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Woman hit by three cars in Palo Alto

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Woman hit by three cars in Palo Alto

Old 02-29-24, 04:42 PM
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As someone who has operated bicycles with rather bright lights for 40+ years*, and motor vehicles with full SAE warning light systems for nearly that long, all I can say is that increasing conspicuity can help - but only if the approaching road user is focused on the driving/riding task. Unfortunately, it seems the trend hasn't been positive in this regard in recent years. My observation when Arizona passed their driver handheld cell ban was that drivers just moved the phone below window level when continuing to use it. Now they just hold it in plain sight in the expectation of minimal to nonexistent traffic enforcement. :\

*I still have a Belt Beacon, but 9 volt batteries aren't cheap...
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Old 02-29-24, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Calsun
While it may seem sensible to follow the rules in going through city traffic it is also decidedly dangerous.
The most defenseless position any road user can take is to allow other vehicles to catch up/overtake from behind. This is often unavoidable, but I do my very best to never stop in a traffic lane on a bicycle. If it means running red lights, stop signs, making goofy turns, or even riding a sidewalk...I'm going to avoid being a sitting duck out there.

I have no idea what happened to the victim or why, just agreeing with the OP on following traffic rules (laws) to the letter no matter what. That is "decidedly dangerous" and unnecessary in many instances, and just adds to the danger baked into the situation of being the slower, more delicate road user.
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Old 02-29-24, 06:26 PM
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This happened like a week after another cyclist got killed in the next town over, Los Altos on a popular biking road. Probably not even 10 miles away.
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Old 02-29-24, 06:40 PM
  #29  
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I do whatever it takes to be safe. That accident looks like a whole lot of inattentiveness going on. After years of commuting it really comes down to being seen. The guy who ran up my butt in his Mercedes said he never saw me, as he looked at my high vis work vest and flashing red beacon on the totalled bike.
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Old 02-29-24, 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by RCMoeur
As someone who has operated bicycles with rather bright lights for 40+ years*, and motor vehicles with full SAE warning light systems for nearly that long, all I can say is that increasing conspicuity can help - but only if the approaching road user is focused on the driving/riding task. Unfortunately, it seems the trend hasn't been positive in this regard in recent years. My observation when Arizona passed their driver handheld cell ban was that drivers just moved the phone below window level when continuing to use it. Now they just hold it in plain sight in the expectation of minimal to nonexistent traffic enforcement. :\

*I still have a Belt Beacon, but 9 volt batteries aren't cheap...
Why not get 9 V rechargeable and a charger?
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Old 03-01-24, 02:01 AM
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For you lot advocating increased visibility as a method for dealing with cars, you should keep in mind that the professional urban riders (delivery boys and girls) tend not to use lights. Some of my shifts ended at 3 am, and none of my coworkers used lights.
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Old 03-01-24, 03:01 AM
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Originally Posted by LarrySellerz
For you lot advocating increased visibility as a method for dealing with cars, you should keep in mind that the professional urban riders (delivery boys and girls) tend not to use lights. Some of my shifts ended at 3 am, and none of my coworkers used lights.
Why should we care about the cycling habits of a group known for reckless and dangerous behavior?
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Old 03-01-24, 10:29 AM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe
Why should we care about the cycling habits of a group known for reckless and dangerous behavior?
Well, if you compared their accident rate to those that ride daily with lights and reflective clothing you might see some percentage differences. I'm going to guess messengers have been in a few more.
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Old 03-01-24, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by curbtender
Well, if you compared their accident rate to those that ride daily with lights and reflective clothing you might see some percentage differences. I'm going to guess messengers have been in a few more.
Almost certainly true, but Larry was suggesting something else.
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Old 03-01-24, 11:14 AM
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I know. I was never in an accident, well, until I was.
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Old 03-01-24, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe
Why should we care about the cycling habits of a group known for reckless and dangerous behavior?
because they’re more experienced than you, and more adept at dealing with traffic.
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Old 03-01-24, 04:05 PM
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Very sad
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Old 03-01-24, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by LarrySellerz
because they’re more experienced than you, and more adept at dealing with traffic.
I know several people that are into free-soloing, but their climbing experience doesn't make them good examples of safe climbing techniques. You're still safer climbing with a rope, and you're still safer riding at night with a light.
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Old 03-01-24, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by LarrySellerz
because they’re more experienced than you, and more adept at dealing with traffic.
So you say. Any evidence ( besides the hot air emitted from a handful of self-deluded bicycling gas bags) that bicycle delivery boys and girls as a group are more experienced (whatever that means), or more adept at dealing with traffic (whatever that means) than any other group of bicyclists who regularly rides or has regularly ridden in urban traffic?
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Old 03-01-24, 07:19 PM
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike
So you say. Any evidence ( besides the hot air emitted from a handful of self-deluded bicycling gas bags) that bicycle delivery boys and girls as a group are more experienced (whatever that means), or more adept at dealing with traffic (whatever that means) than any other group of bicyclists who regularly rides or has regularly ridden in urban traffic?
do you know another demographic of urban riders who rides around all day? It’s just a time in the saddle/numbers thing.
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Old 03-01-24, 07:30 PM
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Originally Posted by LarrySellerz
do you know another demographic of urban riders who rides around all day? It’s just a time in the saddle/numbers thing.
You seem to be implying that lights do not increase visibility, based on the idea that "professional urban riders" often do not use lights. That's faulty logic, much like arguing that seat belts don't improve crash survivability because delivery drivers often don't use them.
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Old 03-01-24, 09:23 PM
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Originally Posted by LarrySellerz
do you know another demographic of urban riders who rides around all day? It’s just a time in the saddle/numbers thing.
But they're mostly 20-somethings and I'm 54, so um...
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Old 03-02-24, 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by tomato coupe
You seem to be implying that lights do not increase visibility, based on the idea that "professional urban riders" often do not use lights. That's faulty logic, much like arguing that seat belts don't improve crash survivability because delivery drivers often don't use them.
It is the same logic that would support an argument that brakes are unnecessary for safety because a certain demographic of urban jackasses ride around on bikes without them and claim that they are superior riders because (so far) they are still alive.

Habitual drunken drivers have been known to make the same argument.
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Old 03-02-24, 05:25 PM
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It was DARK and RAINING. More lights = more GLARE. Ever passed emergency lights flashing all over??
Yah, I don't see any scenario why car #1 would be going full speed into the girl on a bike, with at least the 2 oncoming cars blocking progress.
The news video with the unhelpful LAB prognosticator, was pointing out a "Green Box" that wasn't green, in front of the turn lane. That's supposed to make somebody safer?? LOL Malarky. It makes some difference IF there's a flashing turn phase, at night? Nope.
She was apparently waiting for opposing cars to stop coming. She risked her life to save MAYBE 8 seconds. FACT. If she's waiting until the light goes yellow, then she has to dodge red light runners from both directions. Is that BETTER?? NO. Otherwise she would already be in position to cross from the right street, and 99.9% SAFE.

>> As for car #2 not stopping, it's hard to blame them leaving. Here's a what IF >> What if car #1 just pushed her sideways, then car #2 did the actual killing??
OR What IF car #2 anticipated the girl getting hit, then slammed on the brakes and gets pushed by car #3 and the girl gets hit anyway??
Who is the lawyers going to go after?? It's a damned lose lose situation.
Every driver's manual says DON'T SWERVE.
So car #1 is still 100% at fault, but the girl still gets some or a lot of the blame. Dead right is still dead. Cyclists are called vulnerable road users by their OWN spokespeople, after all.
RIP dear lady.

Last edited by GamblerGORD53; 03-03-24 at 09:43 AM.
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Old 03-05-24, 08:47 PM
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Originally Posted by GamblerGORD53

>> As for car #2 not stopping, it's hard to blame them leaving.
Surprising to see this opinion on a bike forum. Of course they have a moral responsibility to stop.
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Old 03-07-24, 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by LarrySellerz
Surprising to see this opinion on a bike forum. Of course they have a moral responsibility to stop.
Ditto
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Old 03-15-24, 09:49 PM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by GamblerGORD53
>> As for car #2 not stopping, it's hard to blame them leaving. Here's a what IF >> What if car #1 just pushed her sideways, then car #2 did the actual killing??
OR What IF car #2 anticipated the girl getting hit, then slammed on the brakes and gets pushed by car #3 and the girl gets hit anyway??
Who is the lawyers going to go after?? It's a damned lose lose situation.
On the off-chance that you are serious ( a dubious proposition given the remainder of your comment ), in California, "felony hit and run" applies when a driver leaves the scene of an accident, without leaving identifying information, and someone other than the driver was injured or killed.

The penalty for which is up to 4 years in prison, and up to $10,000 in fines.

So, if you aren't busy for the next couple years, run away after running someone over -- but you better hope no one got your plate.
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