anything, but when you stated "Neat build but no comparison to the OP's brand change" I took it as you are saying I am doing something I shouldn't by changing brand names on a frame. I was pointing out that it is not unusual in big bike business. I am no bike company and am not selling it to make a profit. My justification is simply having some fun with an old frame that would have ended up in the trash pile.
12-23-19, 02:59 PM
#47
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We may have both misunderstood each other. I am not trying to act like anything, but when you stated "Neat build but no comparison to the OP's brand change" I took it as you are saying I am doing something I shouldn't by changing brand names on a frame. I was pointing out that it is not unusual in big bike business. I am no bike company and am not selling it to make a profit. My justification is simply having some fun with an old frame that would have ended up in the trash pile.
looks to me as if you took an old crappy frame that had practically no value and made it something that made you happy and had fun doing it. Period. End of story.
Merry Christmas Happy Holidays and a happy New Year!
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12-23-19, 03:00 PM
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We may have both misunderstood each other. I am not trying to act like anything, but when you stated "Neat build but no comparison to the OP's brand change" I took it as you are saying I am doing something I shouldn't by changing brand names on a frame. I was pointing out that it is not unusual in big bike business. I am no bike company and am not selling it to make a profit. My justification is simply having some fun with an old frame that would have ended up in the trash pile.
-Kurt
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Last edited by cudak888; 12-23-19 at 03:20 PM.
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12-23-19, 03:01 PM
#49
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You shouldn't have to explain or justify anything with this bike. Though you know showing it off in the forums is going to bring out the ney sayers.
looks to me as if you took an old crappy frame that had practically no value and made it something that made you happy and had fun doing it. Period. End of story.
Merry Christmas Happy Holidays and a happy New Year!
looks to me as if you took an old crappy frame that had practically no value and made it something that made you happy and had fun doing it. Period. End of story.
Merry Christmas Happy Holidays and a happy New Year!
Yes exactly, thank you.
12-23-19, 03:05 PM
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Apparently, my Bottecchia has his badge on it, and nobody knows if it's a sub-brand or if someone played badge swapping. <sarcasm>What a fraudster!</sarcasm>
Pic via MauriceMoss :
...and my frame:
-Kurt
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