Polartec® Power Shield™ Soft Shell Jacket
 

Anybody got one of these yet? Im looking at them pretty hard,i think it would be better than a rain/wind shell,i think it would breathe better.Wat do you all think????

I don't know about the shell but I've had great results with polartech as a material. Have they made it waterproof now?

This stuff is98%wind proof and i think its also pretty water proof,the thing with this is the breathability,a rain shell/goretex/activent/etc is, you usually get a rairforest build up on the inside,this power shield breathes better..so if your not in a complete down pour it might be better? still looking and checking it out!

I've been riding with PolarShield jacket and Schoeller fabric pants (REI Mistral) for about a month now. Over 45F, it's too warm, but it's great from 45F down to 4F (-9 windchill) so far. A silkweight base layer top underneath for down to 15F, and add a layer of Merino top and bottoms below that. YMMV.

As for water and wind resistance, it is wind resistent enough that I was comfortable in 20mph headwinds at -9 windchill (wish I could say the same about my fingers), and was dryer in 30F light rain than with my "breathable" raingear. This stuff has the best cold weather comfort range of any piece of clothing I own. Mine smells like "me", so I know its moving sweat. It doesn't get stinky, but my wife can identify it as mine.

A friend of mine has the North Face Apex jacket in identical conditions, and is happy with it, so I believe it's the fabric vs. the specific jacket. I have nothing bad to say about the REI Mistral stuff, just great stuff.

Call Lou at www.Foxwear.net.

He can make anything out of the stuff. He made me a pair of tights out of powershield that are wonderful. They are my greatest winter find.

Polartech makes powerdry which is my favorite base material, but powershield is a membrane style softshell, so it is something i would never consider buying. How you'll like it largely depends on the climate your gonna ride in.

I'm unfamiliar with Ohio's winter so not sure what your looking for, but if its not a wet winter, then yes a softshell is much better than a hardhsell. But powershield basically is the exact same material as say goretex, but without the waterproof coating applied. Its the same basic expanded plastic membrane, which is why they block wind so well. Its also why membrane style softshells dont breathe enough for cycling. As the above poster mentions, great for 45 and below, too hot for anything above.

If you have a cold and windy climate, then the lack of breathability wont be noticed much and in fact the sauna effect makes it a nice warm jacket to wear. In the pacific northwest, or anywhere on the west coast, it would typically be too hot due to the lack of breathing.

Why tights instead of pants? any reason? what about a jacket made of power shield, I know Lou can make about anything? Do you notice any better breathing of the tights?thanks

My "tights" are a cross between pants and tights. They are not tight. YOu could comfortably wear them into a store etc. and not feel self conscious. He does make some "pants" as well if you so desire. But i like my cycling stuff fitted pretty much, for the same reason that most cycling stuff is fitted. It just performs better.

My Powershield tights really are incredible. I wear them alone down to 20 F and then add a pair of lightweight winter tights underneath for temps below that. They too warm for anything over freezing for me.

This site is a couple years old now, but had a very good review of materials on one page, and softshell jackets on page 2. Most of the softshell jackets are still available.

http://www.climbing.com/print/equipment/softshells219/

Depends on what you need. For cycling applications, ideally, you'd need someting wind proof or with significant wind blocking on the front panels, and much more breathable on the back panels. I have a high loft powershield jacket, an ibex pingo polyester/wool softshell, traditional shell/fleece, and a cycling specific jacket from canari that can be transformed into a mesh backed vest.

The powershield is great for something like lift-served skiing, but simply too hot for cycling, even in something like a Chicago winter. That'd still be true in lighter versions of that fabric. The ibex is great in most conditions in something like a bay area winter or midwest fall, but again - probably not quite right, for cycling. Neither is all that useful in real rain. If I had to choose just one outerwear solution, I'd have a heavy marino wool sweater and a lightweight shell with lots of vents - that combination is versatile enough for walking around town and cycling down to about freezing, maybe a little less.

The canari jacket, along with a longsleeve base layer, is my choice if I'm cycling hard in near freezing temps, add a wool sweater if it's colder. Pack a down vest or lightweight primaloft jacket for when you're off the bike and you'd be good to go in almost anything except for hard rain.

I have an Apex Bionic (AKA, Apex 2) and it is a very nice piece. It is comfy and warm, although at times when the temperature is a bit warmer out, I don't think the jacket breaths as well as I would like. I usually have to unzip some pockets, and then I'm fine. For winter riding it works great, except I prefer the better neck protection of a hard shell from the elements. They usually have a higher collar with a hood that forms a nice area around my neck.

Still I would recommend it, and the price is right on the Apex Jacket


True, but depending on the design and intended riding environment, you may really have to crank out the watts to keep warm, as all the body heat will dissipate out the back.

I have a Sugoi Team Radius Jacket that is exactly like that. I love that jacket, but it feels very cold when you start and if you stop. The breathable back and back of the arms really ventilates the body heat away. It was designed for very high aerobic intensity... I have used it to -9C, but I really had to keep my effort above 28km/h for the 100 km ride. There was a point when we were riding at about 24km/h and I felt very cold. It is more designed for late Spring, early Fall.

I'm the Apex Bionic user, as legot73 refers to. I am quite happy with this jacket. It's not Powershield material, but rather a North Face proprietary material called Apex Universal Weatherblock that is very similar. For me, it works great and cuts the wind well - which was my primary concern. I usually tend to dress 1/2 layer warmer than most other cyclists (I prefer to be mostly warm when I start and don't mind being a little sweaty once I get to work), and this jacket kep me warm at 5F(-4 windchill) with a microfleece mid layer and a midweight merino base layer. Other good cycling points: long length sleeves with velcro closers, a drawstring at the waist and a high collar. Overall I am quite pleased with the jacket and you can often find it for about $99 on sale.

I have a PowerShield jacket from REI that I used last winter for commuting. It was wind proof and very water resistant but also did not breath real well. I found that with any temps above freezing it would become a sauna inside the jacket for myself. I do ride hard and sweat a significant amount so you may have better luck.
It still breaths much better than my cheap windproof jacket or most rain gear. It is also great as a top layer combined with a modest base layer for temps from freezing to the low teens. I'm sure you could layer for cycling in colder temps but I havn't had much of a chance to test it. Over all for cycling I would go with a more breathable jacket like an Ibex for winter and a more water proof jacket for rain. I can see why the jacket is well liked for hiking as it would be a good use for it.
Craig

That's why I like the zip out back panel on my Canari. Low levels of venting when I want to stay warm, Much higher levels when I needed to cool off.

In truth, through Chicago winters, I went with the shell and sweater, but my commute wasn't very long. Had it been much longer, I would have personally went with feeling cold at the beginning in favor of the more breathable options, but that's me. I'd still pack extra layers, just in case.

The point that I'm trying to get across is that the original poster will probably be better off with several layers instead of going with the single layer softshell. Yeah, they work great in most conditions, but at the extremes, they don't work very well, and cycling as an activity happens to spend more time in those extremes than not. YMMV.

I'm with you, I prefer lots of thin layers and a hard shell to one thicker soft shell. But then again it depends on what I'm doing, and the temperatures outside, however that is my primary modus operandi too.


:beer:

I prefer lots of thin layers and then a thin highly breathable softshell :)

Highly breathable? I have a Polartech 300 wt TNF Denali, that's like a screen door in a breeze :lol:


I find because of the tighter fit concept of most modern softshells, they can start to feel a bit restrictive with lots of thin layers. And I would still have to pack along a hard shell in case it got ugly, or I broke down. If I'm wearing a hard shell and lots of thin layers, I have reduced the bulky softshell layer, and I have a wider operating range. However that is just my environment and preferences, your mileage may vary :)

Ive never heard anyone consider a fleece jacket a softshell before. Then again the term softshell is not very well defined in the industry. Most softshells do a lot better at blocking wind than fleece.

Hardshells work ok in cold temps, since the cold offsets the sauna effect that hardshells create due to their lack of breathability. In the west, wearing a harshell means you have to wear minimal thin layers underneath in order to not sweat to death. Especially with a drw coated hardshell like goretex. And then if you have to stop to fix a flat, you freeze since your no longer generating the same heat.

In west coast climates wearing a softshell allows one to have a much wider range of temps, similar to wools benefits. Here we can wear a softshell and one or 2 thin layers and be comfortable on the ride or if we have to fix a flat.

Cold temps like the prairies or east coast do allow the pitfalls of hardshells to diminish enough to be useable . And yes, they are a lot lighter than a softshell :D

It's not really, I was just being funny about the old Fleece jackets :lol: The 300 wt is warm as hell with no wind, but very breathable. As soon as the wind kicks up though it's like a screen door.

As per the Softshell debate, I'm not 100% sold on them as the be all end all jacket... They are nice, and they have their place, but they do seem to have trade offs as well, such as snugger fit, less protection around the neck, heavier feel, less packable, still have to pack a hard shell, wet suit neoprene feel... But that is just me and my preferences.

Downhill skiing is a perfect example of the situation you describe. You sweat like a bugger skiing down, then sit statically on a chair lift for the ride up. I have used a Hard Shell (GoreTex) for many years of skiing like this with out many issues, and still prefer it. I skied with just my soft shell (Patagonia), and felt very naked at times with just this (add the fact I could not layer as thick due to the snugger designed fit), especially on exposed chair lifts, so much so I had to put a shell on top to feel comfortable again. Again, that's just me... Basically for me, the Soft shell has replaced inner fleeces, however I still carry and use a hard shell the most. I suppose I am just a fossil :lol:

Softshell, you know i have a 300wt jacket that feels more comphy than any thing ive tried, as long as i put a windbloc vest on under it its great,lots of flexability,i have pockets in the vest for handwarmers to fit in front and back and my core stay's plenty warm and the pit zips regulate it just fine, no rain forest effect at all,if the weather gets real bad, i slip on a hard shell that i always carry on the rack...im pretty satified with the fix! joe

That's the big thing... If it works for you, it doesn't matter what anybody says should work when, where and how :)

My 300wt is a TNF Denali which has the nylon on the upper portion, and does provide some wind blocking, it is one of my favorite bash and crash jackets, and as you say, can be very comfortable depending on the situations. It also has pit zips, however I don't think they are really needed when worn on it's own, more for match up use when under a shell with the pits unzipped. Sounds like your windblocking vest is a good idea, I like it!

I would seldom venture anywhere with out a hard shell in my pack, or on my back... I must be oldschool :lol:

300 weight fleece and hardshells is like, so totally 80's!

Polartec Powershield is a NON-laminate, Jaerery, but it relies on the glue that bonds the fleece to the shell fabric to provide both the wind resistance and some of the weather proofing. it's glued in 'channels' togther, strips of glue and no glue....pretty cobbed construction in my opinion, and the glue ******* breathability versus the simpler bicomponent knit softshell fabrics.

Schoeller's bicomponent knits really comes into their own for bicyclists when used as winter cycling pants. Layer appropriately, and wear a wind brief if its going to be really chilly.

Both still works for me, even though I have a closet full of new stuff. They just keep getting better with age. :p

dude, i'm real happy for you. Delirious and hilarious to hear someone that uses a TNF Denali jacket go and complain about the 'packability' of their jacket systems. ( looking for suitable floor for rolling on and laughing)

what do you do when you think you might have to take it off, bring a BOB trailer to haul the bulk of the Denali jacket around?

I happen to have a Denali, and no I don't backpack it, however under a shell it's good to below -40C. I bought it in the early 90's when fleece was part of the new jacket systems. I bought it because it was burly and I was looking for something like that. I have used it on its own to work on cars, cut wood in the winter, shovel snow, or wear it out to the farm....

I'm glad I have it in my closet to throw on when ever I need it. Like I said, it's a great crash and bash jacket that is handy to have. I wear it hard, and can't seem to wear it out, as such I guess I'm stuck with it for a while. Should I throw it away because it's not in outdoor fashion vogue anymore?


You seem like an intelligent guy, yet your posts all have the tone of a 9 year old Bully in a playground where others don't always agree with you.

Windbloc vest/with inside pockets
 

Man does this work for me,i droped two hand warmers in the front inside pockets this morning and did a 21 miler in 26degrees,had a light polartec top on over that and a thin base t shrit,it worked great,the thing is to dress as close to summer as you can and stay warm, if you convience your brain that your core is warm it will let the blood flow to your hands and feet and keep them warm,but if it thinks for a second that your vital organs are in any danger, you had it,the system just uses the imformation you give it.(enjot the ride!)

don't get me wrong, viper,i'm real happy for you, but you're not exactly offering up vanguard advice about layering if you're still stuck in your Denali fleece and a goretex shell. That layering system is so totally 80's!

a Denali jacket packs up (if you decide you don't need to wear it under your GORETEX body condom) about the size of a pony keg. not to mention the limitations of wearing a bulky fleece jacket and a waterproof for aerobic sports. you see a lot of cross country and backcountry skiers in denali fleece and goretex. Wait, let me take that back, you see lots of greenhorn cross country and backcountry skiers in denali jackets and goretex.

how you can go about recommending this system is insulting enough to my backwoods sensibilities to call you on it. sorry. You keep pimping the fleece and the gore-tex for active sports, and i will keep disagreeing with you.

-looking at the malden mills powershield diagram, i see they have added a membrane to powershield. early versions of that fabric relied soley on thre laminating glue for windproofness, now it is glue AND membrane.- i'm not sure on how elaborate this construction is, the glue could BE the 'membrane' they illustrate.....

Powershield. some outdoor enthusiasts love it, some think it isn't breathable enough. I see lots of happy wearers on Mount Rainier foregoing their hard shells while wearing Powershield jackets.

The absolute brilliance of the appropriate softshell jacket is greater user comfort while letting the wearer forego a hardshell in 75-85 percent of weather conditions.

Just because I own and still use a Denali doesn't mean I don't own and use the new soft shells as well. Even though I own 3 new soft shells, the Denali still works and still has it place in my closet for when ever I need it.

I layer with the soft shells as well, is that vanguard enough?


Read how I mainly use it in my previous post. I have said, I ski and bike in my new soft shells, however I'll still pack along a hard shell, because that's call being prepared. You should know that....


I think what's really insulting you, is you have this wealth of back country knowledge, that for the most part is "Vanguard Thinking", yet there are still legions of people that are willing to stand up and say, new tech is all fine and dandy, but is not really required to play outside, the old stuff can work just as well too. Even from old "green horns" like myself, that owns all the new stuff, but can still embrace the old stuff too. To me one of the marks of good outdoor equipment is how long it remains useful.


Graham Hoyland Climbed Everest with old stuff, not requiring "Vanguard Thinking"

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/image...ndmht_203_.jpg


There are many ways to dress for the outdoors, people do this differently, and you really should understand this, in spite of what you or I think. I don't pimp just fleece and Goretex, I just say what works for me be it fleece, Goretex, uncoated nylon, polyester.... etc.


I think when it comes down to it, your continual barbs at me is because you think you know it all, and it pisses you off that somebody else can be comfortable sitting on a pumpkin, when you say we need loungers to comfortable. That, and You have been shown equally effective alternatives, and been proved wrong on a few issues we have debated now....


Again, I own and use new softshells, but I'll always pack along a hard shell. On a ski trip in Banff, I was wearing just a softshell for Skiing (Patagonia Figure 4). I was way too exposed feeling with this jacket, I had to put a hard shell on top to be comfortable. I skied the whole day afterward in comfort. If this does not suit your "Vanguard Thinking" then so be it, I'd rather be comfortable and warm, than cold and miserable because you tell me I should dress a certain way to be "Vanguard" :lol:

I ride to work everyday in -30C, there is no way I'm wearing just a softshell, no matter what you tell me... That's just too cold for my likings.


I have XC skied in soft shells, however I'll ski more with just 2 layers of thinner fleece, and a polypro base layer. I find XC Skiing with in the softshell is just too warm and restrictive feeling. For this the hard shell works as a better alternative, because it packs small enough to fit in a fanny pack, rather than one of my hard shell jackets. It's nice to have to throw on when I stop for a break or lunch.

I just finished a 35 mile ride wearing foxwear base layer t-shirt, a foxwear EVAP lite jacket, and foxwear tights over my bibs. The jacket and tights are the relatively new polartec material that is blocks wind and repels water, but also is claimed to breathe. The weather started in the mid 40s, overcast, misty, and with a 10-15 mph wind. It ended two hours later in the mid 50s, still overcast and windy. I was plenty warm in the 40s, and found myself unzipping the jacket 2/3 way down by the time the ride finished. But it was not at all a steam bath. Lou at foxwear makes the jackets with different polartec fabric under the arms and on the back panel, and most of the wicking happens in those areas.

So, to agree with an earlier post, this particular weight of jacket works well in the 40s, especially on cloudy days. I've worn the same combination in the high 30s, and was a bit chilly. I have a different weight jacket (also polartec by foxwear) that is warmer and use it on those days. So, I've been quite happy with the polartec in general and foxwear in particular, but I haven't tried the alternatives.

Lou's prices are extraordinarily reasonable, so you can try the material at a relatively low investment. (No connection to foxwear except being a satisfied customer.)