DaveW

Hi guys,

I live in the UK and not only new to cycling I am very new to the technical jargon about gears, forks, wheels, tires, you name it - even some of the manufacturers.

Recently I saw an article in my local newspaper about someone like me who is well over weight, was looking to buy a cycle for just around town with the possibility of moving up to do extra miles for fitness, but who had no knowledge of what to buy? He had joined a forum hoping to get some good inside info, but got bogged down with the debates on what a cycle should and shouldn't have. For instance, he assumed that buying a cycle for about £500 (about $1000) would come with weak components so would have to upgrade, which in his mind was a little shoddy. The further he delved he learned that Cannondale have good frames but poor gears, etc etc etc.

Now as I am in a similar position here I looked into it a bit more. I find these debates helpful but sooooo confusing because I am a beginner. And as a beginner I want something like the guy in the article to come with components that are not going to break down after a few miles and have to upgrade straight away.

So my question is if I upped the anti on price to about £1000 (£2000) which cycle would give me good reliable parts? Would Cannondale have a good all round bike in this price range? What about Kona or Giant?

Basically what I'm asking is, which cycle has everything already in place for $2000 or do I still need to go up in price again? Please remember that I have no clue to which Derailleur gears are best, or which frames? I can live with getting a cycle that has a bad saddle or pedals, but I want something right off the shelf that will change gear nicely and reliable. I would also say that I don't intend to go out in all weathers as I can't see any fun in that so the cycle would be kept pretty much away from rain etc.

Black Shuck

Look at Thorn's lineup , built for carrying touring loads and non-racers over rough and smooth terrain, I'm very pleased with mine. The Raven Sport Tour is well below £2000 and should handle just about anything you can throw at it :-)

I enjoyed doing business with them.

Big Brand name bikes around £2000 are most often built for racing and lightness rather than longevity and are probably not your best bet for a everyday bike. I also have a Kona Hoss Deluxe, Konas "clydesdale" mountainbike wick should sell under £1000 and it's held up to my jumping off curbs and ledges, throwing it over ditches and riding in virgin forest since November.

For £2000 you could probably get a custom built bike with tandem wheels and extra thick gauge tubing that will outlive your grandchildren.

MichaelW

When it comes to strength, any *suitable* bike from a respected manufacturer is more than strong enough for heavier riders for Just riding Along. The top end models (£800+) tend to be lighter weight with less metal in the frame and possibly not as strong as mid-range models.

The components on any bike from a respected brand will be reliable and up to the task. I have used the very cheapest shimano derailleurs (SIS) for all-weather everyday commuting in a rainy seaside town and they lasted several years. The weakest part of a bike are the wheels and these are where heavier riders have to pay special attention. My low end Shimano Altus hubs lasted for years on a well built wheel. The key is well built. Whoever tells you thet entry-level components are weak or bad is just being a bike snob.
Ensure that you select a bike with 36 spokes, not 32. More spokes=stronger wheels but over 36 spokes is a special handbuilt product.
MTB wheels are usually stronger than 700c (for 36 spokes) simply because they are smaller. The Thorn range of bikes use MTB wheels on road and expedition touring bikes because of the strength
Buy the bike from a repected dealer not a box-shifter. Really good bike shops will tune the spoke tension and "prestress" the wheels to ensure that they are as strong and reliable as possible.

I suggest you hunt for a good local bike shop (LBS) with an interest in touring and commuting, not just racing or MTB. Touring specialists are really good in the UK and usually have wheelbuilding expertise.
Find out what brands they do and select a mid-range model that fits your needs. Decide if you want suspension or not. Make sure the wheels are tuned or request a set of handbuilt ones made from midrange MTB bits.

One bike shop who do their own range of bikes is Edinburgh Cycles. They are well regarded for everyday commuting in Scottish weather even though the price seems a steal.

You really dont need to spend a hude amount of cash to get cycling. The usual issue for newbies is underspending, eg the £80 discount bikes that barely last a year of regular use.

tomdaniels

The advice in the thread so far is solid. Find a bike that has no Carbon Fiber in it from a major manufacturer. My opinion. If it's just a Carbon Fiber seat post then I would get the shop to swap it out, but I know big guys who ride on them.

Then worry about wheels: Velocity DeepV Rims with 36 spokes seem to be a strength/price leader for road bike wheels.

Sun Rhynolites with 36 spokes seem to be a strength/price leader for mountain bikes.

Have the rear wheel at least built by a good bike shop. Ride 50-100 miles then bring the bike back and have them retension the wheel. (If they don't suggest this, then I would find another bike shop. It should be part of the new wheel package.)

Air

Welcome! Read my sig too for some good links and information

piper_chuck

You can go in two distinct paths. One choice is to try to buy the bike to end all bikes. The other is to start off modestly and then upgrade parts, or the whole bike, as you progress.

I started riding seriously years ago. My first "good" bike was a Trek 1200. I believe it's an early '90s model. It was a prior year's model, so I got it at a good price. Over the years I have changed out a few parts, but have never actually "upgraded" it. It's still got the original shifting components and they still shift like clockwork. The key is proper maintenance and to not abuse the bike. So, if someone tells you will need to "upgrade" components, tell them that's hogwash.

Last summer I treated myself to a new bike. It's another prior year model from a well known brand. I spent a total of $799 delivered for the bike. It's got mostly Shimano 105 components and they have worked flawlessly. So, if you're just starting out, it's possible to buy something for way less than $2,000 without feeling like you're going to have to "upgrade" all the components in a few years.

Tom Stormcrowe

Look at the Specialized Allez if you want something sporty. I have one and upgraded at purchase to Velocity Deep V wheels 36 spoke, 3 Cross weave on the rear and 2 cross on the front, hand built with 14 Gage black DT Swiss spokes and Tiagra hubs. You can set that ride up for about $1400.00, US +/-.

DaveW

Thanks for the replies so far - I assume the thinking is to get what we call a "Racing" bike. That is one with drop handlebars rather than a hybrid like a Bad Boy?.

It never even entered my thoughts that a heavy person could get away with riding one of these and assumed cycles for heavy people were limited to Hybrids under the Urban banner.

If that is the case then that opens up another field to look at.

Would you say getting a Bad Boy be a bad thing or do I really need a faster cycle for fitness and to lose weight?

Tom Stormcrowe

It just depends on what you want to do....

I ride ultralong distance, myself, Imperial Centuries +++. If you want a bulletproof commuting bike, look at the Specialized Hardrock and put slicks on it instead of knobbed tires, for example, $500.00 or so US will get you a nice HR, or if you want speed, go for a road bike. Try all kinds of bikes. Your upper limit of $200USD opens up a world of possibilities.

By the way, don't sweat a carbon fork, as long as it isn't a carbon steerer tube type, a CF/ Aluminium Steerer tube composite is what I run.. The stress loading of a fork is VERY predictable and CF forks are quite stout. It'll damp out a lot of the vibration. As to a CF frame, they're actually stronger than a steel frame even, with one major exception......impact can destroy the frame. One good hard crash and you may well have (Probably, actually), a totaled bike.

DaveW

Can I verify something then. So a road bike would take my weight (300 lbs) if I changed the wheels?

Tom Stormcrowe

Yeah, unless you get some ultralightweight racing bike made of unobtanium.

Look at the Surly Long Haul Trucker, for example.

Alternatively, any other Steel Framed Road Bike, like the Crosscheck (Also Surly). A good rule of thumb is that if it's designed for touring, it'll do you quite well. A touring bike can be carrying 350 pounds of gear and rider combined quite easily.

An older Raleigh of England Raleigh would work, for example, if you wanted to go low budget and eventually upgrade.

Look at this Butler in London area for example.

https://london.craigslist.co.uk/bik/603636822.html

at £200, it's not a bad deal, assuming that the tuneup and service was actually done. Reynolds 531 steel alloy lugged frame and a touring wheelset make for a strong ride. . It also makes for a very usefull commuter, with racks and lots of eyelets to mount stuff on. Also fenders, for that wet UK climate.

late

Let me explain....

Your obvious choice is a touring bike. These are ruggedly made bikes that have drop bars but are nothing like a race bike. Here's a nice one...
https://www.dawescycles.com/dawes/ultra-galaxy.htm
It has a long wheelbase, relaxed geometry, big tires, and it's rugged.
The Ultra Galaxy is nicely equipped and the price is not too bad.
If you handed me a cheque, that's what I'd buy you. It's got a nice saddle; it'll be extremely reliable and all it needs is lights and panniers.


If you can get Surly where you are, there is the Surly LHT Complete. Mercian makes the King of Mercia, Thorn makes a few touring bikes, and there is always the Trek 520.

Drop bars give you more places to put your hands. I suggest double wrapping them with Cinelli gel tape.

Btw,
the seating position on a touring bike is less bent over than on a racing bike. Being bent over so much can be very hard on your back if you haven't been doing it for a while.

markhr

Hi

You can get most of these in the UK for less than GBP1000. Try Condor Cycles and Wiggle first. Do NOT go near evans.

700c, drop bar, disc brake bikes that could be used for racing, training, commuting, touring, cyclocross, etc.

trek portland - https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes...land/portland/

cannondale cross xr7 - https://www.cannondale.com/bikes/08/c...del-8XR7C.html

Brodie Ronin '08 - https://www.brodiebikes.com/2008/2008_bikes/ronin.php
Brodie romax '07 - https://www.brodiebikes.com/2007/2007_bikes/romax.php
brodie ronin '07 - https://www.brodiebikes.com/2007/2007_bikes/ronin.php

lemond poprad disc - https://www.lemondbikes.com/bikes/cross/poprad_disc.php

rocky mountain sherpa - https://www.bikes.com/bikes/2007/TOURING/sherpa-10.aspx

kona sutra - https://www.konaworld.com/08_sutra_w.htm

orbea diem drop disc - https://www.orbea.com/ingles/interior...ilia=6&gama=13

focus cross disc - https://www.focusbikesuk.com/focuscyc...cross_disc.php

devinci caribou2 - https://www.devinci.com/10479_an.html

raleighusa sojourn - https://www.raleighusa.com/items.asp?deptid=5&itemid=427

rei novara element - https://www.rei.com/product/744808

co-motion mazama - https://www.co-motion.com/mazama.html

rocky mountain Solo CXD - https://bikes.com/2008_preview/2008_preview.html

rotwild rs1cx - https://www.rotwild.de/en/ (street bikes section)

fixie inc. pureblood - https://www.cycles-for-heroes.com/200...pureblood.html

maxx roadmaxx custom (you choose the color and parts at the LBS and the factory puts it together, i.e., not a custom frame) - https://www.maxx.de/frmain_bikes.htm (road - roadmaxx custom)

Salsa la Cruz - https://www.salsacycles.com/laCruzComp08.html

Air

I would strongly caution you against a racing bike. They're built for power and speed, not necessarily comfort. It's like if someone wanted to go kayaking for the first time in a river and jumped into a sea kayak but couldn't stay upright - they'd go away with the feeling that it's very tippy and not quite for them yet that's not the right kind of kayak for what they want to do plus takes more skill to maneuver than others. Racing bikes tend to require a great deal of core strength and flexibility to get the maximum power from each stroke - think Lance Armstrong with his head below his butt.

You'll find touring bikes a good mixture between comfort and speed. The Surley LHT is very versatile so you can start off one way and then change it down the line. If you're not flexible and your core isn't strong enough yet you could ride the LHT all day but may barely want to ride a racing bike. Touring bikes also have plenty of braze-ons for things like pump holders, water bottles, fenders, racks, etc... You may or may not need it all but it's useful to have the option. They also come pretty stripped down so they're easy to upgrade parts if your lbs wants to work with you (upgrade the wheels to Deep Vs or Mavic Aksiums for example).

Also the type of handlebars have nothing to do with the kind of bike. There are people who mountain bike with drop handlebars and roadies with flat bars. I have trekking bars which is also another way to go.

Wogster

It's a common misconception that drop bars mean racing bike, touring bikes look a lot like racing bikes, until you see the two sitting side by side. A touring bike, designed for carrying heavy loads, will have higher bars, and longer chain stays, it will have mounting points for front and rear racks and fenders. There will often be mounting points for 3 water bottles. Touring bikes will often have a much lower low gear, handy when slogging rider and gear up a very steep grade. A major difference though, racing bikes often have frames and brakes designed for 23-25mm wide tires, touring bikes often use cantilever brakes and wider frames that will accommodate a 38-42mm wide tire, and that means it can handle a heavier load with lower air pressure, meaning a more comfortable ride. Last comparison, racing bikes tend to have lower spoke count wheels, 16-20 on the front and 20-24 on the rear, where as, as many as 40 spokes can be found on touring bike wheels, although 36 is most common, and some try to get away with 32, usually on the front wheel.

Racing bikes are designed to get from point A to point B in as short a time as possible, it doesn't matter if it's comfortable or not, your not long in the saddle anyway. Touring bikes are designed for long rides, and long times in the saddle, your not out to set a land speed record, your out to get from point A to point B, even if you start in Plymouth, England and point B is Aberdeen in Scotland.

While long distance loaded touring is not where your starting, you still have a heavier load to carry, and as you find yourself loosing some weight, that means you now have weight room on the bike to carry more stuff, which means you can ride further.

Whatever you decide though, that first push of the pedal is the beginning of the road to recovery, first you ride short distances, then you find yourself pushing the distance envelope, then you find yourself thinking of food as fuel for riding, and then you start studying what foods are better fuel for riding, then you find yourself going through your closet looking for those pants that haven't fit (too small) in a couple of years, you find them and they are too big now, the only things that fit are cycling clothes.. You run into someone you haven't seen in a while, and they tell you how good you look.





been thinking of trying to ride downtown tomorrow, I would much rather ride down then drive down, too much traffic for driving,

DaveW

Well this is fascinating to find out all these things.

Can I ask Mark please why he is so against Evans? I know they have several shops in London and they boast that all their workforce know their stuff inside out.

Thanks everyone for the advice and help.

East Hill

Hi Dave, I have nothing to add, because it looks as if the UK folks have given you some brilliant advice, but I'll say,

Welcome to BikeForums!

East Hill

atomship47

hope i don't cause another debate.

first, a little background about me;

i'm not a competitve rider. i'm more of an "enthusiast" at 3500+ miles per year. i used to lift weights as my activity of choice. for health reasons, i had to give it up. i decided i would try cycling. i committed myself to riding every day (about 10 miles) for a couple of weeks....just to see if i liked it. i took a day or two off and found myself totally craving getting back on my $150 department store bike for a ride. after 6 weeks, parts started failing. i bought a comfort hybrid. after 4 months, parts started failing so i bought a trek 7300 hybrid. not long after that, i discovered that i enjoyed a somewhat efficient bike enough to want to go on longer rides. i also discovered that i prefer road riding over trails, etc. i then bought a $2k cf bike.

my advice to those considering taking up riding who don't do it regularly....start comfortable and cheap. get an affordable bike that fits you. that way, if you decide its not for you, or you decide you prefer cx riding or touring or bike paths or etc. you're not too financially deep into a bike that doesn't fit your wants.

tongue in cheek; borrow or buy an el cheapo bike. commit to riding it every day for 2 weeks. take 2 days off. if you can get through those 2 days without wishing you were riding at least 2 or 3 times, then don't spend any more money. if you just have to get back on a bike, buy a comfortable, reliable, efficient multi-purpose bike (i got my trek 7300 for under $400 us).

anyway, this is what worked for me. in hindsight, i'd have purchased a roadie right off the bat. but here's a downside i've discovered...as my fitness level has increased, i no longer need a super-relaxed fit on my roadie. so i've been slowly changing it to fit my needs. i sort of wish i'd have gone with a more aggressive frame/fit to begin with.

just one's person perspective. take it with a grain of salt. hope it helps.

have fun. ride lots.

v1k1ng1001

I'm going to second Air's recommendation. A Surly Long Haul Trucker would be a great starter bike. Throw on a Brooks saddle and you have a great bike for around a $1050 USD. Take the remaining $1000 and buy some clothes and accessories, pocket the rest for you next bike.

The problem is that Surly might be hard to find in the UK. BikesDirect.com will ship you a bike, but you won't have support from your LBS which is a problem for a first time buyer not familiar with bicycles.

What models have you been shopping?

markhr

Evans have a reputation for poor training, high staff turn over, not greasing bearings, scratching paintwork, mis-selling, poor after sales service and much, much more.

Try them if you must but check some of the other on-line reviews first and, if you do buy something from them, double check everything yourself.

https://forum.ctc.org.uk/viewforum.ph...96f80333e205c1
https://www.anothercyclingforum.com/index.php?board=49.0

https://www.google.com/search?num=100...vans+cycles%22

steve2k

£1000 seems like a lot to spend on a bike if you're new to it all. I like the advice that said borrow one for a couple of weeks and see how you get on.

My word of advice is if you're going to commute then look into the cycle to work scheme. Basically your employer can buy the bike and accessories for you, and then you pay them back over the course of the year. The main benefits are that they don't pay VAT so can pass that saving on to you, also your repayments come out of your pre-tax earnings. This means if you're a higher rate tax payer you can save almost 50% of the price of the bike. You're supposed to use it mostly for commuting to work, but there's no check and you're not required to keep any records, so....

I bought a ridgeback velocity (hybrid) from a local bike store for £350 last year (cost me less than £200 though the scheme), put some trekking bars (£15) on it and have ridden it to work and back almost every day come rain or shine. I weight 240lbs and carry 2 panniers every day, I haven't had any weight related problem with the bike. I'm sure it doesn't have the best components but given that it lives outside in the rain and was ridden every day through the winter I think it's a miracle that it's still working as smoothly as it does.

I now know that a touring bike is what I really need for commuting to work, so as soon as I hit 100kg, I'm going to be looking for one.

DaveW

One thing that puzzles me in all this is the reply from Tom where he says a Specialized Allez might suit me if I changed the wheels. But this cycle is not what we call a Tourer so that answer threw me a little.

Does this mean that traditional road cycles would be ok to get if I had the wheels changed to 36 spokes?

Tom Stormcrowe

The Allez is a compromise between a tourer and a very aggressive racing bike (light, stiff and very fast). The frames are a lot stronger than you think, the weak spot is the wheels on a bike. Does that clarify it a bit?

I actually own multiple bikes. I use a touring bike (Schwinn Passage, columbia frame, lugged steel, fenders, rack)to tour and commute on. I ride endurance rides on the Allez and I have a vintage Raleigh that's basically a spare bike that I'm planning on converting to a fixed gear bike for velodrome use.

Yeah, a traditional road bike will hold you if you spec the wheels for your weight.

My basic advice though is to ride all types of bikes and find the bike that calls your name, so to speak and can remain on friendly terms with the keister, back and hands

bautieri

Whats wrong with a mountain bike? Just about any mountain bike would handle your weight plus abuse and come back for more. Is there a reason why you want a road bike? You can put slicks on a mountain bike, add a rack and panniers and presto, a beautiful commuter with low gearing should you live in a place thats somewhat less than flat.

Check out the Specialized Hardrock

The Giant Yukon

and the Kona Hoss, a specially designed clyde bike...but topping out at 999 euros

Bau

DaveW

Thanks Tom for the clarification, and to answer Bau, you have to remember I am a little green, if not completely green when it comes to anything bicycles.

The only thing I do know (and that is only by reading this forum) is that "dedicated" tourers are used predominantly for long road trips with heavy loads, mountain bikes are used for off road, deep mud, etc, so on and so forth. It never occurred to me that I could change wheels on a road or mountain bike probably because I assumed that the reason for different cycles for different reasons, what they come with is what they need to do what they were made for and that's it.

As I don't intend to go off road, and know nothing about bikes, I assumed I needed a bike for the road that would carry my weight - not an off road with different wheels. Not only that, but good reliable gears. OK anything can break, but if I started with good ones in the first place I narrow the odds down a bit. Can you see the problem newbies face? OK after a time it will probably all fall into place but without these forums to start with newbies like me are lost before we start. I'm sure most on here, and certainly those that have posted on this thread know what is good, what is bad, and can look at a cycle in a shop window and know instantly that the wheels, gears, saddle, etc need changing to make it 100% better. I have no idea and accept that the people making these bikes know what they are doing. I don't question things when I buy a car or intend to make changes to it, I buy it after doing some research on its reliability etc.

I'm not as lost as when I started this thread, far from it. I am however more aware that I will have to find a dam good cycle shop that I can spend time in and rely on the expertise of the people who work there. I do have various options now thanks to everyone who posted, so I wont be going in a shop completely baffled.

Many thanks.