long distance touring
 

Are SPD SL cleats better for long distance touring? Nevermind walking on cleats, I'll pack a pair of sandals in my messenger bag anyway. In terms of flex, and comfort, shouldn't SPD SL be better for distances over 50 miles? I just got off the chat with a rep from nashbar, and he told me two bolt and three bolt is night and day difference, and that he recommends three bolt for touring.

That's my question for now. I just want to get this cleat situation figured out, so I can order my shoes, and start working on my physique.

three bolts 'fer sure. i once put two bolts in my three bolt cleats and the chat guy's right. like they say about the temperature change at night in the desert. it's like the difference between night and day!

honestly, i don't think it makes any difference. except you can walk like a human being in most shoes made for two bolt cleats. and you won't have to go digging around in your messenger bag to find you flipflops first.

you're touring with a messenger bag?

I go where I can Try On shoes . you are on your own on the Indecision.
Shotgun approach.. buy several around your size both kinds and send the ones you dont like, or dont fit, back

I toured with Loose toe strap pedals; same Campag, Steel ones for 25 years..
the shoe fit that was most comfortable was also Loose, and I fit supportive insoles inside the shoes .

Loose fit helps circulation of the Humours.

I wouldn't walk in a bike shoe, period. With those spd shoes with the sneaker look, you get the cheap plastic soles. With a the really good, stiff soles, you don't get the nice, rubber touch that's really useful for walking around. Either way, you're going to sound like an irish step dancer everywhere you go. It's not like I'm planning to do any hiking. And I don't think it's really a big deal if I stop to pee, which I would imagine to be the best reason for stopping at all. And if I'm touring, I'm probably going to bring a small bag with me, with small things, like camera, or even just some snacks. But idk.

I just want to find out for sure if the smaller platform makes the shoe flex more, or deteriorate faster, or less comfortable on long rides. Maybe the nashbar guy simply fitted better into his new road shoes going from his mtb shoes. Or maybe he was just blowing smoke, to make me want to buy their more expensive road shoes (highly doubt it). Either way, I don't think I can really find out until I actually go on a ride with them. I don't think I can pick one just by putting it on, because the shoes I'm wearing fit really well, but they give me hotspots only 15 miles into the ride. And the reason why I'm hesitant to buy 6 shoes and trying them out... I mean there's the shipping, the hassle, probably restocking fee. It makes me uncomfortable just thinking about it.

I mean if it's really this bad, then they should just do a demo program like they do with tennis rackets, except with cycling shoes. Pay $20 to test some road shoes for 3 weeks or so, and ship them back. Less work for everyone involved.

i'm not sure, and maybe some others can chime in here, but i believe, for those tourers that use clip in shoes. most use two bolted cleats (duck!).

I have some Shimano TO92 touring shoes I added more Insole than stock, its a road upper , but a Spud
pocket sole.. just don't use them much.. at present,, likewise some Keen Commuter ' sandal shoes..

I managed to get a Behind the counter work it out while the work is being done job in a shoe repair shop.

so a Design of my own, when shopping was not getting it. those walked like penny loafers, because of the stiffer sole

on the bike its fine ..

I think Lake used to have a Spinning Workout , Gym shoe Look cleat
But built up the toe and heel so the cleat was not the tallest point
and you dont fall on your Butt on the waxed health club floor..

First of all ... if you've got questions about touring, why not ask them in the Touring forum.
http://www.bikeforums.net/forumdisplay.php/47-Touring

Next, onward to deal with all of this ...

You need to investigate more shoes. I don't know about the sneaker look shoes with the "cheap plastic soles", but the shoes with the thicker soles are great for walking around ... at least my Lake shoes are. No clicking. No discomfort. And mine look much like hiking shoes, so I can wear them around without anyone casting a second glance at them.

And are you talking about day tours?



Some people think that you have to wear road pedals and cleats with road bicycles ... and that's OK, but it isn't a hard and fast rule. I tried Look pedals (road pedals, 3 bolt) when I first started cycling, but didn't particularly like them, so I switched to SPD pedals and cleats and have been using them since ... with my road bicycles, with my mtn bikes, with everything.

If you are planning to tour, it is good to have cycling shoes you can walk in. In other words, mtn bike shoes. Go try on some mtn bike shoes. It's really not that bad. I ordered my first pair of Lakes from Nashbar, liked them, and have been wearing the Lakes since.


As for your hotspots ... move your cleats back.

I wear stiff soled shoes and use toe clips and straps...some of the time. I am touring, not racing so it works for me.

Aaron :)

Stiff soled cycling shoes that fit properly with adequate room and proper width for your feet. Cleat/pedal choice won't make any difference, IMO.

I have walked long distances in Shimano leisure shoes and boots , the ones with rubbery rather than plasticky soles. They may be thin but they are very comfortable. I used them without cleats , in toeclips. Cleats may affect the comfort and grip.

Note that any clipless shoe has a failure mode: the fibreglass midsole cracks and the cleat cannot be secured. This failure is not very common but has happened. Many long distance expedition riders use toe clips and trail shoes or boots for versatility and better failure mode.

It would be great to get feedback from anyone who has ridden 50+ miles in both spd and sl setups

I have done that many times. I ride SPD-SLs on my road bikes, and SPDs on my tourer. I've also toured extensively on platform pedals, and with toeclips.

I'm a big fan of SPD-SLs or other road pedal systems for performance cycling. The three-bolt, bigger platform, system makes for a more secure feel when you're putting out a great deal of power in a sprint, for example. And road shoes tend to be lighter and stiffer than those made for SPDs.

But the issue is intensity, not distance. At the intensities one rides when touring there's no effective performance difference imo. On a long tour my typical daily mileage might average 50 or 60, but it isn't uncommon for me to throw in a > 100 mile day. I have never had a problem with SPDs for these distances, and using them limits the number of extra shoes one has to carry. As does touring on platforms, of course, which is also perfectly fine as long as your shoes have appropriate soles. Though in those circumstances I do like toeclips, which even if not tightened serve to keep one's foot in the best postion on the pedal in, for example, wet conditions.

thanks for all the feedback.

you know what would be sweet? a rubber sole with a spd sl cleat insert. Is there such a thing out there? Well, I suppose those won't be any better than sandals.

Shoe 'float' is determined by the selection of the plastic cleat in three bolt SPD SL pedals, and by the spring settings on SPD pedals using two bolt metal cleats. Depending on your knees and other joints - that can make a difference. Suggest you also have a look at these articles:

http://www.cyclorama.net/viewArticle.php?id=352

http://www.cyclorama.net/viewArticle...76&subjectId=9

nice articles. I don't really agree with the second one, though. It sounds like someone who rides with toe straps, and wants to convince everyone, including himself, that he made the right decision. Soft soles make you work more, unless you're using your heels to pedal. What's so complicated about that?

I've ridden over 100 miles many times with SPDs, Egg Beaters, and Look road cleats/pedals. There was no consequential difference between the two when riding or over any distance, IMO, outside the usual differences in clipping in and out, walkability, etc..

I've ridden a whole lot more than 50 miles with SPDs. I've also ridden a fair distance with Looks way back when. I prefer the SPDs.

Speedplay is all about float,, Frog is their SPuD offering.
Time Atac you get release angle depending on which cleat is on which side, mirror image pair.

some others, Shimano? has a tension screw adjustment .

the base of the sole pocket that the cleat screws through is not soft, I sense,

you really havent taken any effort to go look at this stuff in shops have you?

I looked twice and didn't see toe straps promoted anywhere, and they weren't even mentioned in the article about pedals. However, shoes and pedals are usually matched - clipless or otherwise. Large platforms are matched with softer shoes for easier walking and smaller platforms are matched with stiffer shoes where walking isn't an issue and weight is. Both combinations optimize power effeciency - whats so complicated about that?

the article is saying that toe straps were the sht until clip in pedals came along. It's saying that everyone who went from regular shoes and toe straps to stiff soles and clipless pedals are chumps. He obviously doesn't use clipless whatsoever. Take those away, and what does that leave you? Do you actually buy into his argument that the whole clip in concept is there only to make sure the shoes don't slip in wet conditions, or that as long as the pedal doesn't flex there's no loss in energy? I wasn't even talking about spd vs sl, I was talking about why stiff soles (compared to regular shoes) isn't as worthless as he makes it out to be.

and for the record. because spd cleats cover less than a third of the shoe area as sl's, there is more than 3x the pressure exerted on the sole. Unless there's a platform to support the rest of the shoe surrounding the cleat, that small area is going to flex more. The mtb shoes are stiffer because they have thicker soles around that region (from what I've seen), but is that enough to overcome that much more pressure concentrated in a much smaller cleat? Granted, this is a bigger deal during sprints and races, where the force exerted is a lot higher, but I can't help but to question what that means for a long distance tour. That was pretty much the point I asked the question in the first place. And evidently, the response is mixed.

SPDs work for long distance rides and long distance touring.

What sort of touring are you talking about? Like ... going to Europe for 3 months or something like that?

Agreed. I'm moving this to Touring (from General).

--Juha, a forum Mod

Welcome to the wonderfull world of having an opinion on something Grant Peterson says in an article. You should read his stuff on touring in crocs.

My spd shoes are about five years old and have four or five thousand miles on them. They are the cheapish laceup shimanos. the pressure bearing area seems fine. I have toured in them, and done aggresive mountain biking with them, and more than a few centurys. For what its worth, I usualy ride and tour with toeclips. In the summer its sandals with toeclips for touring. Less than ten percent of my riding is done with clipless, maybe thats why my shoes have lasted so long.

yeah the response is mixed. Are you suprised? everyone here who can answer came to thier answers by different experiences, physiologys, and temperment.

Listening to a Nashbar rep telling you what to use on a long tour? Your better off going to a brick and mortor shop and talking to the resident carbon wonderbike weight weenie triatholon enthusiast. In my opinion someone telling you that touring in a three bolt pedal has probably never toured. Just to much hassle to stretch your legs or walk into a gas station to refill bottles, ect either taking your shoes off or clomping around on your heels. I can see it if you were doing a full on supported catered ride.

I have Look pedals and nice shoes, but once I discovered Shimano RT-82 Touring shoes I haven't gone back. The RT-82s paired with Crank Brothers Candy pedals are my preference.