What's inside an Edeluxx II?
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What's inside an Edeluxx II?
Has anyone been inside an Edelux headlight? My brand new Edelux II spent a couple of hours yesterday on the bottom of Puget Sound. After grappling the bike up from about 34' of water, to no surprise, the headlight doesn't work. I am still getting current from the SON hub (impressive!) but the light housing is full of condensation. I've used these lights year round for a long time in soggy Seattle but this was apparently too much. I have nothing to loose by dismantling, and even if I can't fix it, it would be educational and fun to try something I've never seen. Looking for suggestions.
P.S. Having torn the rest of the bike apart, the old advice to use boat trailer bearing grease is a great tip!
P.S. Having torn the rest of the bike apart, the old advice to use boat trailer bearing grease is a great tip!
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There is a "Electronics, Lighting, & Gadgets" forum here. You are more likely to get useful help from them.
#3
Banned
Opening it is a warrantee voiding activity , so No I leave it alone, if it is DNF, they are not big , mail it back to Germany for a repair.
SON Repairs
fall off a Ferry-boat crossing the sound ?
SON Repairs
fall off a Ferry-boat crossing the sound ?
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it's unfair to ask for help while teasing us with what might be an interesting story. I feel like saying no help until you say what happened, but honestly I have no idea, so while I'd like to hear the story, don't want to extort it out of you unfairly.
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FB
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An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.
Just because I'm tired of arguing, doesn't mean you're right.
“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN
WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
#5
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At this point dunk it in fresh water to clean it and let it dry out. I am only guessing, but I would assume it has a circuit boar and switch that needs to be dry. You have a generator powered flashlight so that's why I think the insides would be the same without the batteries.
#7
I like cats.
Here are some nice exploded pictures of an Edelux. Your circuit board is most likely short circuited somewhere with water or salt. I'd try removing the circuit board and washing it with dH2O. Let it dry for a couple days and then check every connection with a voltmeter. Replacing components might be tricky with all the surface mount stuff there, but you know, if you've got a steady hand I'm sure it's doable. Mouser/DigiKey/DealExtreme or whatever for sourcing.
#8
Really Old Senior Member
If exposed to salt water, you want to disassemble it and flush with HOT (or at least warm) water ASAP!!!!!!!
Salt water and circuit boards don't mix.
You are in SAVE MODE!
After flushing WELL, douse with alcohol.
I used to build oceanographic instruments. I've had my experiences with "green soup" caused by all the dissimilar metals used on a PCB getting immersed with salt water.
Salt water and circuit boards don't mix.
You are in SAVE MODE!
After flushing WELL, douse with alcohol.
I used to build oceanographic instruments. I've had my experiences with "green soup" caused by all the dissimilar metals used on a PCB getting immersed with salt water.
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As a side note, I wrote the US importer for SON and Edlux, Peter White, from the Anchorage Sunday AM. I was asking about the seals in the generator and etc. He wrote back, not sure about the answers but he had already sent my questions to the manufacturer in Germany. Nice.
And yet another side note, about 3-4 days prior to baptizing the bike, I had applied Chain-L. After working on the bike today, I can say that not only does it work well through Seattle winters, it works well at a nice depth for anchoring in Puget Sound.
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Well, it's like this.... i live on a sailboat and usually keep the bike on deck, port side. ......
And yet another side note, about 3-4 days prior to baptizing the bike, I had applied Chain-L. After working on the bike today, I can say that not only does it work well through Seattle winters, it works well at a nice depth for anchoring in Puget Sound.
And yet another side note, about 3-4 days prior to baptizing the bike, I had applied Chain-L. After working on the bike today, I can say that not only does it work well through Seattle winters, it works well at a nice depth for anchoring in Puget Sound.
The navy has tons of stories about saving the avionics off planes that went into the drink using fresh water flushes and products like LPS-1, so there's still hope.
Sorry to hear about the near drowning (of the bike). Great job with the rescue and resuscitation. Snagging a bike at 34' working blind takes luck or talent, or both.
Can I use the story on the Chain-L testimonial page?
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An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.
Just because I'm tired of arguing, doesn't mean you're right.
“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN
WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
FB
Chain-L site
An ounce of diagnosis is worth a pound of cure.
Just because I'm tired of arguing, doesn't mean you're right.
“One accurate measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions” - Adm Grace Murray Hopper - USN
WARNING, I'm from New York. Thin skinned people should maintain safe distance.
Last edited by FBinNY; 04-13-14 at 09:40 PM.
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Tap water will be fine to remove the salt. The light will have to be disassembled and flushed, but the reflector is likely toast. If it is still shiny, don't touch it with anything except water and shake dry (search cleaning of electro-deposited reflectors).
You might get a kiddie pool or similar and completely dunk the disassembled bike. Don't wait for it to dry out; just don't wait at all. Water at 34' is about 15psi over atmospheric pressure. Guaranteed that there's salt water in every nook and cranny. With dissimilar metals, electrolytic corrosion happens fast.
You might get a kiddie pool or similar and completely dunk the disassembled bike. Don't wait for it to dry out; just don't wait at all. Water at 34' is about 15psi over atmospheric pressure. Guaranteed that there's salt water in every nook and cranny. With dissimilar metals, electrolytic corrosion happens fast.
Last edited by AnkleWork; 04-13-14 at 11:27 PM.
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No water is truly pure -- the question is of concentration. Residual salts from tap water don't have enough activity to cause problems for the circuit in question. When removing salt water, speed is more important than purity. But, since the OP apparently tried to power the light up, the question may be moot.
Last edited by AnkleWork; 04-13-14 at 11:36 PM.
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P.S. Maybe I should soften this. You can start with tap, but you need to finish with distilled.
Last edited by 2_i; 04-13-14 at 11:46 PM. Reason: P.S.
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You might get a kiddie pool or similar and completely dunk the disassembled bike. Don't wait for it to dry out; just don't wait at all. Water at 34' is about 15psi over atmospheric pressure. Guaranteed that there's salt water in every nook and cranny. With dissimilar metals, electrolytic corrosion happens fast.
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Here are some nice exploded pictures of an Edelux. Your circuit board is most likely short circuited somewhere with water or salt. I'd try removing the circuit board and washing it with dH2O. Let it dry for a couple days and then check every connection with a voltmeter. Replacing components might be tricky with all the surface mount stuff there, but you know, if you've got a steady hand I'm sure it's doable. Mouser/DigiKey/DealExtreme or whatever for sourcing.
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Most of you probably know that nowadays circuit boards are assembled and soldered with aqueous flux which is corrosive and conductive when wet. This stuff would be very bad if left of the boards so the standard process is to pass the soldered boards through a washer which works much like a dishwasher and has several stages of washing to completely remove flux residue. The final stages use deionized water so as not to leave any salts on the board or parts. The boards and electronics are designed and intended to withstand this. Some components, like pressure or humidity sensors, might have ports that are sealed with plugs or tape that protects them during the wash cycle and that must be removed to become functional. Some electromechanical items, like some switches for example, also have removable seals.
Anyway, IMO, the guts of the Edlux will benefit from through washing in water, preferably followed by a good rinse in DI or distilled water. Adding a little detergent or desalting agent (Saltaway available at West Marine) to the washing stages would help. The sooner the better. No matter what, this will be way better than leaving salt water residue in it.
Anyway, IMO, the guts of the Edlux will benefit from through washing in water, preferably followed by a good rinse in DI or distilled water. Adding a little detergent or desalting agent (Saltaway available at West Marine) to the washing stages would help. The sooner the better. No matter what, this will be way better than leaving salt water residue in it.
#19
I like cats.
It's probably beyond my ability but I'm encouraged to look...
If you're thinking about rebuilding it, I would totally save the shell and the parabolic reflector because making good optics is the one aspect of diy lightbuilding that doesn't measure up to the manufactured stuff out there. Saw that somebody wrote that the reflector is probably toasted and I'm curious why - it's probably aluminumized plastic and I would think you could put a rotary tool with a buffing attachment on it and clean it up unless the salt caused the aluminum to flake or something.
And if you decide you don't want to dissect the circuit board, I'll send you a stamped, self-addressed envelope and you can mail it to me. I'd love to see if they use any special standlight tricks in their design.
#20
Banned
Seems the Edelux electrical connection on the bottom, for the taillight AFAIK is where water goes in .
guess you have to pry the lens ring off , I suspect then you will not be using that one , and just buying a new one ,
but experimenting on the cadaver.
Along the same lines, a buddy uses the modified bow railing as a bike rack to hang his bike up there, on his marina liveaboard.
had to put on his wetsuit and go get his bike off the bottom, a couple times,
but does not use such a nice bike as yours, seems.
Up there the Anchor Outs row their dinghy to & from shore , not even paying for moorage & hook up fees .
guess you have to pry the lens ring off , I suspect then you will not be using that one , and just buying a new one ,
but experimenting on the cadaver.
Along the same lines, a buddy uses the modified bow railing as a bike rack to hang his bike up there, on his marina liveaboard.
had to put on his wetsuit and go get his bike off the bottom, a couple times,
but does not use such a nice bike as yours, seems.
Up there the Anchor Outs row their dinghy to & from shore , not even paying for moorage & hook up fees .
Last edited by fietsbob; 04-14-14 at 09:50 AM.
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Let it dry for a couple days and then check every connection with a voltmeter. Replacing components might be tricky with all the surface mount stuff there, but you know, if you've got a steady hand I'm sure it's doable. Mouser/DigiKey/DealExtreme or whatever for sourcing.
The circuitry is for sure not simple and the design can be challenging even with those with experience in electronics. Is it the case of a wanna-be professional trying to pass as a professional?!
#22
I like cats.
Oh man, definitely not posing as any kind of EE but let's face it, there's really not much going on in a dynamo light. : ) Not arguing, just curious - where exactly is the substantial complexity to which you're referring? Maybe Schmidt uses some interesting standlight tricks (which is why I'd love to take apart their board) but what else? Mode switching? Overvoltage protection? Come on, the OP can do this, don't be discouraging.
Well obviously you'd need to drive the circuit. My presumption was that the board would basically need a rebuild, since the capacitors are almost definitely gone already and who knows about the LED. But the purpose is to find out what (if anything) on the board is salvageable.
I am baffled by the recommendation of checking every connection with a voltmeter?! If the circuit is w/o power there are no volts to read there. The circuits are normally heavily coated, so you better get no connection there.
Last edited by ericoseveins; 04-14-14 at 10:12 AM. Reason: Ok ok, maybe I'm arguing.
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Apparently, the circuit is mostly power conditioning, current control, and maybe mode control. The concepts and circuit elements are common and widely understood, if not exactly simple.
#25
I like cats.
Really kind of took the punch out of my rhetorical question there. : D I wonder if Schmidt even bothers to limit the current since the output falls so far below where the LED is rated.
Argh, Mondays. The main thing is I think the OP should just get in there and go to town.
Argh, Mondays. The main thing is I think the OP should just get in there and go to town.