kzin

SUNTOUR SF11-NVX-MLO, Lockout

whole BD bike -
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I ride mostly crappy neighborhood streets and hope to add some probably easy trails this summer.

Wondering if these are a plus or just wasted weight.

veganbikes

wasted weight. Any suspension fork used on roads and paved trails or non-MTB trails is just silly and is another part to wear out and go bad. You can get a much nicer bike sans suspension fork for the same money because you aren't wasting money on kind of useless suspension. If you riding off road on some rougher trails than certainly suspension is nice but if you spend most of your time on the road or paths you are better off getting a nice steel hybrid (Jamis makes some for instance) and wider tires.

I would avoid BD bikes as much as possible and go down to my local shop and test ride some bikes and see what I like. Cheap online bikes with old names to evoke quality that are so far removed from that old name just aren't worth it. Plus you have to pay someone to assemble and tune them unless you know all of that and have all the tools you need (which is great) If you develop a relationship with your shop it will pay off for you and for the shop and cycling in general.

Seattle Forrest

It seems like a shock absorber is the best thing in the world and going to make your bike more comfortable than a pillow. They work pretty well in cars. The trouble is a lot of them aren't very good. You wind up paying the weight penalty you mentioned, and not really getting anything for it. Also, you can wind up putting a lot of energy into the fork that should be pushing you down the street instead. A lot of shock forks have an adjustment that goes from super squishy to locked out like a road bike fork, you "lock" it to avoid wasting energy.

I'll agree that a shock fork isn't very useful on pavement or easy trails. In my limited experience.

BlazingPedals

It's not that BD bikes are bad, but think about what you're doing here. You're getting a bike that you will have to maintain yourself, and yet you don't even know what kind of parts you need on it. At your experience level, you need more support than that, and you're not going to get it at BD.

GeoKrpan

Don't get suspension.

BD is a great place to buy a bike.

This one would be better.

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GerryinHouston

Well, I'll go against the current of no suspension advice, as I am probably one of the few that rides a (cheap) front suspension fork bike with smooth Gatorskins.

The flexibility of the suspension makes a difference riding lousy city streets. So much so, that when I ride a non-suspension bike, I find the ride positively jarring.

The argument about robbing energy may apply to racers, I haven't noticed ANY difference measured by distance traveled vs stamina.

The MUP I ride daily here in Houston has quite a few road anomalies (cracks across the path with 1/2"-1" high 'lips', bridge decks that meet the asphalt at an angle). The difference with the front fork absorbing part of the anomaly is obvious and easily felt.

If you don't buy the bike for performance, a front fork will be a plus not a minus. Is it gonna break down? I put close to 2k mi. on my Trek and (knock on wood) it's still ok.

Buying from BD. I haven't done this. I ride with a guy that has bought a Motobecane and puts a few thousand miles a year on his bikes. I don't know the mileage of the Motobecane, but I've heard of no problems. After all, if the frame is decent and the parts middle to upper scale Shimano, what makes it inferior to LBS bikes?

Lastly, LBS means Local Bike Shop, not necessarily Bike Dealership... Admittedly, LBS's with mechanics full of attitude are everywhere. You know the type, 'if it's not a $5k bike, it's not worth my devoted attention'... But most of the other LBS's will take in your bike and work for your dollars. They may sell one brand or two, but they can't survive if they don't work on other brands.

I bought my Trek at a large Houston Trek/Specialized dealership. I've been there often, for repairs/maintenance and I got to know the mechanics in the back a bit. There are a lot of non-Trek/Specialized bikes in the back and most of them are not that expensive. The mechanics don't show (often) attitude, because the store manager told them not to. ...and he is present to enforce it.

I used to take my old bike to a 'bike studio' close to where I live. The owner and chief mechanic is good and personable but was not always present. The other mechanic has attitude... Notice the past tense in the previous sentences.

DorkDisk

+1 on suspension is so not needed on the road.

Your elbows and knees should soak up the bumps. Considering off road riders still ride full rigid, its hard to imagine a scenario where suspension makes sense for road bikes

BD is good for people who have tools and can build/troubleshoot them. The minute you start paying someone else for everything is when the price differential disappears. If you have tools and knowledge though, its hard to beat the used market for value

bmthom.gis

Your body and tires should be shock absorbers, and your eyes used to try to avoid as many hazards as possible. Just because you are being cushioned, doesn't mean your wheels won't take some damage if you hit a big enough pot hole hard enough. You'll do much better with a bike that can accept at least 32 mm wide tires, and adjust tire pressure accordingly. If your suspension locks out (ad you only ride the pavement), what's the point? You aren't supposed to lock out the fork under load (especially on those cheap forks), mean you should stop and unweight the front, hit the lockout and then start up again. Maybe consider a sprung saddle if you want some cushioning.

kzin

Thanks for the feedback.
Most saying a waste and one guy a plus leaves me about where I was

Assembly of a BD bike is not an issue. I will get it rolling and stopping. If I need expert help after that I'll pay for it.

The whole point of this buy is to get an 8 speed hub. I'm already running 3 3-speed hubs so I don't need a discussion of IGH pros and cons either.

BD prices on 8-speed hubs are much lower than anything else I've seen, 400-500$
400 borders on the price of an internet wheel build.

They have:
hybrid/comfort that I worry is not appropriate even for my barely-serious exercise riding. 400
https://www.bikesdirect.com/products/gravity/swift-flatbar-hybrid-8.htm


steel and aluminum framed city bikes. fenders, chainguard and racks(steel only) that i dont particularly want - 500
I have two sets of fenders,chainguards and racks sitting in storage now
https://www.bikesdirect.com/products/windsor/kensington8.htm


https://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...city-bikes.htm


the adventure hybrid linked above 450
https://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/elite_8-speed-nexus.htm

Seattle Forrest

There are a lot of things you can do to make a bike more comfortable, and a few to make it look like it ought to be more comfortable.

Wider tires make a bike less jarring and more comfortable. So does lower air pressure. And those are related because you need wider tires to let more than a little air out. Geometry can help, things like curves in the seat stays turn the frame into a spring, you can put cork tape on the bars or nice grips. Some frame materials tend to deal better with rough surfaces than other; people love carbon fiber and steel and a lot of people think aluminum usually has a "harsh" ride. Seatposts with setback flex more than ones without, giving some shock absorption. Etc. Add a bunch of stuff up and it can make a huge difference.

The point is that you can find a comfortable and an uncomfortable bike, whether it has a shock fork or not.

Retro Grouch 

I don't like low end suspension forks. Here's why:

"Shock fork" is a misnomer. It should be called a "spring fork". The important part that's lacking is actually the shock absorber or more properly called "damper". What the damper does is to smooth the up and down motion to keep the wheel on contact with the surface. That not only makes the bike ride more smoothly, but can greatly improve it's handling and consequently it's speed. If you have budget restraints on your bicycle purchase, it doesn't make very much sense to me to spend part of that budget on an optional feature that really doesn't work very well.

Bicycle suspension forks with dampers are readily available but tend to cost a lot more.

GerryinHouston

I was running 35 mm tires at 70 psi. Any less and I'd be risking pinch flats, as I weigh 265 lbs. I don't care about wider tires. I had a chromoly 700c x 35 (99 Diamondback) and compared to my Verve the latter's smoothness is night and day. Most of you people dun the front fork without actually having ridden one with smooth tires in rough city streets. Everybody thinks MTBs riding ruts, roots and other anomalies.

I currently run 700 x 28 mm at 100 psi. The ride is slightly rougher but nothing compared to that of a Trek 520 with 700c x 28 at 100 psi. I know because I compared them.

You are absolutely correct regarding spring forks vs shock absorber forks.

However, for city riding, you don't need as much damping as on an MTB trail. That's where the cheaper forks work. Of course I'd like a proper shock absorber fork. But a good fork would cost as much as the bike.

The car shock absorbers are viscous dampers. That means that the damping force is proportionate to the velocity of the piston. The bike forks (at least the cheap ones) have a friction damping mechanism which is not as effective. All of them have a spring to provide the return (viscous and friction damping resist the motion but do not provide the force required to return to the equilibrium position).

dedhed

To me a lot of it is the condition of your roads. Here in the frost belt I ride my front suspension hybrid with 700 X 25 tires commuting in the spring until the salt is washed away, the gutters get swept, and the potholes are filled on our beat up roads. Some of us have spent a lifetime of using our knees & elbows to absorb shocks and do repetitive motion work and they don't really care to be doing that anymore. When I move to my road bike after a few weeks there is a noticeable difference. Yes, you "waste" some energy, but if you're not standing or hammering, it's negligible. If you feel the need or want for front suspension I say go for it. No one here can know your personal conditions or needs. On the other hand I personally see or feel no need for suspension seatposts which often also come on these bikes.

GerryinHouston

I'll second the suspension post position. At least for my weight is useless... I know how to lighten up the saddle when a shock is coming, don't need the seatpost for this.

GeoKrpan

The Kensington is the coolest of those bikes. The steel frame is nice and the colors are nice.

Don't get suspension. It works in theory but not in the real world. It looks dorktastic too.

Wilfred Laurier

Save up to 60% off new Flat Bar Road Bikes - Gravity Swift8 Shimano Nexus 8spd Internal Hybrid V Brake Super Hybrid Bikes | Save up to 60% off new bikes Flat bars, rigid fork, and an 8 speed hub. Your LBS also probably has access to similar models from whatever brands they sell.

Edit: This bike is linked above also.

fietsbob

Knees and elbows are good suspension .. get off the saddle .

Seattle Forrest

I put a few thousand miles on a hybrid with a spring fork in Seattle, and lots more miles on a skinny tire road bike here. The road bike, ridden appropriately (avoid potholes, legs and arms as suspension) is just as comfortable, honestly it's more so because of the additional positions.

GerryinHouston

Sorry, it's not. You may be younger, fitter, lighter and be able to ride lightweight on the saddle better than I do (although I do too), but the physics are not there.

Ride a reasonable distance on chipseal and tell me that a rigid bike is as compliant and smooth as a rigid (even steel) bike.

Seattle Forrest

What's "a reasonable distance?" I don't have time to cover that much ground after work but on weekends I like to do 40 to 50 miles at a time.

Anyway, you told us that everybody who thinks you don't need a spring fork on pavement has never been on a spring fork on pavement. You're wrong in that assumption.

I wouldn't be surprised if most of the people offering their advice in this thread have also tried both systems and decided based on their experience. Who knows? You shouldn't assume everybody who disagrees with you is doing it because they're ignorant, though.

GerryinHouston

40 miles will do nicely on chipseal.

Anyway, I gave my two cents, I am not going to give a course in Structural Dynamics. It's a free country and each can judge and do as he sees fit.

Best regards,

Wilfred Laurier

Even good suspension forks will have little to no effect on chipseal - the frequency of the bumps is too high. A fatter tire at slightly lower pressure is a much better solution. I ride 32mm tires on my 'road' bike and can keep up with skinny tire road bikes on the flats on very rough roads, and am faster going down hills.

DorkDisk

Agreed, my opinion come from having owned and ridden different types of suspension on different types of terrain since the MAG-21 days (1992.) If somehow mountain biking over tough terrain on rigid bikes is less difficult than rough roads, I missed something.

Paul Barnard

Even cheap suspension forks today are very good compared to the first suspension forks developed. Here in NOLA, the streets are in horrible shape. If his streets are like ours, you can spend too much of your time focused on road irregularities. So much so that you can't process the whole of the big picture. Here's another problem I have. I am constantly riding from bright sunlight to shade. With sunglasses on, when I hit the shadows, I can't see the road surface very well at all. I have hit some pretty bad ruts that way.

OP, you want that bike, get it.

DorkDisk

Of course we are free to do whatever we choose. The point I am trying to make is that the increased cost, increased weight, increased complexity, and lack of damping - the essence of "suspension" is not worth your hard earned money. Considering technique overcomes road obstacles with ease, its arguably better to choose a lighter bike with better components.

Consider this: one of the biggest upgrades people do to these entry level forks is replacing it with a rigid fork. Replacing a rigid fork with an entry level suspension fork is exponentially rarer.

Yes, OP do what you want. I ride my suspended MTB on the road at times because I just like to ride, but I didn't build the bike for the road because my roads are bad. And they really are, just like everybody's in North America. Big countries do have their drawbacks.