GovernorSilver

Interesting range of reactions:

This Is What Happened When Bicyclists Obeyed Traffic Laws Along The Wiggle Yesterday | The Snitch | San Francisco | San Francisco News and Events | SF Weekly

B. Carfree

Too funny. Nicely done.

Rich Gibson 

I've heard of the 'Idaho law' recently and it makes a lot of sense. Of course there will still be cyclist violators of such a law (you can't fix stupid) but it's worth trying.

Rich

intransit1217

bad comparison due mainly to population numbers. Also, did the bicyclists represent the normal number on any given day or was this pre planned for all to show up and clot a street.

CrankyOne

A friend doing some testing of Tesla's autonomous driving software had a similar experience. It can read signs like speed limit and stop as well as lights at intersections. He drove perfectly legally for a couple of weeks. Exactly the speed limit, coming to a complete stop at every stop sign, and coming to a complete stop before turning right on red. He received a constant barrage of finger and other communications.

GovernorSilver

I regularly ride through Old Town Alexandria on my morning commute ride. Stop signs are just about everywhere in Old Town. Seems like half the drivers I encounter on my morning route wave me through. It could be out of kindness, but more likely its because they know it takes a cyclist longer to accelerate from a dead stop than a motorist does.

I wonder what would happen if the City of Alexandria's Chief of Police decided to crack down on cyclists failing to stop at stop signs. Just the fact that half the motorists would wave us through would foil such a crackdown attempt.

I'm also wondering how narrow the streets are on the Wiggle. If all of us cyclists that commute through Old Town did that single file, strict stop at every stop sign thing, we wouldn't slow down car traffic all that much, because we'd be to the right of the road and cars would still be able to pass us. Well, I guess a car that arrives at a stop sign at the same time as a cyclist would have to wait for the cyclist to move before making a right turn - that would probably be the worst delay for a motorist in that situation.

Chris516

Drivers try to wave me through a stop sign, but I won't go. Until they are gone.

JonnyHK 

What was the final result in the case of the guy who rode through the pedestrian crossing in SF and killed some old guy crossing the road?

catgita

Avoiding delays to motor vehicles is hardly the highest value.

Conditions in LA are so different with our huge streets (ironically "not enough room to add bike lanes"), high speeds, and bikes mostly coming one or two at a time. I wouldn't cross on a red even if it was legal; conditions change by the time you cross 8 lanes. But stop signs, yes, it would be nice to legally roll when either matching the alternating pattern, or when conditions are clear.

I always stop, putting a foot down to be clear about it, and yes, it causes mass confusion. Failure to yield, or not matching the pattern of other vehicle movements is what is really bothersome. The full stop is not what car drivers do or expect.

Chris516

3yrs. Probation + 1000hrs. community service
Bicyclist sentenced for fatal S.F. crash - SFGate

GovernorSilver

I guess they're different in your town. I know what kind of drivers you're talking about - I encounter them a lot more in DC proper than in Alexandria. They wave me through, then start moving immediately while I'm still crossing the intersection.

In Old Town Alexandria, they're well-behaved. If I refuse to move when they wave me through, I waste everybody's time.

Essex

Old Town Alexandria is a great place. Good manners abound. Next time I'm there - I'll be bringing my bicycle.

GovernorSilver

You should! The Old Town part is very bike-friendly and has a bunch of bike shops near MUPs or bike-friendly streets. Mount Vernon Trail is a nice MUP to ride on, as long as you watch out for the usual things (dogs, silent-passing cyclists, etc.), and it connects to Four Mile Run Trail, which in turn connects to WO&D Trail. The newest trail in the area, Potomac Ave. Trail isn't quite as scenic, but provides bike-friendly access to the Potomac Yards Shopping Center - I ride on it on my evening commute to avoid the majority of joggers, baby stroller pushers, tourists, etc. on the Mt. Vernon Trail.

Oh and I forgot to mention there is a concrete-separated MUP on the Woodrow Wilson bridge to National Harbor. Even if there's nothing of interest to you in National Harbor, the view from the bridge is pretty nice.

Daniel4

I'm not sure what the big deal is. I already stop, or roll at a snail's pace no faster than any motorist. Even on uphills.

During Bike-to-work day, we now get bike police *******, so we stop at every stop sign anyways.

Essex

Thank you. I appreciate the tips and places to ride. When I finish my contract here in the Big Crapple - I might have to take another trip to lovely Historic Richmond with Bike in Hand.

Cheers

Essex

Blue Belly

No way to know what it's like to ride a bicycle until you actually are that cyclist. I commuted through Los Angeles quite a few times. Santa Monica to Pasadena often. These types of experiences are tough to gauge unless you are on that bike. How they can try to make laws w/o actually getting out there on a bike, is beyond me. Everyone gets frustrated. Drivers don't like cyclists & cyclists are just trying to do what is best for each situation. & it's always changing. I remember people getting angry with me because I would cross against a light/sign. They wanted me to take my turn. But what they often didn't understand was that I had a safe crossing that removed me from a confused or congested start & added a level of safety to myself. I wouldn't just dart out into an unsafe situation. It had to be safe & make sense. I was never once a part of a vehicle accident & often left the intersection a smoother/faster stArt.
Safety is important. So is an efficient commute. Poorly written laws help no one.

wrldtraveller

sorry but as a avid cyclist who tend to keep their gear in the heaviest gear selection, it takes quite a bit of effort just to regain momentum from a complete stop at a stop sign, So I usually slow down to the point where I can check all the sides for pedestrians, cars and see if It is safe for me to continue, then keep going. but for a traffic red light, that is different, Its safer for me to stop. Based on that, I think it is very inconvenient for cyclist to stop at every single stop sign considering some streets have stop sign every blocks and it takes quite a lot of energy just to stop and accelerate. Of course, I tend to think safety first, but sometimes safety means making yourself very visible, and that causes drivers to become irritated.

W

mconlonx

No jail time for a vehicular murder?!? OMG, the cyclist should have got at least 35 years or so, and been banned from riding bicycles for life!

B. Carfree

I know you're just having fun with the usual attitude here towards people who kill with their poor driving habits, but this case was unique. While it was unclear if the cyclist entered the intersection prior to his light turning red, that appeared to be the case (the DA refused to make the video public, which was odd). However, with the DA threatening him with major jail time if he failed to convince a jury of twelve motorists that the simple fact that he had the right of way was sufficient to prove his innocence, he took the plea deal offered rather than risk rolling the loaded dice. The fact that he ran some stop signs prior to the incident wasn't exactly going to help his case either.

I've never heard of a DA playing such hardball with a motorist. Bear in mind that the bike-lash is a serious force in the home of Critical Mass.

GovernorSilver

I think that's why so many motorists in Old Town smile and wave me through stop sign intersections. I suspect most if not all of them are cyclists themselves.

lostarchitect 

I can say from experience in NYC that many urban drivers hate you for slowing them down when you stop in front of them at a light, and they hate you if you roll carefully through it, too. You can't win. I just do what I think is safest at the moment.

Rootman

I'm with you there, especially if they are going to be behind me after the turn. Why allow me to go first if you are just going to charge up on my rear and probably pass to close anyway?

Daniel4

True but why cause any confusion? I’d rather take my turn as everyone expects. Any drivers behind me can pass properly and safely when the situation permits as should be expected.

Rootman

They should be able to but sometime will not. The closest call I've ever experienced was because of this. I hit a T intersection with a stop on all 3 legs, I hit exactly the same time as another driver in a big Ford pickup. I waited, he waived at me trying to get me to go, I still waited waving him on, he just sat there and I realized he was talking on the phone. So he was just sitting there so I took off and turned onto the street ahead of him. I heard him take off a few seconds later and I heard him getting close. He passed by me so close the enormous tow mirror he had on the side of the truck passed over my left shoulder, he actually bumped me with the rear dually fender and sent me nearly crashing into a parked car, had I not been taking the lane and had some room I would of been flattened. Away he went, still yakking on the cell phone. Several I've also nearly been hit when I guess I didn't clear the intersection fast enough and a car passed behind me and passed by mere inches.

Since then I almost always wave the car on, they can clear the intersection faster than I can. I've even pulled off the road and refused to cross when I didn't feel safe crossing in front of someone. If traffic is that heavy with cars behind me I do it, otherwise the car can go first.

GovernorSilver

Counterpoint blog post - one of you gents perhaps?

Pity The Poor Downtrodden Cyclists Who Protest Having To Follow Laws | Beezodog's Place