lol. that was my bad, I was in a conversation about head lights on another forum and got mixed up. DUH!!! anyway, still though at 20 lumens is considered to be the lowest powered tail lights you can buy these days and are marginal at best. I've seen these dim type of tail lights on the road and their barely noticeable, but like you said, to each their own, I rather have something significantly brighter and those brighter ones can be bought for not much more money than a person would waste on a dim 20 lumen job. I had a 20 lumen tail light I bought in the mid 90's which was considered bright in its day...LED technology has way surpassed that now. That light I bought in the 90's I threw away because even a cheap Cateye LD600 blew it away, not to mention how much more inferior it would be to my Light & Motion Vis180 (not the Micro Vis180).

By the way, I can see my surroundings at night with my L&M Vis 180, so it could be used as red flashlight if I had to use it as such.