Rhubes

We are using an MSR Dragonfly Stove and currently run it on unleaded petrol. We've read that using white gas (Coleman Fuel) is better, but more expensive. Does anyone know if the white gas is readily available for the Dragonfly? We did read somewhere that it may be difficult to get in some countries/regions.

Thanks.

Rhubes
www.2wheelstochina.org.uk

oren_hershco

"White gas" is used in medicine, and therefore can be found in pharmacies. It can also be found in hardware / work tools stores.

It does burn cleaner and nicer than unleaded car fuel. I use it in my MSR Whisperlight International 600 stove.

Oren

derath

I would imagine it is something redily found in most developed countries. The biggest problem I would forsee is that I have always found white gas sold in 1 gallon amounts. It is very likely you may only find it sold in quantities too large for your liking.

When I have camped and needed fuel I always just used unleaded. I could fill up my containers at a gas station rather than trying to buy white gas and not being able to carry it all.

-D

coconut in IA

you can always grab a couple fuel bottles and fill up when you do find some as well. That is what me and my Girlfriend do....She calls me a Molotov cocktail on wheels.....

Bekologist

link to list of global fuel availability:

https://members.iinet.net.au/~mbuckler/fuel/index.shtml

atman

For ten grams weight and an hours work you can carry a backup alcohol stove:

https://zenstoves.net

It's made of two aluminium soda cans, with some flue tape to hold the inner wall together. I've made about a dozen; it's relaxing, and the result is rather durable. Meths are available most places in the world, and a backup can have tea on while you're heating dinner with negligible additional weight.

kesroberts

White gas does burn much cleaner and really isn't all that expensive, but availability will be spotty. My guess is you'll get used to using gasoline - that's what I did in the US. Just remember that the jet will need cleaning much more often.

paul2

In Canada white gas is readily available in one litre containers, but in the States I found it difficult to find it in anything smaller than a one gallon container.

fillthecup

I use a Svea Optimus 123, after the late Ken Kifer. So far I love the stove.

I've heard that while I can use unleaded gas, that cooking with it is dangerous due to the fumes. Anyone know about this? Or have any problems after years of using unleaded?

CHenry

White gas, like any highly refined and volatile petroleum fuel is also highly flammable. In an enclosed space it is even explosively so.

Unlike unleaded motor fuel, which has detergents and other additives for internal combustion engines, white gas is just unleaded gasoline.

All camping stoves that burn petroleum distillates release carbon monoxide when burning their fuels and can therefore be dangerous--deadly--when used in enclosed spaces, including tents and shelters. You should use them only outdoors or in very well ventilated shelters.

cyccommute 

Sorry but that's not correct. Unleaded gasoline is a mixture of branched and aromatic hydrocarbons of a certain boiling range during the distillation of petroleum. For good combustion in an engine, the fuel needs to be highly branched to provide smooth burning.

"White gas" is a lower boiling component of the distillation commonly called naptha. Napthas are straighter, less highly branched hydrocarbons (they'd probably have a low octane rating and make a lousy gasoline ) Although you would want to check with the stove maker to be sure, mineral spirits would be a good substitute for white gas and it's available in smaller quantities.

CHenry

From another site [https://welcomehome.org/backcountry/fuel.names.txt], this might be more to the OP's point:

"4) Some notes on White Gasoline
-------------------------------
<elliot@mail.utexas.edu> writes....... (May 96)
Coleman fuel and white gasoline are not the same. Coleman fuel contains
components that are much less volatile than gasoline (such as naptha).
This is what makes it safer to use in a stove or lantern. White gasoline
is simply gasoline that contains no antiknock additives. Commercial
unleaded gasoline contains additives that will likely damage your stove
unless it designed to accept this type of fuel (some are).
I suppose the question really is: Can I use white gas in my stove? Answer
is: probably. If it is clean and contains no additives, it will burn just
fine. It is more dangerous to handle since it is more volatile, but
clean, pure white gas will probably not damage your stove. At least it
has never harmed my Svea 123."

vik 

I believe the MSR Drangonfly is a multi-fuel stove so you can burn naptha(white gas), gasoline and kerosene. Just make sure you bring any additional jets they provided with you as you may have to switch when going to kerosene.

With that range of fuel options you'll have no trouble anywhere people drive vehicles and if you are really in the boonies you can build a fire with wood, yak dung, etc...

I would not see any need to bring a back up stove - just make sure you have an expedition maintenance kit for your stove.

I have used MSR stoves for about 20yrs and I still have my first one. I bought a maintenance kit for it and have yet to have to do anything more than clean the jets and replace the plunger gasket.

safe riding,

Vik

fillthecup

I use white gas, always outdoors with good ventilation. But I'm perturbed that white gas is often sold only in huge quantities, as noted by others. I've heard from many that unleaded gasoline works well in multi-fuel stoves, but the company line for the multi-fuel stoves I'm aware of (two to be honest), state that I should absolutely NOT use unleaded gasoline due to the damage that inhalation of the fuel additives can cause. I'll risk it if I get stuck without other options, but was curious what people knew or thought of this.

Mineral spirits, that's interesting. Thanks for the tip Cyccommute.

Erick L

Naphta is easy to find in Canada, even in small towns, usually in 1L and 4L container. In most hardware stores, near the Coghlan gadgets.

vik 

I have used unleaded gas for months at a time in a MSR multi-fuel stove with zero ill effects and only the need to clean the jet every couple months.

New MSR stoves all have the shaker jet cleaning needle so you can clean your jets every time you take your stove out to use - too easy.

cyccommute 

I'm sorry but I have to continue to disagree. From https://www.chromatography-online.org...omponents.html

The hydrocarbons [of gasoline] consist of a mixture of n-paraffins, naphthenes, olefins and aromatics. Naphthenes, olefins and aromatics increase the octane rating of the gasoline whereas the n-paraffins have the opposite effect. The aromatics consist mostly of a mixture of benzene, toluene and the xylenes. The benzene content is kept to a minimum (but is not negligible) due to its perceived toxicity.


Naphtha, more commonly know as white gas, consists of lower carbon content alkanes that are more volatile but unbranched of from C4 to C9 with a low aromatic content. Naphtha is used as a feed to make gasoline, although it is more commonly used to make ethylenes which are more valuable.

One of the reasons that naphtha is called 'white gas' is that gasoline has it's own yellow color (some of the components have color) while the naphtha fraction is colorless. This lack of color gave it it's name. Naphtha is added to fuel (especially in winter to improve the vapor pressure) but it is generally used elsewhere in the refinery.

hoogie

i have tried white gas/coleman fuel in my whisperlite international 600, but it just splutters ... whats your secret to success???
it runs fine on kerosene, and yes, i did change the jet ...

cheers,
hoogie

hoogie

my new trangia works really well, although its quite a bit heavier than my whisperlite ...
i picked up a second unused whisperlite at a garage sale for $3 [about US$1.60], had no pump or tools etc ... but i have those already

vik 

hoogie if you are sure you have the white gas jet installed (I would clean the jet just to be safe) and have good pressure in the fuel bottle than I am stumped.

I had that stove and it worked wonderfully on white gas - in fact I have never owned an MSR liquid fuel stove that didn't burn white gas well.

Might be worth sending it to MSR or visiting your local MSR dealer???

atman

A can stove weighs ten grams and costs nothing, and can heat your tea and wash water while you prepare dinner. It also expands the range of fuels you can burn, which can only help the cause. Is it needful? hopefully not. Pretty cheap insurance, though, and works like a charm, especially at boiling water (tea and cleanup and most other backcountry cook tasks). My ten year plus whisperlite international works great, and lives in harmony with my growing collection of can stoves, and between the two of them I'm pretty much covered for liquid fuels.

CHenry

An interesting article with a study and data regarding CO production by gas packstoves: https://www.bushwalking.org.au/FAQ/FAQ_Monoxide.htm

hoogie

ahhh, could be the pressure ... that would sound more like it ... i will try it again ...the jet was new and unused, and the fuel was new too ...

how much pressure should be in there?

vik 

Give it 20 or 30 pumps if the bottle is totally unpressurized. When you go to prime it the fuel should squirt out strongly. Then make sure you open the fuel valve fully once it is burning.

Follow your owner's manual or DL'd one from the web if you are unsure of anything.

hoogie

cool, thanks for that ... i'll give it a go tommorrow ...