springs

Thanks, very informative as usual for your posts!

For my part, I avoid simple/refined carbs but have no issues with complex carbs. Seems to work for me as a pesco-vegan.

I agree with Fat Boy that total HDL is not so interesting. I was looking for HDL and LDL.

Rollfast

I'm gonna have to get a copy of my bloodwork last month and check it over...I AM diabetic and my A1C was 10.3 and up a good bit...I've been a hermit in here for all the de-cluttering I've been at since the hospitalization in July 2012 and at it mostly alone. I was informed by my alarmed FNP that my Vitamin D level was about a quarter of where is should be and she started me on a 50,000 i.u. dose, 1 pill a week and I decided to just BUY that gallon of Vitamin D milk 1-2 times a week for as long as I could afford it every month (and as long as it doesn't go to $7 a gallon like the news keeps harping about I will continue to chug it down over 1-2 days and just adjust the insulin...you have to balance something I guess).

I am the grandchild of dairy farmers and while Grandpa had kidney problems and died in the late seventies my Grandma lived to be 94 and passed last March. Her parents had over 80 and 90+ years of life as well. I know that no dairy bill is no good and that while it's hard to buy milk under $3/gallon $7 is not any help to farmers at ALL. Nobody will accept this and perhaps some elected officials we have now should be forced to live on $700 a month and food stamps as a lesson in humility and a dose of reality...that though is OT here and I'll end that train of thought. The point is that I'm embarrasssed to have to live like I have to sometimes when I have generations of dirt, cattle and dairy farming families on both sides of my family tree and I know what good food is and still have trouble gettiing there from here.

Fat Boy

I'm not sure what to say to you, but you _have_ to get your blood sugar under control. It _will_ kill you. If anyone needs to be low-carb, it's you. Your A1c is twice normal. Get away from carbs in general and grains in particular. 'Healthy whole grains' are not anything of the sort. Eat a lot of fat. Eat a bit of protein. Keep your carbs to less than 25 grams a day. You'll have to get rid of the milk. If you need Vit D, it's probably one of the cheaper vitamins to buy. $10 will buy you a year's worth. If you feel like you have to have some dairy, then stick to full fat cheese, cream and pastured butter/ghee.

Look, I think this type of diet is a good health direction for most people, but for you, it's your only chance. You can't just shoot insulin and hope for the best. You say you know 'what good food is'. Well, it's time to prove it.

It takes about 6 weeks to get a reliable A1c reading. Take 6 weeks and give it a genuine shot. Keep your vegetables to green, leafy type things and use them basically as carriers of butter or cream. Eat some protein. Depending on your size, maybe up to 100 grams/day. Eat all the fat you want. Coconut oil, red palm oil, avocado, olive oil, nuts (macadamia & walnuts are good choices) are all fair game. Eat plenty of eggs and bacon. Don't shy away from sausage, hard salami or bacon. No grains, legumes, starchy vegetables or milk. If you _have_ to have fruit, keep it to berries, peaches, nectarines, and maybe a little melon. At the end of 6 weeks, report back and let us know how you feel and what your A1c is. It will be improved, I promise you. At first, you might not know what the hell to eat, you'll figure it out. You might not feel all that great in the 1-2 week time frame. By the time you're a month into it, you'll be feeling better than you do now.

Honestly, you are metabolically broken and need help. This will help you.

Fat Boy

About 1/3 of the fat in our body is saturated. 'Bad' fat is fat that has been oxidated and that's much more likely to happen on an unsaturated fat.

Machka 

Ah ... so your cholesterol is high then.

The limit here in Australia just dropped to 5. Doctors would like everyone to be below 5.
And your bad cholesterol should be below 2.0. So yours is quite high.

If Doctors here saw numbers like yours, they would drop a suggestion of a lifestyle change or the use of drugs to get it under 5.

I know because my total cholesterol is 5.4 and my LDL is exactly the same as yours at 3.2 ... and my Dr suggested a lifestyle change to me. She told me to cut the fat and refined sugars.



Incidentally, you might want to get checked periodically for colon cancer. Just in case ...

And how's your iron?


I could not eat the diet you're eating for several reasons. To name a few ...

1) Meat tastes bad, smells bad, and has an unappetising texture. My personal preferences.

2) My gallbladder would give me no end of grief. A plate of scrambled eggs can provide me with a night of agony ... add all the rest of that fat, and I'd probably be hospitalised.

3) My iron levels are at the high end of normal according to my most recent blood work. Sometimes my blood work shows iron levels into the high range. If I were to eat that much high-iron food, I'd start showing symptoms of Hemochromatosis.


I'll stick to my low-meat, low fat diet ... happier and healthier Machka.

Machka 

I had to ask the Dr to repeat the results of the angiogram and echocardiogram about 3 times. I could hardly believe what I was hearing. But he had the results of my previous tests in hand to compare, and said that something had improved ... that my valves were closing almost normally now, within normal ranges. Who would have thought!!

I've started drinking Rooibos tea just recently, and really like it ... I'll have a cup or two of mandarin green tea one day and Rooibos tea the next.

GeorgeBMac

Sometimes the GOOD news is the hardest for us to believe!

I experienced a similar reaction when the cardiologist told me that he saw no heart disease in me. After my father and his father both passed away at a very young age, I had assumed that I would follow in the family tradition... When he told me that would probably not happen, I was in shock...

So, now, darn-it, I have to plan for my old age. What a pain! Diet, exercise, stress management, musculo-skeletal conditioning... It's so much darn work! But, I guess, better than the alternative... As a nurse I have seen too many older people reach that point of 'no return' where they are so deconditioned, debilitated, demented, fat and stiff that all they can do is sit there while they slowly rot away and wait to die. Dying doesn't scare me. But slowly rotting away like that is my worst nightmare.

So, now I'll be eating my oatmeal and doing my core strength exercises each morning and follow that with some meditation and a bike ride (although right now it's 25 degrees and icy -- so the bike ride may turn into a treadmill).

Again, Congratulations on your great results!
... I wish you not just a long life, but a healthy one filled with many happy miles and smiles....

GeorgeBMac

Like FatBoy, I would also urge you to get the sugar levels under control because, like he said, it will kill you. But I might add: it will kill you slowly, piece by piece. It's not the way most people would like to go...

There are a number of ways you can do that: Some say that the low/no carb approach that throws your body into a ketogenic state of burning only fat and protein can bring sugar levels down -- and they have shown some good results.

Others have had equally good results with the opposite approach of a whole food plant based diet that eliminates all animal products, extra fat and refined carbs and added sugars...

Or, the diabetic association recommends a balanced approach where every meal contains a balance of carbs, vege's and protein.

And, of course, medication can help bring down those levels -- and regular aerobic exercise can do the same.

But the key is to MANAGE the sugar levels so they stay consistently in a lower range than yours are now. I sympathize with your current financial condition. But a low income does not preclude a healthy diet -- and, in fact, a whole food / real food healthy diet can be cheaper than the typical American diet of prepackaged, processed foods...

But you will probably need help and support to do all of that. If you have insurance, they (or your doctor) can refer you to support programs and nutritionists who will help you find a way to live a healthier life that works for YOU.

Best of luck to you!

Sixty Fiver

Actually... my cholesterol is normal according to Canadian Guidelines and is actually considered ideal to excellent as I am not in a high risk group.

For this to be a problem one would have to subscribe to the un-supported lipid hypothesis that has created this whole debate in the first place.... it is the companies that have been raking in billions of dollars that would like everyone to be on them.

Even for subscribers to that theory...

My LDL is a little higher than it was in the past but I am nearly 50 years old and do have outstanding cardio function, no blood sugar issues and very low Tri glyceride readings. My weight has remained relatively stable for my entire adult life and I have a low BMI. The only thing that has caused me to gain bad weight have been periods where health issues have sidelined me and upon resuming normal activities that has gone away and I have never had to diet.

After having full blood panels there is also no sign that I have any thyroid or liver issues... all those numbers are within good norms.

Haemochromatosis is for the most part, an inherited disease.

My doctor says I am awesome and should just carry on.

phoebeisis

The problem with the low carb diets-but relatively high in vegetables -some fruit-fair amount of meat-eggs-dairy.
THEY ARE EXPENSIVE.
Low carb means-higher in protein-always expensive-higher in fats(expensive in palatable form-can't just drink peanut oil- palatable fats usually come attached to expensive proteins-or attached to carbs)
Rollfast is in a bind-short of $$-but needs to lower his glucose.
We were in a similar position for several years.

Rollfast-what did your MD suggest.Whatever your diet is-and meds are-obviously they don't work.
With your glucose(10% means your average glucose is 220 or so) 3-4 u R or N insulin before meals-no big deal.Cheapest strategy-add insulin to the metformin(guessing).
See what your MD has to say.Explain your $$ situation to him-
Milk-whole milk or 2%-probably most bang for $$ nutrition wise-high quality protein-fat really not much of a concern-fair amount of carbs
You grandparents were producing a healthy food-milk cheese etc.
R or N insulin-walmart $30 1000 units-100 days worth 100 syringes-$20(many folks short of $$ reuse-put alcohol in needle caps)-test strips-ebay $20 per hundred-use 2-3 day-adding insulin and test strips-might add $1.50/d
Ask your MD- insulin usually doesn't require a prescription-current treatment is ineffective.
PS-canned tomatoes-relatively inexpensive somewhat nutritious food-other canned stuff-bargains too.Milk- bargain also
Your MD might suggest seeing a dietician -which won't help much unless the dietician gives you another $300/mo.

Carbonfiberboy 

You can google "diabetic nutritional guidelines" to get current recommendations. Exercise seems to be extremely important for diabetics. I ride with two Type 1 diabetics. They are both mid-50s, very strong riders in excellent health. They ride a lot. They eat about the same thing as the rest of us, i.e. normal amounts of carbs, fat, and protein. They eat stuff like Clif bars on the bike. They keep very close track of their blood sugar and work very hard to keep it steady. When the group stops for a clothing change, snack, or regroup, they're always doing a finger prick. They are both quite slim.

elcruxio

The real challenge is doing the fingerprick whilst riding

But on a serious note type 1 and type 2 are different with treatment regimes. But especially for type 2 exercise is extremely important. Higher intensities give better results on lessening the insulin resistance so regular HIIT training would be very beneficial.

I can get my fasting BG from bad to perfect with just one set of HIIT. Low intensity does not have the same effect for me

GeorgeBMac

As for expensive, that depends... High quality meat AND produce are both expensive. But there are lower cost versions of each (usually) available -- at least in major metro areas... And, for the protein, it doesn't matter if comes from a steak or a hamburger, it's still protein. The difference is in the amount of fat - but the Atkins style doesn't usually worry about that too much.

And, I would say that whether or not the dietician can help depends on both the client AND the dietician. All clients and all dieticians have biases, so one may not work while the next can work miracles... But, with such an elevated A1C, it sounds like a dietician would be probably helpful to this client -- if nothing else to help him find affordable choices that won't kill him.

Sixty Fiver

I have issues with factory farmed eggs... they make me feel ill while range fed eggs don't bother me.

This is probably due to the higher Omega 3's in the range fed eggs while factory farmed eggs are very high in Omega 6's.

Unrefined coconut oil, cold pressed extra virgin olive oil, and avocado (high in fat) would add some healthy fats to your diet and could help address the gall bladder issues... you seem to think that fats = evil.

High fat and low carb are not mutually exclusive and there are vegetarians and vegans who practice this after they realized the healthy whole grains were not that good for them.

We probably eat less meat than many people here... we keep portion sizes smaller and much the fats come from those unrefined oils.

Fat Boy

If cost is the ultimate concern, then dying young is by far the cheapest alternative.

If you want to eat well (regardless of how you define that), then you can do it on a reasonable budget. It's all about personal responsibility. If you make the effort, you can make it happen. If you don't, it won't.

If you want cheap meats, then go to an ethnic market. They will almost always have less expensive cuts for $2-3/#. The 99 cent store close to me actually has a reasonable selection of produce. It's not organic, of course, but it's a hell of a lot better choice than Coco Puffs and Yoohoo. Go to the farmer's market, even in Southern California I can get 20 big farmyard eggs for $7. The vegetables I can get from the farmer's market are _really_ nice. If you go there around closing time, you can often bargain with the sellers and get them _cheap_.

Sixty Fiver

This is well worth watching...

.be

Fat Boy

I'm not sure I understand that first statement, but I would definitely agree that high fat - vegetarian is a viable alternative. You may need to add some sort of hemp or pea protein to the mix, but if that's what floats your boat, then you can do it. If you're willing/able to throw in some fish or eggs, then it becomes a pretty easy diet to maintain.

Myosmith

You can contain the costs of quality protein sources and produce by shopping carefully. A small chest type freezer is a good investment if you don't have much freezer space in your kitchen fridge. Flash frozen berries and vegetables are just as nutritious and possibly "fresher" than the fresh produce available. You can also buy in larger quantities as you don't have to worry about it spoiling within a few days. Same goes for frozen fish. Frozen tilapia is farm raised and no more expensive pound for pound than hamburger. At my local WallyWorld I can pick up frozen cod, flounder and even salmon for about the same cost as beef. Pork tenderloin is also a bargain as it has very little fat and is 100% edible meat, no bone or trimmings and very little shrinkage during cooking. Turkey is less expensive than chicken, especially at this time of year. Dark meat has a bit more fat but is flavorful and nutritious while still being lower in fat than many cuts of beef.

Eggs are a good source of protein and are reasonably priced, just watch how many yolks you eat.

Buying local, in-season produce at farmers markets as Fat Boy mentioned is another good way to keep costs down. If you have a freezer, you can buy a larger quantity and freeze what you can't use fresh.

Sixty Fiver

Many people seem to combine vegetarianism and a low fat diet so the only other fuel source becomes carbohydrates in whatever form they choose.

A friend of ours is a well balanced vegan and she was not able to maintain the kind of physical output her new job demanded on what was a lower fat, higher carb diet and she experienced weight fluctuations, and inconsistent energy through the day with mornings looking like a scene from The Walking Dead.

She has since started to practice a high fat, low carb vegan diet and her weight has stabilized, her energy and focus have never been this good, and she just kills it at work (she is a mail carrier)... the difference has been remarkable.

Fat Boy

Ah, OK. I didn't understand what you wrote. I completely agree.

phoebeisis

A good quality diet-is expensive.
Milk/cheese/eggs/ best bang for buck high bio value proteins-combined with OK fat ok carbs.
$4-$5 for 120 grams protein and roughly 2000 calories-
2 qts milk a day+ $2.50 1000 calories 60 grams high quality protein
Plus maybe oatmeal- 80 ounces maybe $8- 10 cents per ounce 100 calories per ounce-500 calories 50 cents
canned tomatoes .75 cents can
fruit in season
rice bread is cheap-maybe 10-20 cent per 100 calories
Take a vitamin mineral tablet 10 cents per day.

fresh vegetables fruit expensive-maybe as much as $1 per 100 calories-bananas cheapest-but they spike glucose.
Beef is fine $3-$4 maybe 60 grams protein-800 calories
Tricky when short of funds

Most importantly-folks DON'T change their life long eating habits very readily-just doesn't happen-no matter what the dietician says-
quicker solution-real world-insulin- 10% pretty high-he needs a quick cheap solution that he will actually implement until he develops different eating habits

Sixty Fiver

Tilapia is delicious but most factory farmed Tilapia contain too much Omega 6's... most fish that are farmed suffer from quality degradation because of the less than natural foods they are fed and because high growth rates are desirable.

Wild caught is best.

wolfchild

No need to worry about egg yolks. The yolk is the most nutritious and best tasting part of the egg. Whole eggs are perfect food and there is no need to split them in half and throw the good part away, just eat the whole thing.

wolfchild

I eat smoked mackerels ,herrings and sardines for my omega 3's. Wild salmon is just too expensive and I avoid eating farmed salmon, modern fish farming is a nasty dirty business.

Fat Boy

Since we're playing show-and-tell with blood lipid panels, here are mine from a October. (in US measurements)

Total Cholesterol - 202
HDL - 88
LDL - 102
Triglycerides - 50
HbA1c - 5.4
Fasting Blood Glucose - 82

The low density particle size is primarily of the 'A' pattern, which is large/buoyant.

Now to decipher. The total cholesterol number is over the 'normal' range by 1%. Now if you've read what I've previously written, then you know that I don't really care about this number being any lower, and I feel there is a reasonably good argument for it to be higher. The HDL and LDL numbers themselves are good. If the LDL particles were the small type B, then that number would be too high (but still not out of 'normal' range). Triglycerides are right where I want them. The HbA1c is actually higher than what I would like (although, again, 'normal'). I've done some digging around on this, though, and if you eat a high fat diet/low carb, then your red blood cells tend to last longer than on a more conventional diet, so that number is a little less accurate than we would maybe like. It also might hint that I have some carbohydrate intolerance lingering around in there someplace. The fasting blood glucose of 82 is good.

So take this for what it is, a single, anecdotal data point. Since it was brought up and I have recent numbers, though, I figured why not post them. If anything it shows that this type of diet is not driving my blood lipid profile to some crazy place.