Fitting a 'sub-compact' road chainset to BB90 bottom bracket?
#1
The Crank
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Fitting a 'sub-compact' road chainset to BB90 bottom bracket?
Anyone got an 'easy' option (an cheap!) for fitting a sub-compact chainset (e.g. 48-32) to my Trek Domaine SL6 which I believe has BB90 press-fit bearings for Shimano Ultegra.
I will want to revert back to standard 50-34 again so I don't want to have to change the bearings if at all possible (I realize now that not getting a bike with threaded bearings was a mistake!).
I have looked at the Praxis Works Alba M30 48/32 chainset but it looks like this would require new bearings to be press-fitted: I would have to get this done and it practically rule out swapping between chainsets.
I've also looked at Absolute Black oval rings but they are expensive and a bit 'different'; anybody got any experience of them or got them for sale?
Secondly, is there a noticible difference between 32 and 34 (I am 64 and I can get a 34 on the back).
And finally, what distance would you practically get away with between the deraileur and ring - I think I am a bit limited here.
I will want to revert back to standard 50-34 again so I don't want to have to change the bearings if at all possible (I realize now that not getting a bike with threaded bearings was a mistake!).
I have looked at the Praxis Works Alba M30 48/32 chainset but it looks like this would require new bearings to be press-fitted: I would have to get this done and it practically rule out swapping between chainsets.
I've also looked at Absolute Black oval rings but they are expensive and a bit 'different'; anybody got any experience of them or got them for sale?
Secondly, is there a noticible difference between 32 and 34 (I am 64 and I can get a 34 on the back).
And finally, what distance would you practically get away with between the deraileur and ring - I think I am a bit limited here.
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I'm not sold on those oval rings. The effective gearing, when you're actually applying force to the pedals, is higher than during the dead spots of the pedal stroke. So I don't consider that a true 32T ring, even though it may have 32 teeth on it.
I'd just get a cassette that goes lower.
I'd just get a cassette that goes lower.
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I am not totally confident in this but I think that if an ultegra will fit that a GRX will fit. Could be wrong, best to buy from an lbs that knows what they are doing.
I assume you have a front derailleur mount on the frame. It's not too hard to find the distance spec for smaller chainrings. Once you have about 5mm space between the derailleur and the big chain ring, it starts to be a real problem
I assume you have a front derailleur mount on the frame. It's not too hard to find the distance spec for smaller chainrings. Once you have about 5mm space between the derailleur and the big chain ring, it starts to be a real problem
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I was just thinking of a 48-32 today, but I didn't realize there might be issues like needing to change bearings? Or is this specific to BB90? My bike's a PF30, and like the OP, I would also be interested in a solution that requires minimal tweaking so that I could easily go back to my current 53-39 whenever I like to.
#5
The Crank
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I was just thinking of a 48-32 today, but I didn't realize there might be issues like needing to change bearings? Or is this specific to BB90? My bike's a PF30, and like the OP, I would also be interested in a solution that requires minimal tweaking so that I could easily go back to my current 53-39 whenever I like to.
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If your bottom bracket works with Ultegra it will work with GRX. You may or may not need the GRX front derailleur as the chainline is a little different.
#7
The Crank
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Yes, I've been looking into this further and I'm told that the rings are a little over 2mm further out. I'd like to hear from anybody who has tried it.
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I was looking at the Shimano website and the relevant part is the FC-RX810-2? Looks interesting. I have a Super Randonnee coming up in Febuary that I'll have use for...
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I was looking at the Shimano website and the relevant part is the FC-RX810-2? Looks interesting. I have a Super Randonnee coming up in Febuary that I'll have use for...
my gravel bike has a mountain crank on it with a road derailleur (CX-70). It works, even with a 2.5mm spacer behind the bb bearings. The GRX cranks are about that far outboard. The GRX or a CX-70 front derailleur would shift better on a sub-compact than a regular road derailleur, even ignoring the extra space.
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I put a 46 on all my road bikes. I used to have a 54-44 crank, and the 44 was great to cruise around in. So when I found out it was easy to get 46 tooth big chainrings, I moved to that. My gravel bike has a 42 tooth big chainring, and I am only rarely spun out in a downhill sprint by someone that has a 53. So I figure a 46 is fine. If I'm going to spin out a 46-11, that means I should be in a tuck or slow down.
Of course, there isn't much difference between the 31 tooth chainring with the 48 and the 30 tooth chainring with the 46, and it might be easier to adjust the front derailleur for good shifting.
Of course, there isn't much difference between the 31 tooth chainring with the 48 and the 30 tooth chainring with the 46, and it might be easier to adjust the front derailleur for good shifting.
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I'm seriously considering going sub-compact (like 42/30 or thereabouts) next time I have a crank that can do it natively. Other folks (I miss Homeyba) can make good use of monster gears for randonneuring and commuting, but they're wasted on me.
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46-11 is a really big gear. When the 11 tooth cog was first introduced, it was intended to be used with much smaller front chain rings. For example, many classic bikes came with a 52-14 top gear. 42-11 is a higher gear than that. I'm not sure I'm going to end up using it, but I have a spider that fits mountain chain rings to SRAM road crank arms. The thing I like about a 42/28 crank is that I can use an 11-32 cassette, and I almost never have to stand on steep hills.
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For me, I think 48-32 hits the sweet spot.
My bike was originally fitted with 52-36 with an 11-28 cassette. The 52 is great for the fast Sunday club rides, but I noticed on hilly audax rides (or one with plenty of rolling elevation) I tended to stick to the small ring. But I kept cross-chaining 36-11 as a result so kept shifting between big and small rings. That got annoying.
So I switched to a 53-39 in front and an 11-32 at the back, which roughly retains both high and low ends. I figure for randonneuring I would be able stick onto that 39 better rather than keep alternating between the big and small rings. In practice, it only helps a little.
In retrospect it was a bit of a stupid/rash decision to just jump into 53-39 and 11-32 on a hunch or feeling. I got smarter and now did my proper research - by plugging numbers into https://www.bikecalc.com/speed_at_cadence to see what the actual differences are.
Based on the results, I figure 48-32 is gonna be the sweet spot for me, the 48 being sufficient for top end speed on the fast club rides as well as the easier-paced randonneuring and audax rides. And then as an added bonus I'll have 32-32 for the really nasty hills that our local audax club seems to love throwing at us these days.
My bike was originally fitted with 52-36 with an 11-28 cassette. The 52 is great for the fast Sunday club rides, but I noticed on hilly audax rides (or one with plenty of rolling elevation) I tended to stick to the small ring. But I kept cross-chaining 36-11 as a result so kept shifting between big and small rings. That got annoying.
So I switched to a 53-39 in front and an 11-32 at the back, which roughly retains both high and low ends. I figure for randonneuring I would be able stick onto that 39 better rather than keep alternating between the big and small rings. In practice, it only helps a little.
In retrospect it was a bit of a stupid/rash decision to just jump into 53-39 and 11-32 on a hunch or feeling. I got smarter and now did my proper research - by plugging numbers into https://www.bikecalc.com/speed_at_cadence to see what the actual differences are.
Based on the results, I figure 48-32 is gonna be the sweet spot for me, the 48 being sufficient for top end speed on the fast club rides as well as the easier-paced randonneuring and audax rides. And then as an added bonus I'll have 32-32 for the really nasty hills that our local audax club seems to love throwing at us these days.
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My LBS is recommending a Croder Gearmate, so I'm gonna bring my bike over this weekend to have a look.
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I am trying to figure out how that works on a Shimano. The spider would seem to be in the way.
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The chainring bolts aren't hollow, so I imagine they're using narrower ones than usual to keep then from interfering with the chain.
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the chainrings on that crank are always mounted to the back of the spider? Because otherwise, it would be quite tricky to fit the crank on a real frame
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The stock rings would mount on either side, like normal. Perhaps the fact that the inner ring is 30T or 32T helps keep it from interfering with the chainstay. In my book, it's still a hack, when a smaller BCD would be the right tool for the job.
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The LBS said the only thing I needed was an FD extender, so I guess we'll see how it fits tomorrow
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I used the Absolute Black 46/30 chainrings to ride two hilly double centuries over the summer (Terrible Two and Alta Alpina). The low gearing was great, and I can't say I noticed the eccentricity (there was definitely a different feel for standing climbing in the beginning).
I just bought a GRX 48/31 crankset and will be switching to it in next few days. The Absolute Black chainrings and bolts will be for sale as soon as I can remove them from the spider (and I've got the original cardboard sleeves for them so they won't poke any holes in a shipping envelope).
Of note, the Absolute Black chainrings shift the chainline _IN_ while the GRX shift it _OUT_. I didn't have any problems adjusting the limit screws on my Ultegra Di2 front derailleur to work with the Absolute Black's and I'm guessing it'd work fine with the GRX chainline as well, though I have bought a GRX front derailleur just in case (and a whole new frame to go with it).
I just bought a GRX 48/31 crankset and will be switching to it in next few days. The Absolute Black chainrings and bolts will be for sale as soon as I can remove them from the spider (and I've got the original cardboard sleeves for them so they won't poke any holes in a shipping envelope).
Of note, the Absolute Black chainrings shift the chainline _IN_ while the GRX shift it _OUT_. I didn't have any problems adjusting the limit screws on my Ultegra Di2 front derailleur to work with the Absolute Black's and I'm guessing it'd work fine with the GRX chainline as well, though I have bought a GRX front derailleur just in case (and a whole new frame to go with it).
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Chain wear in lower gears should be better and in higher gears will be somewhat worse. Probably since nobody racks up many miles int he big chainring/small cassette, it will not be a big deal. Or it might make it back to the situation from the old days, when the small cogs in the back always wore out first. Nowadays, I always wear out the 17 tooth cog in the back and the smaller ones are okay
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Well, it turns out that the FD extender wasn't needed. Instead, the crankset moves the chainline inwards that they needed to shim the crank arm in order to eliminate chain rub on the FD.
I did a couple of rounds around the shop, mainly to test the shifting, all seemed well except for chain rub when cross-chained, but I'm gonna take the bike out for a longer ride tomorrow to see how it performs.
The R8000 crank arms look ugly attached to these chainrings though... so maybe if these work out I may consider changing them to something more aesthetically pleasing in the future.
I did a couple of rounds around the shop, mainly to test the shifting, all seemed well except for chain rub when cross-chained, but I'm gonna take the bike out for a longer ride tomorrow to see how it performs.
The R8000 crank arms look ugly attached to these chainrings though... so maybe if these work out I may consider changing them to something more aesthetically pleasing in the future.
Last edited by atwl77; 12-07-19 at 06:32 AM.
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I take it the Shimano spline is a straight spline instead of a tapered spline, so the bb can be shimmed. Doesn't look bad to me.
Something is still hurting my head about these. Could you post a picture from the non-drive side?
They used the same bolt hole circle, I guess the problem with putting a smaller chain ring on these cranks is just the height of the spider between the rings.
Something is still hurting my head about these. Could you post a picture from the non-drive side?
They used the same bolt hole circle, I guess the problem with putting a smaller chain ring on these cranks is just the height of the spider between the rings.