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First P123 race- questions

Old 09-21-14, 08:34 AM
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First P123 race- questions

I did my first P123 race yesterday, and race is kinda a misnomer. It was a makeup for a weekly training series over the summer that splits groups into 4-5, and P123. I have been doing very well in the 4-5's and wanted a challenge and decided to move up to the harder race. Well, 7 guys total in this race. See what I mean by not really a race... The other riders were Cat 1's (4) and 2's (2), and then me. I was able to hang with the front 3 for about 5 laps (1.6 mile laps), then got dropped, as did 3 other riders. My average at that time was 27.4 mph, and I could not sustain that pace. So my question is what kind of training will enable me to perform at that level? I can ride zone 2 all day, and am in very good shape for 44. I don't understand how training at that level (zone 2) will allow me to perform at the much, much higher level of yesterday. I had been hoping to hide in a crowd and just experience a much faster and smoother race, but that did not happen. Should I focus on more intervals this off season, continue with zone 2 or what ..........**********
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Old 09-21-14, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by denvertrout
I was able to hang with the front 3 for about 5 laps (1.6 mile laps), then got dropped,

So my question is what kind of training will enable me to perform at that level?
in a 7 person race, if you're not the strongest you need to be riding like you're the weakest. Hiding from wind, etc.

The hard part where the split occurred was a surge. Either get smart enough to see it coming and get protected right away, or work on short interval efforts to build capacity to handle the surging effort. I find racing does both. There's a million workouts and training threads that are aimed at racers here. Read the sticky workouts or just keep doing what you're doing and you'll see improvement.
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Old 09-21-14, 09:38 AM
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+1

also, just keep showing up, keep blowing up. eventually you'll blow up closer and closer to the finish line.
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Old 09-21-14, 11:42 AM
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7 person race?
Yikes. How was anybody motivated?
Chicks and juniors are used to that style, but p123's just bag it and head out for training miles together instead.
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Old 09-21-14, 02:37 PM
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1) I don't understand why they let you race the p123 race when you are a 4. That's just weird.

2) road race season is over in Colorado, and everyone has moved on to cross or the off season. Not surprised at the low turnout for that, not many people want to spend a beautiful saturday racing a race-course crit. The P123 race you did has little to do with any other P123 race you will do.

3) In your statement highlighted below... how is that relevant? Ability to ride in zone 2 all day is pretty close to a tautology. What does your zone 2 ability have to do with racing a crit? Crits are most often spent coasting or at zone seven, unless you are in the break (caveat - i never get in the break, so I don't know much about that). You need to have a seasonal training plan - the zone 2 you will start doing soon is just the base to allow the interval work you will be doing during build. no amount of zone 2 will prepare you for the surges and sprinting in a crit, it's just the prerequisite for starting that kind of training.

I looked at the results and figured out who you are and looked at your results for the last 2 years.

Don't be in a hurry to upgrade. Build yourself a good training plan (or get a coach to build one for you), and focus on learning how to race in a pack next year.

Most of all - you are doing almost all of your racing on that same CSP course, which has nothing to do with any other race in the area. The corners are gentle, wide and perfectly banked, the pavement is perfect, there are no tight corners. If you only ever race there, you'll only ever be able to race there. Go to the weekend races. Go to Meridian.

Originally Posted by denvertrout
I did my first P123 race yesterday, and race is kinda a misnomer. It was a makeup for a weekly training series over the summer that splits groups into 4-5, and P123. I have been doing very well in the 4-5's and wanted a challenge and decided to move up to the harder race. Well, 7 guys total in this race. See what I mean by not really a race... The other riders were Cat 1's (4) and 2's (2), and then me. I was able to hang with the front 3 for about 5 laps (1.6 mile laps), then got dropped, as did 3 other riders. My average at that time was 27.4 mph, and I could not sustain that pace. So my question is what kind of training will enable me to perform at that level? I can ride zone 2 all day, and am in very good shape for 44. I don't understand how training at that level (zone 2) will allow me to perform at the much, much higher level of yesterday. I had been hoping to hide in a crowd and just experience a much faster and smoother race, but that did not happen. Should I focus on more intervals this off season, continue with zone 2 or what ..........**********
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Old 09-21-14, 06:10 PM
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I love CSP and really like meridian as well, except I am 35 miles north, and I leave almost 2 hours prior to the start to ensure I get there. The zone 2 reference is because all i read about is 80% of training should be zone 2 and I don't get how that will make me faster. I just enjoy the fast safe rides vs super fats 90 degree corners thus csp and meridian. If i just did csp that would be fine with me. Looking for advice on how to match those speeds mainly...
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Old 09-21-14, 06:35 PM
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You are reading the wrong books. There is no simple recipe for speed. It takes a lot of hard work and a solid base. You should start thinking about next season now. Plan out your base, build, and race seasons. Training at Z2 will make you a Fred Champion. Training at threshold all the time will make you a decent tryathlete. Training with intensity all the time will burn you out. It's the balance that matters. Rest is super important.
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Old 09-21-14, 08:07 PM
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Originally Posted by denvertrout
I did my first P123 race yesterday, and race is kinda a misnomer. It was a makeup for a weekly training series over the summer that splits groups into 4-5, and P123. I have been doing very well in the 4-5's and wanted a challenge and decided to move up to the harder race. Well, 7 guys total in this race. See what I mean by not really a race... The other riders were Cat 1's (4) and 2's (2), and then me. I was able to hang with the front 3 for about 5 laps (1.6 mile laps), then got dropped, as did 3 other riders. My average at that time was 27.4 mph, and I could not sustain that pace. So my question is what kind of training will enable me to perform at that level? I can ride zone 2 all day, and am in very good shape for 44. I don't understand how training at that level (zone 2) will allow me to perform at the much, much higher level of yesterday. I had been hoping to hide in a crowd and just experience a much faster and smoother race, but that did not happen. Should I focus on more intervals this off season, continue with zone 2 or what ..........**********
When you have a field of 7 riders you have virtually no shelter. To race with the others you need to be about the same strength as them. If you don't have it then you don't have it. For example for me my FTP is about 200-220 (right now it's more like 200, in 2010 when I upgraded to Cat 2 it was more like 220w). To hold position in a short single file line at a 27-28 mph avg pace I need to put down something like 250-300w. By definition I'll be done in 10-15 minutes. In a 20 rider field it might be 220-250w. In a 80 rider field it might be more like 180-200w (I could avg 27.5 mph at the Cat 2 Tour of Somerville doing only 180w or so, about 80 riders in the field).

In a 20 rider race this year, which is still marginal, I lasted about 30 minutes before getting shelled. I rode like I was the weakest, I hid like crazy, etc, but in the end some gaps opened up in front of me and I was done.

As for training I'm not the guy to ask. I'd just go back there and keep doing the races. Make it a goal to go 6 laps, then 7 laps, etc. Don't do crazy hard rides for the two days before the race. Etc.
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