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See Florida And Die

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See Florida And Die

Old 02-16-24, 08:30 AM
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Florida (and some of its cities) have always been on various lists as unfriendly (and deadly) to cyclists. However, I'm skeptical of these numbers, because I think they need to look more into the "why".

I've cycled in many states (being retired military) as a lifelong commuter and my worst states are Hawaii and South Carolina. Granted this is just my personal experience, so I don't intend to say they are the worst states, rather just in my experience, I would much rather cycle here in Florida than either of those two states.

Two thing I've noticed here in Florida. 1) More cyclists for the entire year, so obviously more chances to be hit. 2) I see a lot of people that ride bikes but do not know the rules of the road and they don't seem to care about lawful riding. I've seen some crazy things, even I have nearly hit someone while driving my truck as they blew thru a stop sign.

This is not to say that Florida can make many improvements in road safety, but I don't have issues with reckless motorist anymore than any other state I've cycled in.




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Old 02-16-24, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by _ForceD_
LOL…You had me until you said this. There are no hills unless you’re riding over a bridge. My rides, in any part of the state, frequently end with “0 ft” elevation gain, and always much less than 10’ per ten miles. But…nice try.

Dan
You have no idea what you are talking about. There is a ridge that runs from the panhandle all the way to Lake Wales in the middle of the state that have plenty of hills. Plenty. Ocala, Gainesville, Mt. DORA, Howey In the Hills, Zephyrhills, dozens of little towns with actual hills.
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Old 02-16-24, 09:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Breadfan
You have no idea what you are talking about.
You’re right. The 21 years living and owning property in the northern part of the state, and now being a part-time resident and property owner in the southern part of the state, and traveling around the state over those years…and riding bikes in them all…means nothing. It was a wisecrack. I know there are hills. But with 50 mile rides that end with less than 100’ elevation gain, I know first-hand there isn’t anything near comparable hill-wise to other areas of the country…even ones that are considered flat. — Dan
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Old 02-16-24, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by _ForceD_
You’re right. The 21 years living and owning property in the northern part of the state, and now being a part-time resident and property owner in the southern part of the state, and traveling around the state over those years…and riding bikes in them all…means nothing. It was a wisecrack. I know there are hills. But with 50 mile rides that end with less than 100’ elevation gain, I know first-hand there isn’t anything near comparable hill-wise to other areas of the country…even ones that are considered flat. — Dan
I agree, yes they are small hills. But they are hills nonetheless. I think the highest point in Florida is 345ft, which is the lowest highest point in the U.S. It's all good.
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Old 02-16-24, 09:51 AM
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I have lived in the Tampa Bay area since I was 6 years old in the 70's. It used to be paradise here. Underpopulated and nice weather year round. The amount of people who have moved here is staggering. I thought I read the population increases by 300,000 per year and Tampa is a big destination. The effect is the somewhat quiet routes I had are filled in with building density and traffic. I'll admit I've been getting more spooked out there. I also ride around the Ocala National Forest. Although it can't be developed, the traffic on the bordering roads has also increased. I have been riding mostly on the forest roads. Oddly enough, it is very rare that I get yelled or honked at. There are some close passers, but that is an unfortunate part of bike riding. Also strange, I've had more yellers and honkers around the Ocala National Forest than in Tampa.

What breaks my heart is how much natural beauty there was in Florida. The beaches are full of condos and everything else gets paved over. It is my wish to leave here post retirement. The only thing I think I'll miss is spanish moss swaying from the old oaks.

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Old 02-16-24, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by bikecrate
I have lived in the Tampa Bay area since I was 6 years old in the 70's. It used to be paradise here. Underpopulated and nice weather year round. The amount of people who have moved here is staggering. I thought I read the population increases by 300,000 per year and Tampa is a big destination. The effect is the somewhat quiet routes I had are filled in with building density and traffic. I'll admit I've been getting more spooked out there. I also ride around the Ocala National Forest. Although it can't be developed, the traffic on the bordering roads has also increased. I have been riding mostly on the forest roads. Oddly enough, it is very rare that I get yelled or honked at. There are some close passers, but that is an unfortunate part of bike riding. Also strange, I've had more yellers and honkers around the Ocala National Forest than in Tampa.

What breaks my heart is how much natural beauty there was in Florida. The beaches are full of condos and everything else gets paved over. It is my wish to leave here post retirement. The only thing I think I'll miss is spanish moss swaying from the old oaks.
I was born in '66 in St.Pete and lived near Central Ave towards the beaches and I go back often, I see what you mean. A lot has changed.
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Old 02-16-24, 11:25 AM
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Same here in Jax, we've grown so much since I first moved down here in 1986. All the country roads are now busy four-lane roadways. We even now need a second area code in Duval county, called an "overlay", requiring us to now use an area code when placing a local call.

And we're still growing all across the entire state: https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/n...-other-states/


Florida leads nation as destination for residents moving from other states

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Old 02-16-24, 09:12 PM
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Fargo to Pembina: 171 miles, 121 feet of elevation change up, 231 feet down.

Fort Meyers to Jacksonville: 335 miles, 1050 feet elevation change up and down.

The east side of ND is flatter than Florida. It's the wind that makes the difference...
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Old 02-17-24, 08:05 AM
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Originally Posted by work4bike
Same here in Jax, we've grown so much since I first moved down here in 1986. All the country roads are now busy four-lane roadways. We even now need a second area code in Duval county, called an "overlay", requiring us to now use an area code when placing a local call.

And we're still growing all across the entire state: https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/n...-other-states/
I first moved to Jax in 1981, and resided there on and off over the next twenty years. Back then, Race Track Rd. off SR-13 in Fruit Cove, just over the county line in St. Johns County…was desolate — two lane, flat, straight as an arrow for 10 miles, no buildings, and hardly any traffic. We would take our motorcycles out there and just open them up. But it was all a descent bicycling routes.

Dan
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Old 02-17-24, 11:32 AM
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I didn't catch exactly weather the bann is in a city or a county. The death of the elderly lady has prompted a knee jerk reaction ban on ebikes, e scooters for 90 days.
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Old 02-17-24, 12:22 PM
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Like anywhere else you need to pick where you ride. In North Florida you can ride along the Ocean for about 100 miles from Fernandina Beach to St Augustine all n bike lane, bike path or residential streets. As scenic a ride as you will find anywhere

In Central Florida there arre actual hills on fairly low trafficked country roads around Clermont.

there are some great rails trails. The Apopka Lake loop trail is a world class ride.

Even in South Florida, the last part I would pick to ride, there are long stretches of bike lane/ paths along the Ocean.

But please keep believing how bad Florida sucks. 1000 people a day move here. We don’t need anymore of you.
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Old 02-17-24, 04:53 PM
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Originally Posted by tcs
How much of that is actual trail and how much of it is on a road that they call trail
(not being snarky, I've just seen a lot of that)
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Old 02-17-24, 05:16 PM
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So I looked at the linked article, which says:
"4. East Baton Rouge County, Florida"
AFAIK, there is no East Baton Rouge County in Florida. Now, there is an East Baton Rouge Parish in LA, and I can see that's not the friendliest place to ride, maybe compared to Orleans County as the article claims.

Now Pasco County is No 1! (I have a house in west Pasco County, and other than US19 don't see why it's worse than any other southern state.) In fact, Fla 52 the main E-W route in the county has excellent bike lane, and there is also the Suncoast Expy bike trail, 52 mile paved route. Probably would not ride US41, but that's me.

But I see the Tampa/St Pete/Sarasota area is claimed to be the worst in the state. No idea if that is true.

As far as "flat Florida", sure, around Tampa it is flat (other than bridge to Clearwater Beach), but on the west side once you're north of Perry it's all rolling hills. Check out Tallahassee/FSU area.

Even on US19, you have bike lane all the way from Pasco County to Georgia state line. Once across the line zero, zip, nada. Tell me that's safer.

scott s.
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Old 02-18-24, 02:01 AM
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just a political hit piece on florida...also many of the comments.
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Old 02-18-24, 02:57 PM
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If you research this, Fla does have the highest bike deaths per 100,000.
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Old 02-19-24, 02:00 PM
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Originally Posted by merlinextraligh
Like anywhere else you need to pick where you ride. In North Florida you can ride along the Ocean for about 100 miles from Fernandina Beach to St Augustine all n bike lane, bike path or residential streets. As scenic a ride as you will find anywhere

In Central Florida there arre actual hills on fairly low trafficked country roads around Clermont.

there are some great rails trails. The Apopka Lake loop trail is a world class ride.

Even in South Florida, the last part I would pick to ride, there are long stretches of bike lane/ paths along the Ocean.

But please keep believing how bad Florida sucks. 1000 people a day move here. We don’t need anymore of you.
I've ridden several times around Fernandina Beach and St. Augustine on vacation. Beautiful areas. Sadly, the only time I've been hit by a car was in a bike lane on Amelia Is. Left hooked. Bike destroyed. I got away with minor scrapes.

Some good hills around the Ocala National Forest too. There are some rides you are either going up or down, no flats.

Sorry to say...I wish people would leave FL too. If high housing prices, impossible to pay for home insurance and devastating hurricanes aren't enough to deter people nothing will.
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Old 03-02-24, 06:12 PM
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Haven't you seen the YT videos of the Polk county Sheriff, Grady Judd, himself?? He is tough as nails on criminals. He's the Sheriff Arpaio of the east. LOL.
And banning e-bikes after a 12 year old runs over a lady?? Hell YAH. Those 2 seat MOTORCYCLES have ZERO in common with bicycles, those in that video, all I see is school KIDS operating them. Way to teach them being LAZY and irresponsible, eh.
That's as safe as having a pet alligator!!!!

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Old 03-02-24, 11:33 PM
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Originally Posted by rydabent
If you research this, Fla does have the highest bike deaths per 100,000.
Similar "research" will probably indicate that there are more swimming and boating accidents per 100,000 people in Florida than occur in North Dakota or Nebraska.
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Old 03-03-24, 07:35 AM
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I'm not defending the ban, but it's a 60-day ban, not a permanent ban. Communities around the country have been having issues with ebikes and how to deal with the problems they bring.

In California they're talking about banning ebikes for 12 and under children. I would think that would be a hard sell, since I'm starting to see ebikes for little kids now....And then there are further restrictions for those over 12


P.S. For you ebike enthusiasts. I know it's not the ebikes, rather it's the operators.

https://www.bicycling.com/news/a4678...lifornia-bill/

A New California Bill Would Make it Mandatory for E-Bike Riders to Need a Driver’s License

THE PROPOSED LEGISLATION WOULD ALSO BAN E-BIKES FOR RIDERS UNDER 12 YEARS OLD.


A controversial new e-bike bill was introduced in California this week by Assemblywoman Tasha Boerner. If passed, children under 12 would be banned from riding e-bikes, and anyone over 12 on an e-bike would require either a valid driver’s license or proof of passing an e-bike safety course as well as valid photo ID—essentially creating an e-bike license.

This type of bill has been introduced before and has historically failed, but according to The San Francisco Standard, 2022 saw the most fatalities and serious injuries for cyclists in five years, including several high-profile deaths of teens riding e-bikes.
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Old 03-03-24, 09:33 AM
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I'm not defending the ban, but it's a 60-day ban, not a permanent ban. Communities around the country have been having issues with ebikes and how to deal with the problems they bring.
It appears that the push to do something is catching on by some highly motivated naysayers. I worry that with this push against ebikes, we are going to see even more push against regular bicycles. There has been no evidence pushed forward that I am aware of that shows the child on the ebike caused the death of the woman in question. In general ebike or no ebike many adults have no better road skills and disobey the right away laws like they did as children. Because ebikes are easier to get there there are more children and adults riding. Has anybody compared this to the amount of people to get an actual per capita.
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Old 03-03-24, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by work4bike
I'm not defending the ban, but it's a 60-day ban, not a permanent ban. Communities around the country have been having issues with ebikes and how to deal with the problems they bring.

In California they're talking about banning ebikes for 12 and under children. I would think that would be a hard sell, since I'm starting to see ebikes for little kids now....And then there are further restrictions for those over 12


P.S. For you ebike enthusiasts. I know it's not the ebikes, rather it's the operators.

https://www.bicycling.com/news/a4678...lifornia-bill/
waaay off topic here. Perhaps you thought you were someplace else.
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Old 03-03-24, 04:04 PM
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Originally Posted by fishboat
waaay off topic here. Perhaps you thought you were someplace else.
No, I was responding to Post #42.
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Old 03-04-24, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by work4bike
No, I was responding to Post #42.
ahh..I have the gambling guy on my ignore list so I didn't see it..of course..he was off topic too..usually is, even when he is on topic. No matter..
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Old 03-06-24, 11:11 AM
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There are a lot of places around the country that I wouldn't want to risk being on a bicycle. Sadly we have more than our fair share of hateful jerks who would love to kill us and get away with it saying "it was an accident," usually in an oversized 4WD truck driving too fast and too aggressively.
.
But, there are usually better places to ride if one does some research on safer routes (not always possible however - sometimes better to bypass the area).

It's better than it used to be despite all the narcissistic murderous egomaniacs in their oversized pickup trucks. 45 years ago in California I was shot at, beer bottles and cans thrown at me, run off the road, spit at, cussed at, and other transgressions just for the sin of riding a bicycle on a public road. That hasn't happened to me in a long time, but I do choose my routes more carefully these days.

Having lived in Europe for 16 years (I'm back in the USA now), I felt much safer riding there. Drivers are better trained and don't tend to let their frustrations out on cyclists - they seem to have a more civilized attitude toward cyclists, giving room on the road, staying behind if it's unsafe to pass, and a general attitude that cyclists truly have rights too.
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Old 03-06-24, 02:31 PM
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@Calsun Warning, no politics.
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