The newest heresy: Pinarello releases a rear-suspension Dogma
04-02-15, 04:15 PM
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The newest heresy: Pinarello releases a rear-suspension Dogma
Pinarello Dogma K8-S rear-suspension road bike released - BikeRadar
Note, however, that it does not have disc brakes--if it did it'd be the ultimate Fred-mobile
(and yes, heresy is tongue in cheek)
Note, however, that it does not have disc brakes--if it did it'd be the ultimate Fred-mobile
(and yes, heresy is tongue in cheek)
Last edited by tekhna; 04-02-15 at 04:18 PM.
04-02-15, 04:28 PM
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I've always thought suspension would creep (back) into to road bikes. I personally wouldn't mind seeing front suspension with a Cannondale Headshox type fork with a lockout on the stem.
04-02-15, 06:02 PM
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Disc brake flamewars are over. We can now move on to suspension on road bikes (again)..... :-(
Cycling News Link
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Cycling News Link
Velonews Link
Last edited by omarcastz; 04-02-15 at 06:06 PM.
04-02-15, 06:22 PM
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Dropper posts are next.
04-02-15, 06:28 PM
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Choice of words. 10mm of vertical movement sound a lot more machi than 1cm...
this is a great option for the classics. With the slack HT angle & fork rake it has to suffer in the corners.
& that choice of words again "could Result in loss of power( concerning the rear suspension)
this doesnt sound like the high end race bike many consumers should be interested in...
this is a great option for the classics. With the slack HT angle & fork rake it has to suffer in the corners.
& that choice of words again "could Result in loss of power( concerning the rear suspension)
this doesnt sound like the high end race bike many consumers should be interested in...
04-02-15, 06:43 PM
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I like it. I'd much faster buy a road bike with suspension than a road bike with Disc brakes here in Southern California.
04-02-15, 07:04 PM
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Already a thing - Dropper Seatposts Come to Road Bikes | Bicycling
04-02-15, 07:16 PM
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04-02-15, 07:18 PM
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Just shooting the breeze here....
I wonder if this is a benefit of keeping the official weight limit of racing bikes at 6.8 kg or whatever it is, in spite of it being pretty easy to build a bike lighter than that. It makes manufacturers put R&D into technology other than weight reduction. If a little give in the front end and rear end can be done without exceeding the 6.8 kg thresh hold, and is neutral or improves handling, and makes the bike more comfortable, why the heck not? Note I said no weight disadvantage and neutral or improved handling.
We all know that a well designed suspension on rough trails can improve handling and speed, and reduce fatigue - thus also increasing speed in the long run. And make it more fun.
I'm seeing both disc brakes and electronic shifting to be a result of being able to meet that 6.8 kg limit easily with conventional brakes and shifting. If manufacturers were struggling to get down to that limit, they certainly wouldn't be developing and marketing heavier braking and shifting systems.
To me, I'd be more interested in spending extra money and/or weight on this sort of stuff than disc brakes or electronic shifting, since I'm perfectly happy with nice mechanical shifting and rim brakes. But being in my 60s and riding rough chip seal and patched roads often, why not a little comfort give in the frame?
I wonder if this is a benefit of keeping the official weight limit of racing bikes at 6.8 kg or whatever it is, in spite of it being pretty easy to build a bike lighter than that. It makes manufacturers put R&D into technology other than weight reduction. If a little give in the front end and rear end can be done without exceeding the 6.8 kg thresh hold, and is neutral or improves handling, and makes the bike more comfortable, why the heck not? Note I said no weight disadvantage and neutral or improved handling.
We all know that a well designed suspension on rough trails can improve handling and speed, and reduce fatigue - thus also increasing speed in the long run. And make it more fun.
I'm seeing both disc brakes and electronic shifting to be a result of being able to meet that 6.8 kg limit easily with conventional brakes and shifting. If manufacturers were struggling to get down to that limit, they certainly wouldn't be developing and marketing heavier braking and shifting systems.
To me, I'd be more interested in spending extra money and/or weight on this sort of stuff than disc brakes or electronic shifting, since I'm perfectly happy with nice mechanical shifting and rim brakes. But being in my 60s and riding rough chip seal and patched roads often, why not a little comfort give in the frame?
Last edited by Camilo; 04-02-15 at 07:24 PM.
04-02-15, 08:53 PM
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Ten years ago Trek out or a version of their Pilot road bike that had an elastomer rear suspension, and last year Calfee was selling a rear suspension road bike as well. It seems like there might be an advantage over cobbles and other rough terrain as it may be more comfortable and keep the rear wheel in better contact with the ground leading to less losses from vertical displacement.
04-03-15, 01:17 AM
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Just shooting the breeze here....
I wonder if this is a benefit of keeping the official weight limit of racing bikes at 6.8 kg or whatever it is, in spite of it being pretty easy to build a bike lighter than that. It makes manufacturers put R&D into technology other than weight reduction. If a little give in the front end and rear end can be done without exceeding the 6.8 kg thresh hold, and is neutral or improves handling, and makes the bike more comfortable, why the heck not? Note I said no weight disadvantage and neutral or improved handling.
We all know that a well designed suspension on rough trails can improve handling and speed, and reduce fatigue - thus also increasing speed in the long run. And make it more fun.
I'm seeing both disc brakes and electronic shifting to be a result of being able to meet that 6.8 kg limit easily with conventional brakes and shifting. If manufacturers were struggling to get down to that limit, they certainly wouldn't be developing and marketing heavier braking and shifting systems.
To me, I'd be more interested in spending extra money and/or weight on this sort of stuff than disc brakes or electronic shifting, since I'm perfectly happy with nice mechanical shifting and rim brakes. But being in my 60s and riding rough chip seal and patched roads often, why not a little comfort give in the frame?
I wonder if this is a benefit of keeping the official weight limit of racing bikes at 6.8 kg or whatever it is, in spite of it being pretty easy to build a bike lighter than that. It makes manufacturers put R&D into technology other than weight reduction. If a little give in the front end and rear end can be done without exceeding the 6.8 kg thresh hold, and is neutral or improves handling, and makes the bike more comfortable, why the heck not? Note I said no weight disadvantage and neutral or improved handling.
We all know that a well designed suspension on rough trails can improve handling and speed, and reduce fatigue - thus also increasing speed in the long run. And make it more fun.
I'm seeing both disc brakes and electronic shifting to be a result of being able to meet that 6.8 kg limit easily with conventional brakes and shifting. If manufacturers were struggling to get down to that limit, they certainly wouldn't be developing and marketing heavier braking and shifting systems.
To me, I'd be more interested in spending extra money and/or weight on this sort of stuff than disc brakes or electronic shifting, since I'm perfectly happy with nice mechanical shifting and rim brakes. But being in my 60s and riding rough chip seal and patched roads often, why not a little comfort give in the frame?
). 
Last edited by hueyhoolihan; 04-03-15 at 01:20 AM.
04-03-15, 01:52 AM
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04-03-15, 03:22 AM
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04-03-15, 04:44 AM
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Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahajajahajaj@aa@aaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
04-03-15, 06:05 AM
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I would laugh, except that I have seen the possible benefit first hand. I did the Paris-Roubaix Challenge ride a few years ago. There were a couple of guys on full suspension mountain bikes out there. While they got completely destroyed by the road bikes on the asphalt, they were absolutely flying on the cobbles. If you could somehow get the benefits of both then you would definitely have an advantage.
04-03-15, 06:07 AM
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Not if you are riding in the Tour of Flanders and Paris Roubaix, which is what the bike is really designed for.
https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/team...-paris-roubaix
It will also be used in the Tour de France for the cobbled stage.
If you read the report, note that the riders say they cannot feel the suspension on pavement.
https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/team...-paris-roubaix
It will also be used in the Tour de France for the cobbled stage.
If you read the report, note that the riders say they cannot feel the suspension on pavement.
Last edited by roadwarrior; 04-03-15 at 06:26 AM.
04-03-15, 06:46 AM
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The question of...is a bit of suspension better or not? Roads are less than perfect and most vehicles have suspension to compensate.
So the question is, what are the tradeoffs to adding some suspension on a road bike?
- Weight?
- Durability?
- Cost?
- Lost of control in and out of the saddle?
- loss of energy transfer?
There is a reason why many prefer a hardtail mountain bike to a dually...some addressed above.
But tech marks on. The Trek Domane introduced some displacement in the saddle some love and others don't. Spesh does it with their COBL seatpost which I am not in personal love with.
Will see how it goes and I will reserve judgement until it has been tested more. A bit of suspension front and rear maybe the next big thing on road bikes as most of us encounter rough roads on our rides which we would all prefer to be easier to ride at higher speed. Its one of the reasons I prefer an endurance geometry...because the frame natively offers more suspension based upon more laid out angles...force is attenuated laterally.
So the question is, what are the tradeoffs to adding some suspension on a road bike?
- Weight?
- Durability?
- Cost?
- Lost of control in and out of the saddle?
- loss of energy transfer?
There is a reason why many prefer a hardtail mountain bike to a dually...some addressed above.
But tech marks on. The Trek Domane introduced some displacement in the saddle some love and others don't. Spesh does it with their COBL seatpost which I am not in personal love with.
Will see how it goes and I will reserve judgement until it has been tested more. A bit of suspension front and rear maybe the next big thing on road bikes as most of us encounter rough roads on our rides which we would all prefer to be easier to ride at higher speed. Its one of the reasons I prefer an endurance geometry...because the frame natively offers more suspension based upon more laid out angles...force is attenuated laterally.
04-03-15, 06:51 AM
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Seems like a reasonable solution to me and much more believable than Specialized's Zertz sillyness. P-R has always had some non-conventional bikes, I remember some suspension forks in the early ninties. Wiggins has said that he loves it and I don't think he's the kind of guy to take this lightly or be a corporate shill.
04-03-15, 06:55 AM
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Just shooting the breeze here....
I wonder if this is a benefit of keeping the official weight limit of racing bikes at 6.8 kg or whatever it is, in spite of it being pretty easy to build a bike lighter than that. It makes manufacturers put R&D into technology other than weight reduction. If a little give in the front end and rear end can be done without exceeding the 6.8 kg thresh hold, and is neutral or improves handling, and makes the bike more comfortable, why the heck not? Note I said no weight disadvantage and neutral or improved handling.
We all know that a well designed suspension on rough trails can improve handling and speed, and reduce fatigue - thus also increasing speed in the long run. And make it more fun.
I'm seeing both disc brakes and electronic shifting to be a result of being able to meet that 6.8 kg limit easily with conventional brakes and shifting. If manufacturers were struggling to get down to that limit, they certainly wouldn't be developing and marketing heavier braking and shifting systems.
To me, I'd be more interested in spending extra money and/or weight on this sort of stuff than disc brakes or electronic shifting, since I'm perfectly happy with nice mechanical shifting and rim brakes. But being in my 60s and riding rough chip seal and patched roads often, why not a little comfort give in the frame?
I wonder if this is a benefit of keeping the official weight limit of racing bikes at 6.8 kg or whatever it is, in spite of it being pretty easy to build a bike lighter than that. It makes manufacturers put R&D into technology other than weight reduction. If a little give in the front end and rear end can be done without exceeding the 6.8 kg thresh hold, and is neutral or improves handling, and makes the bike more comfortable, why the heck not? Note I said no weight disadvantage and neutral or improved handling.
We all know that a well designed suspension on rough trails can improve handling and speed, and reduce fatigue - thus also increasing speed in the long run. And make it more fun.
I'm seeing both disc brakes and electronic shifting to be a result of being able to meet that 6.8 kg limit easily with conventional brakes and shifting. If manufacturers were struggling to get down to that limit, they certainly wouldn't be developing and marketing heavier braking and shifting systems.
To me, I'd be more interested in spending extra money and/or weight on this sort of stuff than disc brakes or electronic shifting, since I'm perfectly happy with nice mechanical shifting and rim brakes. But being in my 60s and riding rough chip seal and patched roads often, why not a little comfort give in the frame?
04-03-15, 07:24 AM
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Pinarello Dogma K8-S rear-suspension road bike released - BikeRadar
Note, however, that it does not have disc brakes--if it did it'd be the ultimate Fred-mobile
(and yes, heresy is tongue in cheek)
Note, however, that it does not have disc brakes--if it did it'd be the ultimate Fred-mobile
(and yes, heresy is tongue in cheek)
04-03-15, 07:24 AM
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Seems like a reasonable solution to me and much more believable than Specialized's Zertz sillyness. P-R has always had some non-conventional bikes, I remember some suspension forks in the early ninties. Wiggins has said that he loves it and I don't think he's the kind of guy to take this lightly or be a corporate shill.
Remember, the 41 is a "think-tank".
04-03-15, 08:12 AM
#25
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Trek has been selling a road bike with rear suspension since 2012, with huge success. You guys don't have a problem with the Domane - why this?
Just for the record, this is essentially the same basic design as the Moots YBB, which has been around for quite a while.
Just for the record, this is essentially the same basic design as the Moots YBB, which has been around for quite a while.