Yeah, I was there.
Jes is just fine now.

This might be a good time to mention that from what I've personally seen there is more road rash, breaking of bones, and loss of lives in USCF/UCI cycling than in alley cats. This is partially due to road speed, pack size, and drug use. I'm not sure what to make of this, and not sure it wont change as alley cats popularize, but the fact still remains that I am much more hesitant about riding in a twisty criterium than an alley cat. At least in an alley cat one has more control over the dangers one confronts. Not much you can do when a 30 person criterium peloton goes in front of you and you are cycling at 30+ MPH. That's what makes an alley cat death like the one this week so sad. It was so very easy to prevent. It was a matter of the rider's own error, and not a matter of anything beyond his control. In the end, it is why I don't really dig pack racing at all anymore, criteriums, alley cats, road races, or otherwise. I may think about playing with time trails, pursuits, and kilos in the summer, but my pack racing days are largely over. I take enough risks in life, I don't need to tempt karma.

What's really needed are some new forms of racing besides criteriums, road racing, time trials and track. More egalitarian where "category #" is not part of the equation.

Quarter mile drags? Slalom courses set up in parking lots (gymkhana) ? They do both of these with cars. Why not with bikes?

some places are starting to do sprint nights. boston just got boldsprints, which uses rollers, but we tried doing street sprints, too. nyc has (had?) the rat pack hustle. but you're right. newer competitions would be fun.

First: condolences to the rider's family and friends. Second: Condolences to the Chicago cycling community. I can only imagine how everyone involved is feeling right now.
I don't know the answer to the question. I just keep thinking that these events are supposed to be fun and it's no fun when people end up dead or seriously injured. I've done dumb ****. I went over the hood of a car and accept the responsibility for it. I should have seen it coming. The difference being, i was still breathing after the fact. I got lucky.
I have some mixed feelings on it all right now. We have an event coming up for which i will be working a checkpoint and I hope the emphasis is on fun more than competition...just be careful. I think with the increasing popularity it may be crucial to emphasize the fun more than the competition. I'm not a messenger and I never will be. Honestly I think that the whole thing has been watered down to the point where they can't even be considered "messenger races". These events are fun however, and I like to have fun with friends on bikes as long as nobody gets themselves killed.

Categories are meant to divide skill levels. Open category races are inherently dangerous, due to the varying skill levels. Qualifying, heats, or rounds all achieve the same purpose.

I don't see why most people assume grass-roots racing will automatically result in some version of internationally-sanctioned, regulated, and soul-sucking racing. The track racing portion of this year's West Side Invite was OBRA-sanctioned, and all the riders didn't turn into "spandos". Hell, some messengers even competed in the Rapha Roller Races. Most of these unsanctioned races already have sponsors--they're only one step from collecting permits and waivers--especially if they're collecting money to run the event.

Racing is a balance of risk versus reward. Keep the rubber side down and the shiny side up.

We totally have this! It is called NORBA. People race everything from knobby tired clunkers to custom made mountain bikes made by tiny companies in California. The whole scene is really chill. Racing is totally secondary to making friends and drinking beer. The scene has a lot of ex roadies in it who got sick of all the USCF bullsh*t. NORBA has nothing to do with any other cycling governing body, and certainly doesn't condone drug testing. Heck, I've watched some of the cream of the NORBA crop smoke some insane dubage. I'm telling you, I've actually thought about selling my Masi track bike and getting this kick ass camo painted bike a guy named Tom Ritchey is selling over at Palo Alto Bicycles. Woah...sorry guys...totally flashed back to 1984 there for a second.

My point exactly. But if you want to stay on pavement, and race a bicycle, then you either have to become an uber-roadie or you don't get to play.

What I'd like to see are grownups racing like kids do - short run, small packs, low risk. Maybe even handicap it like bracket drag racing. If the NHRA can do it with cars, why can't we do it with bikes?

Save your sound, well thought out logic for another forum!

Actually, I think you missed my point entirely. USA Cycling and UCI tend to swallow up almost everything good about cycling, and spit out a regurgitated unfun lycra mess. NORBA is no exception all these years later.

What I'd personally love to see is a road racing and track series built much like NJS. Total standardizing of equipment so as to be afforded by the masses and about athletes, as opposed to windtunnels, carbon fiber, and cash. As well as regular road racing and track events, it would be great to see rally type events too where a map, timer, and compass were part of the fun. Maybe even single speed and fixed gear road racing. Standardized, less expensive, more fun. Cycling could use some of this.

pro racing and low category USCF racing are two completely different animals. Have you done sanctioned racing to warrant such comments?

Let's be clear here... The West Side Invite had to be OBRA sanctioned in order to actually race at Alpenrose. A bunch of messengers coming down to race Alpenrose "unofficially" probably wouldn't fly for long. And if you look in the pics, most of them are wearing lycra shorts.

And I don't think you can compare anything to the Rapha Rollers, nor is anyone complaining about it. It was meant to get all varieties of bike riders out on the rollers.

NJS being about the athletes... hahaha. What a silly notion.

It's about the gambling.

Yes.

I was referring to the possibility of purposeful equipment limitations in order to make riders more important than the expensive technology of what they ride, so as to make the sport easier to afford. I know that the NJS rules are in great part there to prevent cheating in a gambling sport. But, even the NJS rules do help to make the betting be about the better cyclist as opposed to the better bicycle.

Like that affordable, entry-level NJS equipment? By labeling it as "competition-worthy equipment" (CWE henceforth), they are labeling it "special" equipment. CWE components will cost more than equivalent components without the CWE stamp on them. Sure, some new NJS frames cost less than the most expensive road frames, but the components cost about the same, once you account for there being FAR fewer parts on a tack bike and factor in the relative mechanical simplicity of the few parts involved.

Also if there wasn't a good reason (international professional-level competition) for developing crazy and cool space-age bikes, nobody would do it!

This is bike racing, not formula 1. As long as your bike is mechanically sound and you know how to ride it, an amateur race WILL NOT be won or lost on a basis of how expensive, or technologically advanced one's bike is. Sure racers like to spend money or their bikes which might make an outsider think its necessary, but in reality it doesn't take much of a bike to get yourself on to an essentially level playing field.

the differences in skill and fitness levels are so much greater than the equipment for beginners.

The only place were big money can buy you a big edge is in elite time trailing.

No wonder few people transition into sanctioned racing with misconceptions like these floating around.

Roadgator,
What type of fixed gear or single speed bicycle do you own?

huh, alleycat with a route? :p the races are dangerous, unorganized and anything goes; otherwise they wouldn't be as fun or exciting for the participants (who know what they're doing). as someone else said, they're also supposed to loosely mimic a day of work for the messengers they were organized for and once you start making rules and trying to control the environment to make the non-mess safer, the purpose of having an alleycat in the first place starts to disintegrate. = my opinion

You will also notice having to sign so-called "waivers" at your local weeked warrior charity events, whose only real function is to discourage people from suing by making them think they can't.

(I know you were kidding so don't take this as an attack. Your comment was a catlyst that I needed to get myself back into this discussion)

In the case that I was talking about there actually wasn't a set route, but I knew full well that the shortest way to go from the start to the first (mandatory) checkpoint was to go through this intersection. I admit that I planned it that way on purpose. In this particular case, much of the pack stopped. A few went through on the red. One of them got hit.

The funny thing was that I knew that there was an alternate route that was slightly longer but involved fewer intersections. When I rode them before the race, the alternate was always faster unless I got a green on the intersection in question. I thought that people that knew the area would see the same thing (they were given time to review the manifest before the race). Aparently no one did. They were only interested in the shortest route. I fear that this is beginning to take precident over more intelligent planning.

I look at intersections like obstacles. Maybe like someone planning a cross race looks at stairs or hurdles. People deal with them in different ways. When I plan a race that doesn't have a set route, I try to look at how people will run it. I try to get people to negotiate certain situations, but thier actual path is untimately up to them. Some are intersections, some are bad roads, etc... Last year (same race as was referenced above) I made a manifest where taking the freeway for one exit was a massive shortcut between two checkpoints, thinking that no one in their right mind would do this (of course I never reveal my intentions for the route before the race). I was wrong. There were no incidents.

Taking current developments in racing tactics into account, I intend to re-evaluate my strategies before I plan another race.

Maybe most; not all. Include me out. I find riding a bike exhilirating in and of itself, and I'd like to continue for many years. I'm truly sorry for everyone involved in this tragic death, whether directly or peripherally.

I don't think there is much we can do. Some people just push the limits too far and don't realize until its too late. Maybe some sort of screening process would help. A big problem is inexperienced riders trying to keep up with faster guys by riding reckless. If you had a staggered start where the experienced riders started first then the inexperienced riders started second then maybe inexperienced riders would be less likely to get baited into keeping up with experienced riders. Different checkpoints for different levels of riders could send less experienced people on safer routes. The biggest thing that could be done would be to stress safety over speed but we all know that some people don't listen to that kind of stuff. Those are my suggestions to help newer riders. All of those suggestions are probably already in use in some alleycats.

Let the messengers and big shots keep doing what they are doing. Its sad when people get hurt/killed in races but it is ultimately the doing of the rider. We all know the risks associated with street racing. If it wasn't dangerous half the racers would quit.

Interesting. Having never "raced" professionally or otherwise, I have nothing to compare to and probably shouldn't even be posting in this thread, but doing that type of a race in traffic in winter has to be riskier than your daily ride. That said, I know there have been times when I am out riding where I get in that "zone" where the endorphins are flowing and you are running on pure energy and you just concentrate on riding and lose track of your surroundings.

I would really like to do an alley cat race, but I know my daily bicycle commute and weekend rides do not come near to providing me with the reflexes and experience needed to dart through traffic in the middle of a city at night at an acceptable level of risk.

I think that is the key here--we all take risks and do "dangerous" things to some degree or another for the thrill or ego, or whatever reason----but the people I know who have done these types of races know the difficulty and risks before going in, and to them, given their experience and the thrill they get, it is worth the risk. I feel horribly saddened by that tragic story in the other thread. I don't blame anyone for that, but riding in that type of a race is certainly riskier than a morning spin on your local bike trail.

However, the people I feel really sorrow for/angry at are the highschool/college kids I know that are into the "hipster" scene that are trying to do these races without really appreciating the risk involved. Whether through naivette or that youthfull sense of indestructibility, it just never occurs to them what they are doing is dangerous or that they are endangering others. I have a younger cousin that was all amped to do an alley cat even though he just started riding fixed 6 mo ago and had moved into the city 1 yr ago. He won't be able to now because he broke his shoulder 3 blocks from his house the other day when he slipped on ice while trying to ride to work in the morning on his brakeless "fixie."

STOP SAYING "FIXIE"



please?



my bike is not a toy.



back on topic...

If we start applying rules to alleycats, there will inevitably be new races made without rules. You can't stop them; as long as there is there is the desire for outlaw races there will always be outlaw races. If you put sanctioned routes and required brakes and helmets in MonsterTrack, there will be a new race with the old rules.

And about the technology aspect: I for one appreciate the technological advancement that comes with the lack of regulations over equipment. Trying to get the advantage is what fuels progress. If rules like that were made in automotive racing when it first started, we'd still be using carbeurated engines that get 10 mpg and 30 hp in our everyday cars.

Thanks for posting this. I'm sorry, as I always am, to hear of a cyclist being killed. But I also feel for the others involved - his wife, his family, witnesses, and the driver of the vehicle, who will never forget the day he/she ended someone's life, albeit through no fault of his/her own. Understanding that point is a key to comprehending why lots of people are "intolerant" of street racing and unpredictable riding in general.