Hi all,

The shops in Tokyo run a cartel and will not budge from recommended retail prices! However, one shop has made some small concessions and we have finally decided to get the LHT for my wife, replacing her Specialized Sirrus Comp.

The only problem is we have to choose frame size before he orders and builds it. The standover height for the 42 and 46 frames are about 49cm and 51cm respectively. Her standover height is about 51.

So both it seems would work. The 42 seems safer but are there any advantages/disadvantages between the two?

If you're basing the decision solely on standover, I'd probably go with giving her the extra cm for comfort/safety sake. But, which size best fits her reach and sitting position? Which is most comparable to her current setup (assuming, of course, she's comfortable with it)?

There are no bikes of any size in the shop so we cannot tell which would be better. Her Sirrus has a sloping top tube (?) so hard to compare; but measuring straight accross the LHT is shorter, so I guess would give her a more upright position which would be more comfortable. But I dont know much about bike fitting so I can only guess.

Look at online geometry for the Sirrus and LHT. Compare the effective top tube lengths. Also compare stack height and reach measurement.

Those 3 measurements will give you a level set between a sloping tube bike and a level top tube bike.

Your measurements are whacked. A Surlys standover for a 42 cm bike has to be at least 28" - 71cm your wife's standover (crotch to the ground) has to be more than 51cm, 20" unless you tell me that she is incredibly short (under four feet tall.)

It would be helpful to post her height.

Bicycles in Japan in general are more expensive than they are in the US, with the exception of mamachari.


That said, while I can't comment on the LHT sizing, posting some height/inseam measurements might make it easier to get good advice.

Thanks. I will look into those numbers.

Yes my numbers are wrong! Ooops. They should read "about 70 can 72cm respectively"

Yes prices are higher but shops agreeing to stick with recommended pricing and telling us the cannot make a deal because the other shops would be angry if the others found out? This sounds like illegal price fixing to me. But Japan is like that.

She is 159cm tall and her inside leg measurement seems to be the same a the standover height.

It seems that Specilized do not publish geometry numbers! It means I would have to measure myself. Looking at the Surly chart the reach and stack are measured from an unidentified point above the "head tube." What is the point?

"Those 3 measurements will give you a level set between a sloping tube bike and a level top tube bike."

I can't quite understand what these number will give me!

do you plan to put dropbars on this bike? If so, be aware of the toptube length, thats the most important thing.I'd get some opinions from people who are the same height as her, or who know people her height who have LHT's.

will this be her first dropbar bike?

I'm not sure if this will help, but I have one daughter who is 150 cm tall who rides a 42 cm LHT, and one daughter who is 165 cm tall who rides a 50 cm LHT.

I googled and instantly found geometry figures for Specialized Sirrus Comp at the top of the list. You may have to work harder to find geometry info on older bike.

Disregard stack and reach. Compare effective top tube (ETT) length between your wife's drop bar bike and LHT. If you intend to build LHT with flat bar, then you will need ~50-70mm more reach (ETT+stem length) for comparable fit. On a LHT this will likely result in an undesirably high standover height (SH). Bear in mind that 26" LHT SH is based on ~1.37"/35mm tires (628mm diameter), so if you fit larger tires than this the SH will be even greater. Refer to diagram to measure ETT:

https://www.bikecad.ca/effective_top_tube_length

Err?

These measurements help standardize sizeing across the many varying frame designs.
When did that change?

Yes it will be her first drop bar bike. I was hoping someone of similar height would be on here but it seems not.

Thanks for the information and for finding the geometry page. It looks the same as her model. I cannot understand some of your information; but in any case her bike now is the Specialized flat bar and her new bike will be the surly with drop bars.

Speicalized refer to "TOP-TUBE LENGTH (HORIZONTAL)" I don't know what this means vis-a-vis Surly's "Top Tube Length" and "Effective Top Tube Length"

Can any one clarify that?

Cheers

The top tube length horizontal refers to the same thing as 'effective' measurements. And those are the same as actual level horizontal top tubes.

All are measuring what length the top tube effectively would be if it were horizontally level.

Thanks for the clarification. But now I really don't understand! My wife's Specialized with flat bars has and effective top tube length of 55.5cm. She finds it quite comfortable and her position relatively upright. To have the same top tube length on the Surly she would need the 54cm frame! In fact the choice is between the 42 and 46. So I cannot understand comparing the top tube length on both bikes.

Things seem more confusing than ever ;(

There is a Google spreadsheet of LHT owners with their dimensions and the size bikes they ride. It's thin on the lower sizes but it might be of some help. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...GQ/edit#gid=23

ETA: The heights are out of order a bit but it looks like the five or so riders of the same height as your wife are riding 46's.

The top tube length of a flat bar bike should be longer than that of a drop bar. This is because more length needs to be tacked on to a drop bar bike for the reach to the levers. A flat bar has its shift and brakes basically right at stem length. A drop bar has its brakes out another habdful of cm from the stem(how far will vary based on drop bar style).

Based on the stack and reach of the Sirrus, a 52cm LHT would be closest. But the standover height is too high at that frame size.
This assumes your wife rides an XS size Sirrus for size comparing.


Perhaps a sloping top tube touring bike frame is needed?
Otherwise, you could size down on the LHT and have a lot of steerer spacers plus a long stem to compensate.
This approach, a huge spacer stack, is actually pretty common on LHTs(based on all the pics i see). Its as if the geometry doesnt work for a lot of riders, but they still use the frame because its a solid value for the price and features.

Looks very much that a 46 would be more appropriate, especially that she has never ridden drops before.

I misconstrued OP's comments, thinking they had a Sirrus with drop bar and intended to build a LHT with flat bar (reality appears to be the opposite). Mathematically, 42cm LHT with drop bar most closely approximates an XS Sirrus with flat bar in terms of reach (ETT+stem+bar type consideration). 46cm may work too since ETT is only 1cm longer, but it gains 2cm standover. However, 42cm seems better choice since the XS Sirrus comes with 80mm stem.

OP, why not simply use the Sirrus for touring (439mm chainstays probably fine for female), since it is rear rack capable? Clearly you don't want to pay the asking price for LHT in your locale - so why buy a whole new bike?

Thanks very much, now I understand quite well.

Thanks for the info.

She has been using the Sirrus for touring but wants the smoother ride of a metal frame; a frame that she can keep for the rest of her life; and she cannot turn tightly (U-turn) with the 700 size wheels and often gets off!

Also I am sick of fiddling her breaks whereas my Surly breaks never need touching.

Finally the model we are looking at comes with 36T (this years model is down to 32T!!!!) and the guy has agreed to change the granny ring for free to 24t from 26. We always ride in moutains and it can be pretty tough sometimes.

I would like to thank everyone who joined this thread. All things considered, we have finally decided to go with the 46!