I am just now getting into power (would have done it earlier had I realized how powerful this can be-no pun intended). Right now I am using Golden Cheetah for general data analysis purposes. I'm not even sure right now what data I am going to be most interested in over the long term. I tend to be analytical, FWIW.

I also just signed up for the free version of TrainingPeaks, but assume that if this were my choice some version(s) of paid upgrades would be proper for me.

For those of you who have used both, what are your observations (beyond the obvious price thing) about the two. FWIW, I much prefer software that runs on my (Windows 7) laptop vs. web-based applications. Haven't gotten far enough into TP to even know for sure, but I assume that this puts me into the WKO world. Not sure if I also would have to go 'Upgrade' on top of that or not.

Would be interested in anyone's observations here - thanks.

dave

Try the Racing forum.

Thanks for the suggestion. If that is the 'right place' then that seems odd to me. But long ago I learned not to ignore your typically useful input. Thx.

dave

Yeah the racer forum is the right place because that's where most of the people training with power hang out. For most non-racers, a powermeter is overkill.

Here's a thread to look at:
https://www.bikeforums.net/33-road-bi...ents-here.html

Personally I use both WKO+ and TrainingPeaks (paid version), WKO+ is better for detailed file analysis and comparing files (multi-file analysis) and T.P. is better because it includes the GPS/mapping component, and (more importantly) is how my coach reviews my files and delivers my training plan.

I tried G.C. for a minute before i bought WKO+, but since I had already read the A&C book and was familiar with their terminology, I opted for WKO+ since it uses all the same terms.

I think there are a bunch of options out there now - I saw CyclingAnalytics for a few minutes the other day and that looked good. There is also some free thing from PowerTap - PowerAgent.

Most important thing for the power analysis - read the Allen & Coggan book, and have a power-based training plan - that you either build yourself or get from a coach. A plan is how you take the analysis and turn it into results.

valygrl, thanks for the helpful response. I have refrained from posting in one of the racing forums because I feel like I don't belong there. But maybe that is the right place to go for additional information.

dave

ps. There is one additional and very significant value to 'power analysis' in my case. And that is motivation. When indoor riding is all that is available, power data gives me information that indicates improvement (or lack thereof) which will, in my case, get me in the saddle much more often than would be the case otherwise. I'm not saying that the proper plan is not important, but for me there is something else WRT power that is at least equally important.

Here is my status at this point.

This would seem to be associated with the fact that I (recently) ran Golden Cheetah as a Full Screen app. At this point when I start GC I completely loose control of my desktop. There is no 'X' to close GC. There is no Toolbar. ESC does nothing. I can start Task Manager but no controls supplied by TM are helpful. HOWEVER, when I start TM I do get some of my Taskbar back. I can 'right click' on GC (on the Taskbar) and ONE THING that I can do is to close the program.

This problem is so richly covered (per a typical Google search) that I have no idea what to think other than it obviously is not a simple problem. So GC is now, from my perspective, a secondary thing that I might reconsider down the road. This is Open Source stuff and such is the nature of this kind of software, but GC goes way down on my list at this point. I might come back ...

From what I can tell from TrainingPeaks the full capability that they offer requires that you both sign up for premium services WRT their Web-based offerings and that you buy WKO which, from all that I can see, has not been updated since 2010. See the previous paragraph for my reaction to that.

Lots of other options, from what I can tell.

dave

In case anyone doing general Golden Cheetah research stumbles into this thread ....

I seemed to be stuck in a 'more than full screen mode' that,typically, you can back out of via the ESC (escape) key. It didn't work in my case. Interestingly uninstalling (via Win7 uninstall) and reinstalling Golden Cheetah also did not work. Possibly using the Golden Cheetah uninstall process would have done the job, but another answer/resolution is that key PF key PF11 toggles fullscreen on and off. And this will resolve the problem (at least in my case).

FYI.

dave

For GC problems google groups is a good resource. https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!...-cheetah-users


i think GC does a pretty good job of adding new features and it's been very stable for the last couple of years.

Thanks, Greg. I had somehow missed that.

dave

I use TrainingPeaks Premium and highly recommend it. Works great. I am a slave to the Performance Manager chart. I don't have power, but I can easily see improvement or lack thereof on my resistance rollers. IME the single most important thing one can do vis a vis training is to modulate the training impulse. Almost doesn't matter what else you do as long as you can precisely control your training dose and hold it somewhere near, but not over, your capacity to absorb same, from day to day, week to week, month to month, and year to year. I use both the PM chart and my morning resting and standing HRs to accomplish this.

I've been on wko fro a while and never really used the advanced features. Recently I began to dable with golden cheetah but have found the different terminology a bit confusing at times.

I love the feature in golden cheetah and the kickr control coming out is something i'm really interested in.

I've had issue with downloading data to GC form training peaks though(premium trial) it seems to be hit or miss and I have data as far back as 2010 I'd like to have in GC

I'm going to keep working with all 3 and try and find my happy place

DaveLeeNC....

I use all of the following and have for years, so I consider myself skilled using data packages.

TrainingPeaks
GoldenCheetah
Garmin Connect
Strava
RidewithGPS
MapMyRide
PerformanceProStudio & Analyzer
TrainerRoad

I'm going to focus on 3 of these and keep it simple.

Training Peaks is far more powerful than Golden Cheetah...especially if you like to look at graphs of data. You can knock yourself out looking at data displayed graphically. And Training Peaks can accumulate data for you above and outside of cycling. I track weight, sleep, overall feeling, etc. in Training Peaks as well as other things. I use the internet based application. and I don't have to worry about losing data.

Golden Cheetah is also a powerful data tool, but not as much so as Training Peaks. But it's free. It will do more than you need, but not quite as easily and intuitively as Training Peaks does. It is a local software, meaning if you don't have it backed up, your data is gone. But, frankly, if I had to give up one of these two, I would give up Training Peaks. I like Golden Cheetah, and like I said, it is free and will do more than you will ever understand. Training Peaks is not free.

In my mind, the most important piece of data you can use in training is the Performance Manager Chart. Both of these do this. The PMC shows your fatigue level, both acutely and chronically, and it shows your rest level. So you can use it to show your overall fitness as it grows, then use it to show you how to taper your workouts for the best ride on any given day....like an upcoming race.

Performance Pro Studio with Analyzer is a fantastic piece of indoor training software and a data analysis tool. Trainer Road is good for indoor training and is simpler to use, but there's no comparison when it comes to data. I am amazed every day how much I can do with Performance Pro. You buy it once and you are done. It is a local copy, but you can send data to their website and your email for safekeeping. Trainer Road is not about data other than the simplest stuff. More user friendly, but, again, no comparison. PerfPro is a whole another level of indoor training. Fantastic stuff. You can create your own workouts in both. You don't have to own a power meter to use these, but you can. If you don't have one, it uses virtual power from a speed sensor and a vendor supplied power curve. It's not perfect, but it's great for training in that it's consistent. And you can design your own workouts if you choose, which I do. Both have a library of workouts and available videos otherwise. TrainerRoad will cost you $10/month. PerfPro is a one time purchase of $99 for a single user. Videos, like Sufferfest, have to be purchased for both. TrainerRoad displays a graph of power vs heartrate vs cadence as you ride. PerfPro will display more than your screen can handle. You customize it.

The other pieces I listed have their place, but these 3 stand out in a crowd.

I hope this helps.

I am far from any type of racer, but have been training with power for 4 years now and use TP, STrava, Garmin, and WKO.

Honestly for what I do, strava premium works fine. I can track my power over segments, entire rides etc. They have a version of the performance chart thats good enough in my mind for average cyclist just trying to improve.

That being said I still keep my training peaks premium account. I track my weight, fat percentage and of course workouts and rides there.

I rarely use WKO anymore.

Thanks for the additional comments - VERY helpful.

dave