wrk101

+1,000 Many brand new touring bikes come with bar end shifters. Send me all that obsolete stuff you want.


"Integrated shifters are the greatest innovation in drop bar bicycles in many generations. If their ergonomic merits isn't enough to convince you, then ride whatever you like. As you say, there are plenty of choices. This is certainly an innovation that I would not be without unless there was a damn good reason."

They also have driven up the cost of road bikes, leading those on budgets to adopt hybrids or mtbs instead. They also are much less durable than what they replaced.

I pretty much have every style shifter on my keeper fleet other than stem shifter. Indexed DT shifters, friction DT shifters; STI shifters; bar ends: indexed, friction, Shimano and Suntour. The choice depends on the style and age of the bike, with nothing newer than 1992.

clubman 

One such good reason is reliability and service. Loaded touring in remote areas requires the most reliable equipment. I wouldn't be (have been) caught dead with ergo/STI on my touring bike. I'd also need my bar shifters to have a friction option so I wouldn't have to deal with cable stretch/indexing failure at an inconvenient time. I assume all barends have that capability but I'm not sure.

Bikerider007

Fitting on a touring bike. Or keeping a bike looking vintage if someone does not wish to reach for the down tube. All the improved stuff is great but not necessary to ride.

USAZorro

You could mount brifters on your bike without going to a clamp on the tube.

As for bar cons... my second choice to brifters on a go-fast bike. It can take a ride or two to get used to the shifting, but before long, even in friction mode, shifting becomes a bit of a zen experience. Just a small movement of the wrist, and you have shifted. Ergonomically they're as efficient as brifters. I have probably 6 or 7 bikes set up with them, one with downtube shifters (soon two) and 3 with brifters.

I just saw these things called Gevenalle. They may be efficient, but to my eye, they're a stylistic atrocity.

twodownzero

I do not buy this argument. This is one of those things in the cycling world that has been repeated so many times that it's become gospel. It is a bunch of nonsense, but based in just enough truth for people to believe it and repeat it.

If integrated shifters are too unreliable for wherever you intend to tour, then you should probably not be taking any derailleur equipped geared bike there. A bent or broken derailleur hanger would leave you much more stranded than any integrated shifter failure mode; considering the likely failure is only one shifter at a time, it would still leave you with at least three gears, which is at least two more than you would have if your derailleur hanger broke and perhaps three more.

Even if integrated shifters were somehow so unreliable that they could not be trusted in the backcountry (a position often claimed as axiom without any real support in the real world), in my view, it would be far lesser a hassle to take a downtube shifter and cable with you in your seat bag instead of permanently dealing with an inferior shifting system that requires you to move your hands away from the brakes in order to shift. You are perhaps so used to bar end shifters that you don't find them to be an annoyance, but if it were me, and I was so convinced that integrated shifters were unreliable, that would be the path I would take rather than permanently dealing with bar end shifters. In fact, if that is the argument as to why many touring bikes do not have integrated shifters, I am surprised more people don't do this.

Now if I were riding a $700 touring bike, of which there are excellent examples out there, and economy was the argument, then perhaps I would just deal with it and ride on. But considering the thousands of miles I've ridden in my life and not ever had a concern with an integrated shifter that required parts to repair, this is simply not persuasive. Integrated shifters are not unreliable. Especially not when the cables are in good condition, which is a requirement for any bike with gears, derailleur or not.

Also, if these sort of reliability arguments were persuasive to me, I would take them much further. I would definitely not install a non user serviceable dynamo hub on my bike, nor would I install hubs with cartridge bearings of any kind, I would probably carry spares of absolutely every bolt and nut on the bike, a spare bottom bracket and cassette, probably an entire wheel's worth of spokes, the tools to change them, etc. If I was touring in a place so remote that a single integrated shifter would be impossible to get, I would not count on that place having any parts available at all. In fact, if I thought the place that backward, I probably would just not go on the trip at all. But if I did, I'd probably have everything short of another bike frame with me, or just be content with the fact that I might have to whip out the credit card to get home.

If you like bar end shifters, that's fine. But you're using them because you like them, not because the alternative is unreliable. It's just not. And the alternative is also much more convenient to use in a way that pays dividends throughout every ride you're on. It's not like we're talking about a feature that you would only use occasionally. If you ride a geared bike, you shift. Sometimes a lot. And having that option at your fingertips greatly improves the efficiency and enjoyment of the ride. Compromising on a significant ergonomic feature is really doing yourself a disservice if it's based on meritless concerns about reliability that really are not realistic concerns.

cdmurphy

I'll throw in a big +1 for bar end shifters. I won't argue they're better than brifters, but they're my favorite vintage option. I went from friction thumbies on mountain bikes, to friction barcons on a touring bike, to now maybe a 50/50 mix of bar end shifters and downtube shifters. The downtube shifters certainly had a learning curve, but I'm pretty comfortable with them now. I have used brifters occasionally when borrowing my wife's bike. They're nice, but I wouldn't call them revolutionary. They certainly make frequent shifting easier, but most of my bikes are 5 and 6 speed in back, so I don't shift nearly as often as some of my racer buddies on modern bikes. (I probably won't be winning this year's tour, but I can't really blame that on the shifters.)

Among bar end shifters, my favorites are the ubiquitous Suntour ratcheting "Barcons". The first generation Shimano Dura Ace bar ends are a close second though. They use a spring to balance out the derailleur tension, so if you get it set just right, they're very light action. The downside is the tension changes over their range, so you have to balance where in their sweep you set them, otherwise they slip at the top end, or take too much friction to hold. Also, they pull a lot of cable. Shifting across the entire freewheel probably only takes 20-30 degrees of lever motion. Great for a 5 or 6 speed, but probably not what you want when the cogs get tighter than that.

Classtime 

Change your cables first and go for a few rides. rotate the bars so the drops are leveler. I've only used 9 and 10s Shimano bar ends and have them on my go fastest bike.

cs1

Only the small time companies like Campagnolo, Shimano and SRAM are selling barcon shifters.

Ex Pres 

Rode mine today
(an '82 Raleigh w/10s campy bar-ends)

cdmurphy

From a practical perspective, I agree. The odds of a brifter failing on any particular trip are pretty low, probably so low as not to worry about. I disagree, in that bar end or downtube shifters really are more rugged, and will almost certainly outlast a brifter. If you're changing bikes, or replacing your brifters with a new groupset every couple of years, you probably don't have anything to worry about. Would I want to use 20 year old, well used brifters out in the boonies? Not really.

I don't chose friction shifters because of their reliability, but more for their cheap cost. I don't mind their ergonomics, and the added reliability is just a nice bonus.

USAZorro

Low probability? Yes. Meritless? No. It is one less potential point of failure - especially when on a brevet, where a mechanical could blow the event.

3alarmer 

...not certain you are aware of which forum you are posting in ? Or maybe you are ?
And your Surly, just for some additional information, is unimpressive relative to the extinct stuff still available.

clubman 

Blah.
I've done my touring, I know what I need and want. Your remarkable ability to perceive these new ergonomic wonders that we less intelligent beings can't see are a revelation. Don't insult people unnecessarily.

Yeah my 8 speed Chorus Ergo group went 3 years without missing a single shift before I sold it. Still wouldn't tour with it.

Salamandrine 

The ex mechanic in me would like to call attention to some practical considerations:

Option 1 - Down tube shifters, clamp on

The problem with this is that without a braze on stop tab, DT shifters have a strong tendency to migrate down the tube. They will need to be put on very tight, and this will destroy your paint job. An ugly modern clamp on adapter like the one problem solvers sells may hold better. I don't know. Already mentioned are the aesthetic considerations of having unused head tube stops just sitting there. Also, in case you care and FWIW, it isn't period correct. Clamp on shifters were phased out in the 70s.



Option 2 - Brifters

Main issue is that you will have to lose the SR derailleurs. At a minimum, you could go with Microshift 7 spd brifters, and replace the derailleurs with shimano compatible types. More likely, you'd be re-spacing the frame to 130, rebuilding or replacing the wheels, and going with 90s era campy brifters and derailleurs. That's a lot of work.

1989Pre 

I just don't see it, and never really have: I don't ride in the drops that often, and if I ever felt the need to have my shifters on my handlebars while in the drops, I'd put them in the location where my hands are actually placed in the drops.., not over the end of the bar where your hand has to actually leave the bar. As far as accessibility and efficiency go, I prefer downtube shifters. I don't like the way bar-end shifters look, either. They are not nearly as bad-looking as the heinous integrated shifters/brakes of the modern day, though.

gugie 

Brifters are a great innovation. All of your controls are at your fingertips. I cannot deny that. Ergonomically, they are superior to any other shifting paradigm. I agree with you completely. As a shifting system, when working correctly, it can't be beat. There are costs to it, however.

I look at the pros vs cons. If I were racing, that'd be the way to go. If I rode locally with a fast crowd, ditto.

It gets down to the way I like to ride. I like long rides out in the country, do some touring, and like gravel riding. I've seen too many broken brifters from minor crashes that making shifting impossible. I'm not big on index shifting either. I rode with them for a decade or two. They're great when they work, but there always seemed to be some adjusting to do too often for my liking. You can't trim the derailleurs. They add a lot of complication, and you're stuck with a proprietary shifting system. If you go down and bend your derailleur hanger, indexing doesn't work anymore. Non-brifter systems are more durable, less complicated, less expensive, and work on a variety of different cog combos. I can switch wheels and don't have to adjust for indexing differences.

I like to keep it simple, and the trade-off for simplicity is too much for me.

To say that bar ends, stem and downtube shifters are extinct is just plain incorrect.

1989Pre 

The Audax shifters? I think those look pretty good! At least, compared to the obtrusive "brifter".

clubman 

That's fine, you have a position on your bike that others may not choose to use when touring. I lived on the drops on my T-1000 for most of my riding. We all shift more than we brake so choose your weapon, up high or down low, it's all about bike fit and personal choices.

Reynolds 

One thing I like about DT shifters is their crisp, short travel action. Can't say that of brifters.

1989Pre 

Yes, it is. O. P. asked my opinion and I gave it. Nowhere did I say that what was right for
me was necessarily right for anyone else. We all have our own preferences and riding styles.
Even if I do not prefer the barcons, I am happy to read about those with opinions other than
mine, because it expands my world. I like to know how other people think, and I suppose honesty, without trying to sound better or smarter, is the way to go.
I may have strong likes and dislikes, but I am hoping that others have the sophistication to put things into the proper perspective.

1989Pre 

I tried brifters twice. Their mushy, long-travel feel was a nightmare, and their lateral movement, counter-intuitive. Whenever I see them, I want to take a Sawz-All to them, and make one diagonal cut, right in the center of the body. There. It may not be something beautiful from Campagnolo from the early 80's, but at least it doesn't stick out any more.

Fahrenheit531 

Nothin' personal. When you set up the pins like that, you've gotta expect somebody is gonna send a ball down the lane.

The Golden Boy 

I use Command Shifters. I have 2 bikes with bar ends on. One with DT shifters and I have a set of brifters that I'm not using...

I don't particularly care for DT shifters. Never have. I prefer bar ends to DT shifters. You can still maintain control the bike while shifting with bar ends- especially when coming to a stop.

Brake levers and brifters are naturally in a much more vulnerable position just being perched on top of the front of the bars. One would be hard pressed to find a well ridden bike without some damage to the levers, however, there are many many well ridden bikes with no damage to the rear derailleur or derailleur hanger. While that position is uncovered- it is not as open and vulnerable as the brake levers. Even a fall to the drive side has the crank to strike the ground/pavement first. Brifters have (somewhat) complex workings that just are exposed on the front of the bars that will be the first portion of the bike to strike the ground. Both DT shifters and bar ends are more robustly designed than any brifters I've seen.

Command Shifters mount inboard of the brake levers, they're not only protected from impacts by the levers, but also by the curves of the bars. You have the freedom to choose whatever lever style you like with Command Shifters. You can also dump a whole 10 speed cassette in the flick of your thumb. I don't know why you'd want to do that, but you can.

As far as the OPs bike- it's a pretty bike. I'm really surprised it's shifting reliably. The chain is really short, the housings are excessively long and poorly routed and I'm shocked that Accushift shifters are indexing on a Campagnolo mixed system. You should be able to put brifters on there- I don't see any reason not to.

fietsbob

I have Campag friction bar end shifters, on a Campag Rally RD.. equipped bike..

jyl

I have bikes with brifters, down tube shifters, and Gevenalles (shifter levers mounted on the front of the brake lever).

I don't presently have a bike with bar end shifters but I have a set of bar end shifters waiting to go on the right bike. I like them fine. My second bike (as a kid) was a Raleigh Gran Sport with bar ends.

My only issue with bar ends is that on some bikes my knees brush the levers, but only when sprinting or climbing raggedly.