Hi all,

Some good buddies of mine are getting married and April, and my college friends and I just pooled our money together to get them a tandem to ride away on. I picked this older steel tandem Peugeot up on Craigslist, and it is quite pretty:



It needs a little bit of work, and I have decent amateur repair experience and tools. The rear wheel that it came with doesn't quite fit. The frame is spaced for 135mm, but the wheel looks more like 120mm or 125mm.

So! I need to find a 27" rear tandem wheel, which thus far in my googling are difficult to find. I've never built a wheel before, but have always wanted to learn. But I'm not sure if a tandem wheel as a gift to friends that I care about is a good first wheel to build (I don't want them to have a terrible accident due to my amateur skills).

I talked to my LBS and they said they could cold set the frame at a different spacing, give or take 5mm, if I needed.

What should I do? Should I try to buy rim and hub and get my LBS to build it? I'm hoping not to spend too much more money on this gift. Or, maybe someone out there has an old tandem wheel lying around that they'd like to sell?

Thanks!
-Andrew

That's a very thoughtful gift. You guys rock.

What about these? https://www.ebay.com/itm/Tandem-Wheel...item3f20deb649

Fewer spokes, but these are brand new

https://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Sun-CR18...item3f1ce2b879

Awesome find! Thanks! I just bid on them. We'll see!

They would look great on that Peugeot. Good luck!

The over-locknut dimension (OLD) for tandems has steadily increased over the years to the present where there are two standards, 160mm for Santana and 145mm for everyone else. 145mm hubs build significantly stronger wheels than the earlier standards. Back when that Peugeot was new, folks riding tandems would experience more broken spokes than flat tires, on average. This is because the narrower OLD hubs have the flanges closer together, so the bracing angle of the spokes is less, which stresses the spokes more. So I would never want to cold set a frame to a *narrower* dimension, if anything I would widen it to 145 if possible. If you don't want to spread it that much, then by all means get a true 135mm hub, because that wheel will be stronger than either the 130 or 126 wheels listed above in this thread. Don't add spacers to a 130 to make it fit, if you do that you still have the weaker 130 flange spacing.

You should be able to find some on ebay or amazon. If not, then could get one from Peter White's site as he has a new stock of new production 27" tandem rims and has long experience in building wheels for these long bikes.

Ok, thanks for the advice. I'm trying to find a 135 or 140 wheel now.

Aye, thanks Ksisler! I'm looking. I didn't win the ones linked to by hup earlier . I just bid on these.

I saw the Peter White option, but it looked like it was going to be pretty expensive to get him to custom build some for me. I'm willing to spend $150 on a rear, do you think he'd be able to do it for that?

If they are not riding far and are not large people like me (6'4" 198), then the bike as is should be good enough for a photo op. How into cycling are they?

We live in Brooklyn, and they cycle around the city often. They've never done long bike tours, but I would be excited to do some day or weekend rides with them on this. He is probably your size, she's pretty average for a woman (5'6" maybe?).

On a budget - 135mm OLD tandem rear wheel - that is STRONG.

Hub:
https://www.amazon.com/Wheel-Master-T...1&keywords=40h
or
https://www.amazon.com/Wheel-Master-A...2&keywords=40h
these hubs are made like sealed bottom brackets, strong, big sealed bearings, not serviceable because they are glued together.

Spokes: 2.0mm stainless steel: Wheelsmith, Sapin, lots of choices; make sure they are stainless steel.
Nipples: nickel plated brass.

Rim: 27" 40H rim is hard to find. What is the spoke count on the wheel you have?

If it is 36H; keep the rim, get Wheelsmith DH13 spokes, the correct lengths, and this hub:
https://www.amazon.com/Shimano-FH-RM3...3&keywords=36H

IF you were in the area (San Jose, CA); I'd be happy to help you build it up.

Wheels98...and any other contributors - sounds like the start of a good thread, but for today I was just wondering;

Is there an analysis of the different OLNs for the rear or front wheels? I am thinking of something with good math well done and the results in tables to be read and assessed. If the study had good line drawings with degree angles and spoke lengths, that would be instructive also. Although I am pretty sure I have one or more tandems in each OLN from 120mm to 160mm (mostly just ride one with 145mm rear/100mm front), I don't have the breakage experience, nor the fine grained understanding of the wheel geometry to write such a report myself. Appreciate if anyone could post links to such info. Comments also welcomed

Thanks
//K

OP Ottomatta; I haven't added up the parts you have in mind. Hit the site and go to the tandem parts page. I think will lead to a specific tandem wheel page with prices that you can compare for parts and for completed wheels in stock. Note the 27" rims listing. Peter 's prices and labor costs are right there in the open as they are for most good wheel building shops. Also might be good to give him a call by phone to discuss your specifics. It comes down to parts plus labor plus a bit for shipping. His warrantee is included so be sure to read that too. I have heard many good reports regarding his wheels and have several myself that are as good as or better than any I have seen or ridden from others. I have no financial or company relationship with him at all but am an occasional customer.

Yeah, he's got it all listed over here:
https://www.peterwhitecycles.com/tandemparts.asp

The cheapest applicable hubsets he has listed is > $150, and that is just the hubset. I'd only need one hub I suppose, since I can probably make the front wheel work. But still, all added together that will cost me $200 or $300 just for a wheel.

How did you guys find those used 27" tandem wheels on ebay? I keep searching and can't come up with much. I'm trying to get these:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Phil-Wood-Hu...-/150979934785

But the guy says that he is wrong about the posting somehow, and will need to repost them. Not sure what's going on with that.

I've never built a wheel before, but I'd be willing to learn for this if I have to. Although, I'm not so sure giving my first built wheel away as a wedding present is such a good (or safe) idea.

Their wedding is in April, so I have a bit of time...but not too much. I can't procrastinate! I'm still looking!

Ha, it would be cheaper for me to go buy a new crappy tandem bike than to get a new wheel built.

OP/Ottomata;

Re PWC price; There isn't a tagline on the webpage saying "Peter is Currently Giving Stuff Away Just For The Hell of It". Basic he and other shop owners sell things based on their cost plus a bit of profit plus a bit for labor. And generally good quality bike parts are not what you would call cheap. I have went through the work and materials needed to make a hub from scratch for a customer application and it is a lot more than $300. When it comes to tandem specific strength stuff, the wholesale cost to the dealer is higher due to the far lower volume (like 1-2% of the volume for single bike stuffs). It is what it is. These shop owners are offering their product for a fair market price and they will build you a wheel-to-die-for; not a wheel-to-die-on! There is a difference. And it is not Walmart!

- To extend that discussion: If one is wanting or needing to buy something like the above said item, but wants or needs to pay only a forth as much, then he has to look at other outlets.

-- Ebay is a big one but it is an acquired taste so to speak. If you login to ebay and search on tandem +bike (not in quotes) then you will find tandem bikes and tandem parts and pieces. Likely quite a few pages. So search again using tandem +bike +wheel and you will still get some bikes but the results will have a higher ratio of tandem wheels. Look within all those to find what you want. I normally sort the listing by "those expiring first" so if the auction for the exact thing you are looking for is ending in 10 minutes, then you will have 10 minutes to look at it before the auction is over and you miss out on it because you couldn't convince youself to pull the trigger soon enough...

-- Craigslist is usually a decent place to buy a used name brand bike (magic spot for a used Trek) and somethings a used tandem. To my experience it isn't of much use to buy just bike parts or tandem parts. However you can sometimes snag a nice Tandem at a good price; the same as on ebay. The downside of craigs is that you typically have to actually deal with actual people and you have little structured protections. If I am buying a bike, then I ask the seller where the nearest Walgreens or nearest police station is to there location and then agree to meet the seller only at those types of locations. Even more so if I am the seller...I never allow anyone to visit my residence as getting mugged/robbed/killed is not my idea of a good day.

-- Now to close; Your inference to parts verses an entire bike. Yes, to a degree. If you have a tandem frame already and want to build it as an example. This is going to cost you a lot if you buy all the pieces from retail stores and websites. Maybe $2.500 or so more or less. However If you buy a complete Cannondale/Commotion/ Santana/Burley/etc, off ebay or craigs then you will probably have from $700 to $1,800 invested in that effort. Then it is your choice whether to swap the components over to your existing frame or just sell it and ride the new one as is. However if you are not fully up on the idiosyncrocies of bottom bracket spindle lengths, stem fitting, OLNs, seat post diameters, Cantilevers vs Rim vs Disk and all that that entails, then keep the new bike together and ride it unless you just have lots of extra money and time to burn... In many cases when one finds oneselve in a deep hole and having only the shovel in your hand, then the best use of that shovel is not to dig further, but to lean it against the wall of the hole to support your foot in leveraging yourself out of the hole.

Hope that helps
K

There are two 27" sets on ebay right now. Cheap. here's one:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Tandem-Wheel...item1c300c9681

The other was off a gitane with wolber super champion rims. Seller did not indicate that it was 27", but if it's off an old gitane, that would be 27", right?

Good luck.

I was just scrolling down through here and ran across this month-old thread. It may be too late now, but I wouldn't recommend getting ANYone a tandem as a surprise gift, for multiple reasons. For one, I know couples that ride all the time, ride a bazillion miles, have friends that ride tandems, and they have zero interest in riding one (or, if either one of them isn't interested, same issue.) If they do ride a tandem, knowing what they'd like is pretty much a crapshoot. (I bought mine a year ago, but would never have considered the one you're working with.) If you know them well enough to know they'd like to ride one, like to ride a vintage one, and like to ride this vintage one in this size and in this color and know they don't want to spend more and don't want to settle for less, then go for it. Otherwise, cash would be a better option.

I've bought tandems for friends. Bought my Dad and his list of ex's a Cannondale, bought my friend a Burley. Neither ever get ridden so far as I know.

Best 27" rim that is tandem rated that I know of is the Velocity Dyad in 48h. Paired with a used Phil Wood hub (one piece alloy shell, not older two piece) and built by either Peter White or Wheelbuilder. That's my recommendation. I'd avoid any Amazon or eBay built wheel like the plague.

If the wheel is in decent shape otherwise then it shouldn't be hard to replace the axle with one that's longer and add spacers to bring the hub up to the 135mm spacing.