I am looking into getting a fixed gear touring frame.

I am looking at the iro phoenix or the surly cross check.

I know that the big complaint about the phoenix is the rear is spaced 120 but that does not bother me as it will be fixed. i would actually like the 120 spacing better then the cross checks 132.5

How will the phoenix do with touring? the crosscheck is a proven machine, but with that said, I like the idea of not going down the beaten path.

Will the iro Phoenix be stable with panniers?

When looking at the geometry of both frames they are very close in angles. also i am looking at the 54 version of both, which is my size.
both have 72 h/t and 73.5 s/t

the wheelbase and chainstay is actually a little longer on the phoenix.

but the iro phoenix has a t/t of 54cm and a s/t of 49.5cm
and the crosscheck has a t/t of 55.88cm and a s/t of 54.102cm
which is very different among the 2 frames.

what do you guys think. and just to let you know my arms are longer than normal

steelwool tweed with an EBB, so when you decide you actually want gears (it will happen) you can easily convert .

If you can find an IRO Rob Roy, I think those are a little more tour-oriented than the Phoenix. If you switch out the fork for a LHT fork, you're golden.

I'm selling mine, but its a 56cm

well right now i am riding a 55 pista. The rob roy in the 56 has a 55 tt so it would work.

I have an On One Pompino (size large/54cm) with a no-name steel fork that has low-rider mounts. It handles pretty well with about 50lbs gear attached to cheap (Blackburn or similar) racks and cheap (Nashbar or similar) panniers. My favorite features of the Pompino are the extras in the frame: pump peg, chain hanger, and threaded fender mount (into the end of the seatstay wishbone). I can fit 35mm Nokian W106 studded tires under the fenders, too, but I wouldn't want to tour with them. As with most of my bikes, it's probably for sale so I can make room and fund another project.

I'll have to double check that it's not the next size up, but I'm pretty sure. It's hard to keep it straight because IROs tend to have weird measurements (extended seat tube, very slightly angled top tube). FWIW, I did see it sitting next to what I was told was a 53cm Pista and was really surprised at how closely sized they were.

If you're interested, I can take some more precise measurements or pictures for you!

Actually, the pompino is a great frame choice. My buddy had one for fixed wheel audax rides in the UK. If you really are set on fixed, its worth a look. great company. Plus, pompino is italian for *******...

I would love some more pictures.

Prepare for the onslaught, because this is a can of worms in the touring forum. Why tour on a track bike though, if you're going self supported? If you're carrying nothing but water (cc touring), then sure, I can understand. But if you're even packing 20 extra pounds, the geometry of a conversion or even a cross check will be much more relaxing. I personally wouldn't want to tour on a track bike with no braking mechanism at all (although my braking system on the penny isn't much to speak of), also.

The rob roy is not a track bike by any standards. The only thing that will be somewhat track about it is it will be fixed and have track cranks on it. but still that does not make the frame a track frame.

neither is the pompino. it has very comfortable geometry. It is basically a traditional UK style winter training bike.

Look at a Rivendell Quickbeam, it's a single speed/fixed gear bike with a touring geometry. Even has clever angled drop outs so if you run a second sprocket and need to move the wheel to tighten the chain up the brake pads stay aligned with the rim. I toured single speed in England last year, not fixed, but it was fun

It also depends on the sort of touring you want to do. I have a few of the bikes discussed, so I'll offer a comparison.
I have the following:
2006 IRO Rob Roy 60cm (no longer have it... it was too big)
2006 Redline 925 54cm (58tt)
2008 Jamis Sputnik 57cm (57tt)
2008 On One Pomino Large (54st, 55tt)
2009 Surly Travelers Check 58cm (58tt)

They'd all be fine for some kind of touring.

The Sputnik is the lightest, fastest, and has road racing geometry. It still feels pretty fast with 5-10lbs of gear hanging off the seatpost. The frame is pretty stiff, so low pressure tires are mandatory for comfort. I use 28mm tires around 70-80psi. Mine has no braze-ons for racks or fenders (but the newer models have fender eyelets).

The 925 is next fastest (unloaded) and has road sport geometry. It has braze-ons for a rear rack and fenders, and can fit 30mm tires under the fenders. It's my bike of choice for brevets and commuting. It handles well with a loaded rack, but the chainstays are only 42cm, so you might have heal clearance issues with large panniers. It would be best suited with an extra large seatbag and perhaps a small handlebar bag. It only has single-eyelet rear dropouts.

The Cross Check or Travelers Check can fit wider tires thanks to its cantilever brakes. It's pretty comfortable unloaded with skinny tires, or you can load it up and increase your tire size to match the load. It's practical cargo capacity is the same as the 925's.

The Rob Roy is basically a Cross Check with track fork ends instead of forward-facing horizontal dropouts. Mine was too big, so I didn't ride it much before selling it. It seemed like it would be pretty comfortable if it fit.

The Pompino is the best frame for loaded touring. It's the only one of the bikes that I keep a rear rack on all the time. The chainstays are slightly longer (up to 44cm), which helps with heal clearance and stability. The head angle is steeper than the 925 or Cross Check, so it also handle a front load better. It's pretty stable with front panniers, rear panniers, or both. The frame feels slightly stiffer than the 925 or Cross Check, so I tend to be more particular about my tire pressure on this bike. It would be best paired with a Long Haul Trucker fork.

My Pompino is a little smaller than my other frames, so I'd be more inclined to take the Travelers Check or 925 on a long tour.

thank you, that was awesome. I am not going to do any cross country, just a few hundred miles here and a few hundred there and i want to carry everything that i need. no cc touring here.

do you feel that you would if liked your rob roy more if it was correct size.

Yeah, it's lovable like the Cross Check. It's not light, fast, or good looking, but it's pretty versatile.

that is what we are going for versatile.

I just want to throw out that I personally like how the Rob Roy looks way more than the Cross Check. Those curvy seat stays! How can you not love it?!