Biker Pete 

I have ‘tubeless ready’ carbon wheels and I’ve waffled back and forth on the tube vs tubeless question. For my riding style (a daily 10 mile loop on flat and known roads) I made the decision for tubes. While it’s wise to ‘never say never’, flats are just not a concern for me on these roads. I use TPU tubes so weight-wise, it’s a coin toss. And after spending a good amount of time reading the analyses on bicyclerollingresistance.com I’ve come to the conclusion that the marginal gain in lower rolling resistance for tubeless is just not worth it for me. My bicycle frame will accept a maximum width of 28mm tires, and according to the SRAM and Silca tire pressure calculators, I anticipate no significant gain in ‘comfort’ with tubeless when the tires are inflated to their ‘optimal’ pressure. So for me, it’s tubes. At least for now.

choddo

For just 10 miles (maybe max 5 mile walk home), I agree it's not worth the effort and higher tyre cost.

Eric F 

A 5 mile walk in road bike shoes is not something I want to have to do. I would be calling the wife, or Uber.

Troul 

i'd say location would determine if tubeless is optimum over distance.

1 mile in a high crime area on a public thru-way vs 10 miles safe ride to/from a local town park.

choddo

Yeah we don’t have high crime areas around here so that thought didn’t enter my consideration. Good point.

choddo

We don’t have Uber either

Some of us have wives

5 mile max though. Chances are it would be far less. I’ve done a couple of miles before. It ain’t much fun.

3speedcliff

Some will vehemently disagree but I believe the "ability to run lower pressures with tubeless" claim is marketing B.S. First off, the pressures I see recommended are not in what I consider to be pinch flat territory, unless you ride on pot hole riddled roads and make no effort to avoid them or lessen the impact. Secondly, the idea that you can find the magic pressure that results in the occasional bottoming out that would be hard enough to cause a pinch flat but soft enough to not damage the rim is quite a stretch for me. The only exception I can see is the hookless rims that don't have the thinned out hook part of the rim sidewall, but even that's a stretch.

choddo

Agreed. The dramatic reduction in ride stopping/pausing punctures is the biggest draw. We do also have a lot of potholes around here. Rural roads, nice to ride but terrible surfaces so less than 90psi is risky with tubes.

Biker Pete 

My 124 gram solution.

choddo

Yes I have also

Just glad I don’t have to use them any more I don’t object to people using tubes even in the same group and like I said earlier in this thread, some great conversations to be had over a flat tyre.

PeteHski

That's only a valid claim for mountain bike tyres. For road tyres I'm not sure anyone is touting significantly lower pressures for tubeless. In this case, lower pressures are being driven primarily by increased tyre width/volume.

Parsival

My vote is for tubeless. Lower pressure with tubeless has more benefits. Less tire pressure creates less deflection when you hit rougher pavement, significantly smoother ride, better sealing if a puncture occurs (allows the sealant more opportunity to seal instead of squirting out), and tubeless is known to have lower rolling resistance over standard tubes in general. As far as repairs and maintenance, I'd rather have scheduled tubeless maintenance in my garage over a road side repair but in the event of a repair, I keep a Stans Dart and can of GUP air/sealant on hand. 10 seconds to plug a hole and 20 seconds to inflate the tire and wait a minute to make sure it's sealed up. I run a 700x30 at 65-70 PSI depending on road conditions. I used the Silca tire pressure calculator to find my zone https://silca.cc/pages/sppc-form I'm very happy with the results but admittedly, I'm more of sport rider and not a hammerhead and I value longer rides and comfort over straight up speed.

Parsival

I had a puncture today in my tubeless tire, you can see the sealant kind of working around the nail. I was only 5 miles from home so I left the nail in and added some air. Once I got back to my garage I pulled the nail out and Stan's sealant puked everywhere. The sidewall would not have sealed without a plug or bacon strip, while the center tread was a non issue. I used my Topeak Micro pump to add air, I was surprised how well that little sucker worked.

cweb99

Are tire liners an option for you? I know a lot of roadies frown upon them but I have only had one flat using them for like 10 years. And it was a nail, nothing would have stopped that.

just put some rhino dillos on my new Roubaix as well.

Parsival

I have used Mr. Tuffy a long time ago in my BMX bike, but I'm not aware of any tire liners that work with tubeless setups.

choddo

https://www.tradeinn.com/bikeinn/en/...se/138261494/p

Dave Mayer

I haven't read any of the previous posts, but has it already been pointed out that you can add sealant to a traditional bike tube? As in the good ones with the removable valve cores?

If the so-called benefit of tubeless is flat reduction, you can achieve the same thing in a traditional setup with 20cc of Stan's, without having to carry a gas-powered air compressor on your backpack for reinflating the tubeless tire....

PeteHski

More nonsense.

Parsival

Dave Mayer Tubeless isn't for everyone. If you don't like it don't use it, I don't think anyone here is going to get their feelings hurt over it. I still use tubes in bikes I don't ride very often and in that use case scenario, it's maintenance free until you get a flat. But the photo of the nail I got yesterday would have definitely been unrideable with a tube and sealant, Slime tube, or any other tubed configuration. I was able to make it home without a roadside repair and I was probably down to 25-30 psi when I got home- you can't do that on a tubed tire.

choddo

I suggest not only reading a thread before commenting would be polite but using tubeless tyres for a year before commenting would be even more beneficial.

Dave Mayer

I've had more objects embedded in my tires over the decades than probably everyone here combined. Including nails going straight up through the tire and the rim, and through the tire from the side. Plus innumerable glass shards and staples and I once received a flat from what appeared to be a toenail. I ride long distances almost daily over gravel and get maybe one flat every 3 months.

A small amount of Stan's or Orange Seal injected into a tube will have the same flat prevention as tubeless.

I can see the usefulness of tubeless in MTB applications for the avoidance of pinch flats, but not for road bike use. On the road, you are riding with enough pressure so that unless you are aiming for potholes and curbs, you should not be getting a lot of pinch flats.

choddo

You seem to be arguing from a position of someone who has done one thing, about another thing, with people who have done both of those things. I can tell you categorically I have spent hours less time at the roadside in the 5 years since I switched to tubeless than I did in the previous 5 years.

Dave Mayer

The more efficient solution to small puncture flats is to use tires that have more flat resistance. Such as via. tread thickness and armor layers. Using irresponsibly lightweight tires and then depending on some messy slime to (temporarily) plug up holes is a suboptimal solution. Plus with the more robust normal clincher tires you don't have to deal with the mess, the special (expensive) tires with stiff (less compliant) sidewalls and the difficulty getting the beads to to seal etc.

Hey, I had tubeless on a recent gen Ultegra wheelset. Tires were impossible to install and remove without our shop-grade metal tire levers. Needed an air compressor to get any tires to seat. I tried, but it just wasn't worth the hassle.

Besides, if I need lightweight performance road gear, I'd be on tubulars. Strong, no pinch flats, and with 20cc of sealant injected, pretty much impenetrable to flats. Plus you save at least 100g per wheel, mainly in the rim.

PeteHski

I don't have ANY of those issues with GP5000S TR tyres. Sorry, but you are just arguing complete nonsense as usual. If tubeless tyres were evenly remotely as bad as you state then nobody would be using them, including me.

choddo

OK so now your criticism seems more reasonable. I also had a set of tubeless at the start that were near impossible to fit and it almost put me off for life. They were GP5000TLs. Since then I have used 3 types of high quality tubeless on 3 different wheelsets (IRCs and GP5000TR) and they are pretty easy to fit and I did two tyre swaps including new sealant in less than 10 minutes last week. I've never used a compressor in my life. I don't even use CO2 canisters.