Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Mountain Biking Mountain biking is one of the fastest growing sports in the world. Check out this forum to discuss the latest tips, tricks, gear and equipment in the world of mountain biking.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 08-14-09, 12:40 PM   #1
ed 
.
Thread Starter
 
ed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: The Summit of Lee
Bikes: Hecklah
Posts: 10,934
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
RC's take on the XX

discuss
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 10spd-2.jpg (105.1 KB, 118 views)
ed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 12:54 PM   #2
mtnbiker66
Old School Rad
 
mtnbiker66's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: The old Mountains
Bikes: Blur LT
Posts: 8,212
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Whatever.........more hype.
__________________
Like a circus monkey on a stolen Harley......
mtnbiker66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 12:55 PM   #3
ed 
.
Thread Starter
 
ed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: The Summit of Lee
Bikes: Hecklah
Posts: 10,934
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
I'm thinking 1x10 could be cool...but I'm still sold on the hype surrounding the Hammerschmidt with a SS rear cog. 1x2 gearbox.
ed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 01:45 PM   #4
craigcraigcraig
Don't really have a bike.
 
craigcraigcraig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Wenatchee, WA
Bikes:
Posts: 3,368
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
2x10 or 3x9 is still a lot of shifting if you are searching for the super climb gear. i agree with ed, if the complaint is the derailleur then why not take one out? instead of having a 4x t outer ring just make it say 38 and make the rear cassette like 11-30 or 26. seems funny to hype up 7 less gear choices.
craigcraigcraig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 01:50 PM   #5
ed 
.
Thread Starter
 
ed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: The Summit of Lee
Bikes: Hecklah
Posts: 10,934
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
How bout simplifying the Rohloff 14spd rear hub and getting rid of the under drive crap that is supposedly so noisy and power draining. (basically a Sturmey that's Gnar-rated) Run that with a Hammerschmidt up front. and you got yourself an internal 2x7. No extra dishing = stronger wheel. Proper chainline...belt drive even? You'd prob. drop alot of weight with those extra 7 gears being gone in the Rohloff...bringing it back down to a normal weight for a drivetrain with the simplicity and ease of a drivetrain you can shift front or rear any time under any power load in any mucky/crappy condition.

Any takers?

Last edited by ed; 08-14-09 at 01:54 PM.
ed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 01:53 PM   #6
Chuckie J.
Senior Member
 
Chuckie J.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: USA
Bikes: Too many...
Posts: 292
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by chelboed View Post
How bout simplifying the Rohloff 14spd rear hub and getting rid of the under drive crap that is supposedly so noisy and power draining. Run that with a Hammerschmidt up front. and you got yourself an internal 2x7.

Any takers?
Well it will only cost $2000 for the drivetrain alone... but it would be GREAT!
Chuckie J. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 01:58 PM   #7
ed 
.
Thread Starter
 
ed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: The Summit of Lee
Bikes: Hecklah
Posts: 10,934
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Naaahhhh...you could get it as a new package. Rohloff builds the 7spd hub licensed to SRAM. Much less complicated b/c it's only 7spd.

So instead of a $1300 hub, you got a $650 hub with a $600 crankset. $1250 drivetrain including crankset that should inherently last 100,000 miles or so. Throw in the licensed belt drive to combat sand and gear wear.
ed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 01:59 PM   #8
ed 
.
Thread Starter
 
ed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: The Summit of Lee
Bikes: Hecklah
Posts: 10,934
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
If you think about it...
PG990 cassette on sale is around $70
PC971 chain $20
XT crankset $250
Good hub $190

Add all that up and the comparison is...umm...well, still depressing
ed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 02:05 PM   #9
craigcraigcraig
Don't really have a bike.
 
craigcraigcraig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Wenatchee, WA
Bikes:
Posts: 3,368
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
sounds good to me.
craigcraigcraig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 02:26 PM   #10
junkyard
Fourth Degree Legend
 
junkyard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: American Gardens Building
Bikes: 2005 Kona Cinder Cone & 2010 Cannondale SuperSix
Posts: 3,826
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I want a 4x9. 36 heavenly options.
junkyard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 02:44 PM   #11
-_RebelRidin'_-
"STAT"
 
-_RebelRidin'_-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: WVU-Morgantown
Bikes: Trek 3900. 2007 Kona Dawg
Posts: 1,111
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
^lol, 4x9.

why not 4x10?




IDK... i just know the Front Derailleur on the Kona is really pissing me off lol. The problem is I feel I need all 3 up front because of the constant change in terrain.
-_RebelRidin'_- is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 02:48 PM   #12
helmut
Senior Member
 
helmut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Bikes:
Posts: 435
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I was recently considering upgrading my bike with an 8 speed drivetrain to 9 speed. It was going to cost me about $100. Then I stopped for a second, and thought about the different ratios I use. I essentially use only 3 of my sprockets in the back, and leave it in the middle up front. Adding another gear for $100 is silly. Instead, I'm just getting new 8 speed shifters to replace my crappy old ones for about $27, and saving the rest of the money for a new fork down the line.
The only positive that I can see with the XX system is the compatibility with the road group. I know plenty of guys who would like to run the larger cassette with an XX RD on their road bikes for tough mountain climbs.
helmut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 03:48 PM   #13
RatedZeroHero
foolishly delirious
 
RatedZeroHero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Panhandle of NE
Bikes:
Posts: 798
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by chelboed View Post
How bout simplifying the Rohloff 14spd rear hub and getting rid of the under drive crap that is supposedly so noisy and power draining. (basically a Sturmey that's Gnar-rated) Run that with a Hammerschmidt up front. and you got yourself an internal 2x7. No extra dishing = stronger wheel. Proper chainline...belt drive even? You'd prob. drop alot of weight with those extra 7 gears being gone in the Rohloff...bringing it back down to a normal weight for a drivetrain with the simplicity and ease of a drivetrain you can shift front or rear any time under any power load in any mucky/crappy condition.

Any takers?
so has this been done? I looked at that 7 speed hub and it has some interesting gearing... change a sprocket here or there to suit riding conditions and it looks pretty tight...

so does the internal crank set up... are we seeing the future? (probably only possible with CAD and modern machining techniques I presume...)
RatedZeroHero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 04:10 PM   #14
Mr IGH
afraid of whales
 
Mr IGH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Front Range, CO
Bikes:
Posts: 3,838
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 129 Post(s)
Great, 9 speed systems are sucky enough, now they're going for 10...We've regressed in my house. The boys ride single speeds and I ride an Alfine (I'm not allowed to shift when I ride with them). Is the problem that we don't have enough gears or too many?

IGH on holiday, the 9 speed chains were breaking all day long. Mr IGH was just cruising along with his Alfine:
Attached Images
File Type: jpg alfine muddy 1.jpg (101.8 KB, 17 views)
File Type: jpg alfine muddy 2.jpg (97.5 KB, 16 views)
Mr IGH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 07:29 PM   #15
RatedZeroHero
foolishly delirious
 
RatedZeroHero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Panhandle of NE
Bikes:
Posts: 798
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Mr IGH is that a single up front?
RatedZeroHero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-09, 11:29 PM   #16
ed 
.
Thread Starter
 
ed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: The Summit of Lee
Bikes: Hecklah
Posts: 10,934
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by RatedZeroHero View Post
so has this been done? I looked at that 7 speed hub and it has some interesting gearing... change a sprocket here or there to suit riding conditions and it looks pretty tight...

so does the internal crank set up... are we seeing the future? (probably only possible with CAD and modern machining techniques I presume...)
Has the simplified Rohloff been done? Or has a HammySturmey been done?

Far as I know...neither.


The only really cool thing I've seen done lately with the Hammy was the singlespeed 1x2 Hammerschmidt setup in last months MBA, I believe. Beautiful piece of XC work there. 2 very useable gears in a light and efficient package that will go most anywhere a "trail biker" needs to go.

Take it up a notch to the less efficient "big bikes". That's where you will need the extra few gears to get'em up those hills. Lose the Planetary under drive. Enter the Diet Rohloff. Rohloff Zero? Rohloff Lite?
ed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-09, 06:04 AM   #17
Mr IGH
afraid of whales
 
Mr IGH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Front Range, CO
Bikes:
Posts: 3,838
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 129 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by RatedZeroHero View Post
Mr IGH is that a single up front?
Yes, I'm running 32x23 gives me a low of 21 inches and a high of 68 inches (29er wheel). I'm a spinner so I can make ~25mph pedaling, fast enough for me. I wouldn't mind a equivilent of 22x34 on a 26" wheel. that would take a 22x20 and I'd need a second ring up front (maybe a 36).

IMHO, Alfine has surpassed Rohloff. 1/5 the price, same low gears, lacks a little on the high end (gear-wise), shifts much better. My entire bike cost less than a Rohloff hub, what's the point? ~1-2% of all Rohloffs are defective out of the box (their number, not mine), IMHO, for $1600 large, the hub should be perfect.

IGH are great, no catching derailliuers on rocks, no filling a skinny 9 speed chain up with sand. I was replacing chains all the time before I switched myself and my boys over to single speed drivetrains. Now we just ride and enjoy. IMHO, if the next step is 10 speed, we're not really going in the right direction.

Last edited by Mr IGH; 08-15-09 at 06:08 AM.
Mr IGH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-09, 09:02 AM   #18
ed 
.
Thread Starter
 
ed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: The Summit of Lee
Bikes: Hecklah
Posts: 10,934
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
So...IGH...how much have you punished that Alfine? Do you think it's pretty tough?



I'm almost sold, dude.
ed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-09, 09:28 AM   #19
RatedZeroHero
foolishly delirious
 
RatedZeroHero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Panhandle of NE
Bikes:
Posts: 798
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I am riding an AL framed HARO at the moment and just got sent home from my spot because my FD got jacked and kept dropping chain.

I am 6'6" and 275 ATM... too much bottom flex... that Hammer looks like the schnizzle...

been looking at I believe SRAM has an 8 speed... 4lbs... 340% range of gears...

I am also almost sold... I can see it on a Karate Monkey, Hammer up front 8 speed in rear... no drive line worries at all...
RatedZeroHero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-09, 09:30 AM   #20
ed 
.
Thread Starter
 
ed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: The Summit of Lee
Bikes: Hecklah
Posts: 10,934
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
+1dood...+1.
ed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-09, 05:47 PM   #21
mzeffex 
Senior Member
 
mzeffex's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Bikes: A Tarmac, a TCR, a Tipo Uno, a Grand Prix Luxe, an Anthem, a Norcross, a Claud Butler, and an SLM 2.0
Posts: 9,417
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I was getting all... giddy... about getting a Hammerschmidt, and then, after about a week of excitement and preparing to order it - ISCG adapters do not work. Can you say let down?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjones28 View Post
Are they talking about spectators feeding the cyclists? You know, like don't feed the bears?
mzeffex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-09, 08:08 PM   #22
scrublover
Te mortuo heres tibi sim?
 
scrublover's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: East coast
Bikes: hardtail, squishy, fixed roadie, fixed crosser
Posts: 3,486
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The Alfine and the SRAM internal hubs. Both are great, but both are not meant for long term offroad use. Beef them up, give them some faster engagement, maybe a little more gear spread, give trigger and twist shifter options, with a simple double wheel tensioner system for running on rear suspension bikes, and provision to run six bolt or Center Lock rotors -not some other standard. They'd still come in likely lighter than, and still much more affordable than the Rohloff.

They would sell like mad.

Otherwise: wait, people really listen to anything RC has to say about the world of MTB?
scrublover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-09, 09:26 PM   #23
RatedZeroHero
foolishly delirious
 
RatedZeroHero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Panhandle of NE
Bikes:
Posts: 798
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by scrublover View Post
The Alfine and the SRAM internal hubs. Both are great, but both are not meant for long term offroad use. Beef them up, give them some faster engagement, maybe a little more gear spread, give trigger and twist shifter options, with a simple double wheel tensioner system for running on rear suspension bikes, and provision to run six bolt or Center Lock rotors -not some other standard. They'd still come in likely lighter than, and still much more affordable than the Rohloff.

They would sell like mad.

Otherwise: wait, people really listen to anything RC has to say about the world of MTB?
http://www.ninerbikes.com/fly.aspx?l...bikes&taxid=93 here the future comes... http://aebike.com/page.cfm?action=de...=30&SKU=HU2520

$261.xx for the 9speed...

"The W.F.O. 9 went through exhaustive testing and refining, including a first for a 29er frame: a tapered headtube for increased front end stiffness and strength. We thought about all of the ways people might take advantage of having 5.5” of travel coupled with a 29” wheel, and we designed the W.F.O. 9 to handle them all. A custom S-bend hydroformed downtube allows the use of both coil and piggyback shocks, offset bottom linkage makes room for an ISCG mount, making this frame the first 29er to be compatible with the all new SRAM Hammerschmidt system and other chain guide systems and an optional 150mm rear spacing increases rear wheel strength and stiffness. Best of all, build it how you want. Order the W.F.O. 9 with 135 or 150 rear spacing and then choose from our shock options or order without a shock.

Whatever your needs, from aggressive all mountain to big hit, the W.F.O. 9 will keep you pinned all the way down some of the gnarliest terrain you can throw at it.

Last edited by RatedZeroHero; 08-15-09 at 09:29 PM.
RatedZeroHero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-09, 09:28 PM   #24
RatedZeroHero
foolishly delirious
 
RatedZeroHero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Panhandle of NE
Bikes:
Posts: 798
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I am looking at building/buying a 29 and I think I am going to use the Hammerschmidt and SRAM hub... (they do have 6 bolt disc BTW)...

just because I can... at $261.xx I'll ride it til it explodes and get another...

no real adjustment... UBER ground clearance... 23" steel frame hardtail mmmm mmmmm I'll post pix when I'm done

Last edited by RatedZeroHero; 08-15-09 at 09:43 PM.
RatedZeroHero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-09, 09:52 PM   #25
mzeffex 
Senior Member
 
mzeffex's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Bikes: A Tarmac, a TCR, a Tipo Uno, a Grand Prix Luxe, an Anthem, a Norcross, a Claud Butler, and an SLM 2.0
Posts: 9,417
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
$261? Where are you getting it?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjones28 View Post
Are they talking about spectators feeding the cyclists? You know, like don't feed the bears?
mzeffex is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:02 PM.