Is this on the board that cannot be named? Good catch.

Yep.

Your religious zeal for all things Phil Wood is inspiring. For my part I like Phil Wood bearings, but I can't take it as an article of faith that their bearings are better than all other bearings. The evidence I have in the form of 2 pair of high mileage bearings still full to the brim with good grease and still spinning well after 6 vermont winters suggests otherwise to me, but I wouldn't dream of denouncing your faith. If there is a God of cartridge bearings his name might as well be Phil.

You mean the bearings which are bicycle specific and aren't even made any more. :rolleyes:

Religious zeal? I recognize a quality product when I see one. Why you have a problem with this is beyond me.
For some reason you just don't like PW. Period. You simply want to troll.

I actually DO like Phil Wood, and I've said so many times. I bought some, and from what I can tell they are a quality product. I would and DO recommend the bearings they sell, but I don't recommend them above all other bearings. I refuse to believe the hype that they are something special.

I've said many times in this thread that I think they are quality bearings, yet you keep responding claiming that they are MORE than that. You're welcome to believe what you want.

Why do you keep touting a bicycle specific bearing which was made by a company long bankrupt as an alternative? What are some current production bearings which will stand up to the elements like a PW bearing?

I've tried the bearings which come in Hope hubs, SKF, Formula, and others; none has lasted me longer than 9 months in rainy Riga. What should I use?

It wasn't made by Suntour. It was made by NSK, same as the Phil Wood bearings I bought to replace them. Buy Phils by all means, they work for you and I don't believe they are overpriced.

Phil Wood apparently beleives and from my experience I agree that a lot of waterproof grease will protect your bearings and make them last longer. Regardless of Manufacturer, cartridge bearings CAN be repacked easily. It's easy to remove the seals with a pocket knife without damaging them. If the grease washes out or gets contaminated flush it out and repack it with copious amounts of fresh grease. Press the seals back in and you're done. This SHOULD help make your bearings last a lot longer.

I don't know what that's supposed to mean but it's probably true... Why am I still posting about this? It's *********sing ball bearings!!!

So now what you are saying is that one should repack the new bearings which they buy in order to make them similar to PW bearings. Um okay.

As for the bearings you have they were specifically made by NKS for Suntour, just like PW bearings currently are.......

Thunderdome my man.

Listen all! This is the truth of it. Fighting leads to killing, and killing gets to warring. And that was damn near the death of us all. Look at us now! Busted up, and everyone talking about hard rain! But we've learned, by the dust of them all... Bartertown learned. Now, when men get to fighting, it happens here! And it finishes here! Two men enter; one man leaves.

Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls... Dyin' time's here.

No I'm saying you should repack your bearings more frequently if you're wearing them out in 9 months due to weather. Crud in the grease will make them roll poorly long before it damages the balls or race surfaces. So by repacking your old bearings before any damage occurs you can get more life out of them.

As for the bearings I have, you don't know anything about the guts of them and how thay may or may not differ from Phil Wood Bearings, or electric motor bearings, or motorcycle motor bearings, and neither do I, but I know these things are bomber and I intend to repack them and keep using them for a LONG time.

...and that's all I'm going to say about it. Ever again. I promise.

I've got other things to do besides repack bearings every month or so. I think I'll stick with high quality, fair priced bearings made for foul weather.

I actually enjoy cleaning cups and bearings, then repacking. But I think I would enjoy cleaning the area and putting in new cartridges as much.

In the amount of time several of you have spent posting in this thread you could have serviced your loose-ball hubs half a dozen times.

I still believe there is a real, perceptible difference in speed/resistance on the road between cartridge and loose-ball. I suppose this may very well be placebo effect though - I also feel faster when I'm riding drunk... Given the many moving parts creating resistance bottle-necks in your drive-train, I can't claim a perceptible difference when it comes to rear hubs - and currently I run loose-ball front, and a cartridge rear on my everyday bike.

I will still advocate loose-ball for the average rider. The upkeep just isn't that bad, even when used in occasional slop - modern loose-ball hubs have pretty decent seals - and you can generally get cheaper, higher quality hubs by going that route.

If you live someplace really, really wet - by all means get hubs with cartridge bearings, you'll still be fast. However, I don't think the convenience justifies the price of Phil HUBS, buy Formula/whatever cheap cartridge hubs, ride them till the bearings get gritty, then replace those BEARINGS with Phil Wood (or whoever).

Although I agree that Phil's are expensive, any piece of gear that you're willing to ride constantly over a long period of time has its cost negated. In other words, if you think it's worth it and you're going to ride it, then it's worth it.

Also, the problem with open ball bearing that you see on SunTour and DuraAce is that the hubs themselves are not designed for the kind of burly city riding that all of these trendy track bikes are seeing on the road now. My friend has been riding a set of Dura Ace 7600 track hubs for four months now and has already begun to strip the cones. I have NEVER seen this kind of breakdown of Phil Woods because they're simply more durable. The sealed bearing system in Phil Wood hubs is simply indestructible. Plus Dura-ace hubs have their bearings designed specifically for the individual hub, meaning that each hub's microscopic imperfections are compensated by making minute changes to the bearings that go into them. This also means that if one little piece of sand gets in there and starts scratching everything to hell and you have to replace the bearings, the hubs, even with new bearings, will never run as smooth as when you first purchased them.

That being said. If I were to race the velodrome (which we don't have in Albuquerque) I would lace up Dura Ace 7600 or the Suzue Pro Max. These two hubs are the fastest and lightest hubs for the money, hands down.