Sometimes there is nothing you can do (close call)
01-24-06, 08:03 PM
#51
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Originally Posted by Expatriate
I find your use of the word "Ignorance" to be highly ironic. Thank you for such wonderful insight.
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"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
01-24-06, 08:11 PM
#52
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Originally Posted by chipcom
Curious, do you think some of us have been cycling all these years without having basic survival skills like planning for Murphy?
I recently toured from Tampa to NYC. The safest I felt--EVER-- was in Manhattan, weaving in and out of traffic. In other words, I have exact and personal experience in dealing with these conditions. I'm wondering if Expat can say something similar.
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01-24-06, 08:23 PM
#53
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Originally Posted by Matthew A Brown
Expat, I think its a fair question. Do you have any experience watching people on bikes in NYC, such that you would label FG riders significantly more reckless than any other group?
Since that really is the key factor for whether "ignorant" is an accurate term or not.
Since that really is the key factor for whether "ignorant" is an accurate term or not.
Originally Posted by Matthew A Brown
Not at all. My statement was not intended to be a judgment on everyone else, but rather to counter this "FG=reckless" idea. (Which while that isn't what Expat wrote, it's degrees on a theme for certain.)
As to this post, you (visitordesign) have apparently not bothered to read anything else I've written in either thread.
Originally Posted by visitordesign
it's ignorant to assume that SS/FG riders are the only ones riding in the manner i've described--particularly since i explain in the preceeding paragraph that it's simply not the case.
if you find that ironic, that ignorance runs deeper than i'd previously suspected.
if you find that ironic, that ignorance runs deeper than i'd previously suspected.
01-24-06, 08:26 PM
#54
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Originally Posted by Expatriate
As to this post, you (visitordesign) have apparently not bothered to read anything else I've written in either thread.
actually, i did. reality and your posts rarely converge.
01-24-06, 08:29 PM
#55
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OK, so do you realize that the videos you see are only representative of a small percentage of riders? As are most videos of any kind of riding?
My problem is that you're opinion has now been applied to far more of us than the riders in the videos. See how that might be annoying, or perceived as ignorant?
My problem is that you're opinion has now been applied to far more of us than the riders in the videos. See how that might be annoying, or perceived as ignorant?
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01-24-06, 08:30 PM
#56
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And honestly, how about you answer my question, rather than quoting me back to myself? Whatever dots are there, I'm not connecting them.
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01-24-06, 08:51 PM
#57
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What seems painfully obvious to me is slowing dawning on some of you.
1) I only meant that baiskeli should have taken steps to avoid being stereotyped as a reckless cyclist.
2) I never said all SS/FG riders are reckless. I used the phrase "One of those ss/fixie guys getting cheap thrills dodging cars".
The funny thing is, if I had substituted "Full kit road cyclists" or "Mountain biker" or even "13 year old punk on a BMX" in place of ss/fixie, this wouldn't be an issue.
[edit] I've added the emphasis, hope that helps.
1) I only meant that baiskeli should have taken steps to avoid being stereotyped as a reckless cyclist.
2) I never said all SS/FG riders are reckless. I used the phrase "One of those ss/fixie guys getting cheap thrills dodging cars".
The funny thing is, if I had substituted "Full kit road cyclists" or "Mountain biker" or even "13 year old punk on a BMX" in place of ss/fixie, this wouldn't be an issue.
[edit] I've added the emphasis, hope that helps.
01-24-06, 08:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Expatriate
Please explain your question. And why aren't you a moderator? I'm not trying to paint everyone in SS/FG with the same brush, but you've made that assumption. As far as the cheap thrills, you are correct. I'm sure the videos of the SS/FG guys cutting in and out of traffic, running lights and stop signs between beer stops, I'm sure that's not just about cheap thrills. So one word for you: Whatever.
What you said was a generalization and it is innappropriate. There are people who obey laws who ride fixed and single speed, yet comments like yours are the reason misconceptions and stereotypes come to exist. Do a lot of people grandstand on their fixed gear bikes? The videos would point to yes - but does that mean that all of them do? Or what about all skateboarders grinding on parked cars? Or are all roadies doping? Or all 'bents for old people or nerds?
Generalizations and stereotypes are rarely a good thing.
01-24-06, 09:10 PM
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I'll agree about the generalizations and stereotypes. But I did not make a sweeping generalization. I was suggesting to baiskeli that he educate the motorist. That guy's not going home to tell his wife he almost collected some poor commuter. He's going to complain to his friends that some reckless kook on a bike, like "One of them bike messengers" nearly ran into him. That's how I see it, and that was the purpose of my post. It was never my intention to upset the ss/fixie members.
01-24-06, 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Expatriate
I'll agree about the generalizations and stereotypes. But I did not make a sweeping generalization. I was suggesting to baiskeli that he educate the motorist. That guy's not going home to tell his wife he almost collected some poor commuter. He's going to complain to his friends that some reckless kook on a bike, like "One of them bike messengers" nearly ran into him. That's how I see it, and that was the purpose of my post. It was never my intention to upset the ss/fixie members.
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"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
01-24-06, 09:50 PM
#61
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I hate those swinger-outers. The ones who swing left then turn right, or swing right then turn left.
But then there are people who want to do a U-Turn. At a 4-way intersection you are supposed to signal left but then you sort of swing right and hit all the corners. It's very confusing.
That's not really what happened to the OP, though. I've seen that happen--where somebody is intending to go one way but then goes another. Somehow you kinda know it might happen before it does. So I listen to my instincts, slow way down and watch the guy to see if he confirms my suspicions. I don't pass him until I know if he's confirmed my suspicions or I was wrong.
By the way, Sheldon Brown rides a FG and he also rides a trike, like me.
But then there are people who want to do a U-Turn. At a 4-way intersection you are supposed to signal left but then you sort of swing right and hit all the corners. It's very confusing.
That's not really what happened to the OP, though. I've seen that happen--where somebody is intending to go one way but then goes another. Somehow you kinda know it might happen before it does. So I listen to my instincts, slow way down and watch the guy to see if he confirms my suspicions. I don't pass him until I know if he's confirmed my suspicions or I was wrong.
By the way, Sheldon Brown rides a FG and he also rides a trike, like me.
01-24-06, 09:55 PM
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Thanks Diane. Can I expect to hear from Sheldon too? 
Wait, he also has a folder and a tandem, like myself.
Wait, he also has a folder and a tandem, like myself.
01-24-06, 10:08 PM
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Originally Posted by chipcom
All roadies are arrogant poseurs, all commuters are car-free counter-culture types or DUI convicts, all BMXers are 10 yrs old with no sense and no fear, all 'bent riders are old wussies with roids, and all MTBers are just plain strange.
All the above are true premises and these assumptions are to be considered as Gospel until someone can prove to MY satisfaction that that these statements are not true.
The only conclusion to draw from these true premises is that I (and those who agree with everything I say) am the one and only true, real, and serious biker who has all the right answers. And it makes no difference if my conclusion doesn't make sense and can't be deduced from the above "true" premises, because, I believe them and, I alone make all the definitions for real, true and/or serious bikers.
01-24-06, 10:12 PM
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Well, looks like it's about to become a VC debate. On the bright side, I'll be off the hook.
01-24-06, 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Expatriate
Well, looks like it's about to become a VC debate. On the bright side, I'll be off the hook.
Besides you wouldn't be off the hook, you're the culprit bringing up the dark side subject. I'll leave it to the signifying monkeys to prattle on about that dead horse subject.
Last edited by I-Like-To-Bike; 01-24-06 at 10:33 PM.
01-24-06, 10:30 PM
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike
By jove, you've got it!
All the above are true premises and these assumptions are to be considered as Gospel until someone can prove to MY satisfaction that that these statements are not true.
The only conclusion to draw from these true premises is that I (and those who agree with everything I say) am the one and only true, real, and serious biker who has all the right answers. And it makes no difference if my conclusion doesn't make sense and can't be deduced from the above "true" premises, because, I believe them and, I alone make all the definitions for real, true and/or serious bikers.
All the above are true premises and these assumptions are to be considered as Gospel until someone can prove to MY satisfaction that that these statements are not true.
The only conclusion to draw from these true premises is that I (and those who agree with everything I say) am the one and only true, real, and serious biker who has all the right answers. And it makes no difference if my conclusion doesn't make sense and can't be deduced from the above "true" premises, because, I believe them and, I alone make all the definitions for real, true and/or serious bikers.
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"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
01-24-06, 10:30 PM
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike
What's to debate? Agree with me or be wrong; couldn't be simpler.
01-24-06, 10:35 PM
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Originally Posted by chipcom
OK Mr. Commuter, are you car-free counter-culture commie, or just a DUI convict with a Bullwinkle T-shirt?
01-24-06, 10:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Expatriate
Yes. Save time, see things my way.
01-24-06, 10:38 PM
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike
I'm car-free everytime I ride my bike and have never been convicted of DUI so therefore I commute-cycle down the path of self-rightousness and fear no evil.
Edit: But if I was a Phearless Phixie Phreak, them truckers couldn't hurt me, right?
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"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
01-24-06, 10:40 PM
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Originally Posted by chipcom
Screw evil, it's them truckers checkin out the bimbo in the convertible in the left lane, while I am on their right, that scare me!
01-24-06, 10:42 PM
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike
But if you read the Good Book you will be comforted.
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"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
"Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey
01-24-06, 10:43 PM
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Originally Posted by chipcom
Screw evil, it's them truckers checkin out the bimbo in the convertible in the left lane, while I am on their right, that scare me!
Edit: But if I was a Phearless Phixie Phreak, them truckers couldn't hurt me, right?
Edit: But if I was a Phearless Phixie Phreak, them truckers couldn't hurt me, right?
01-24-06, 10:44 PM
#74
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Originally Posted by chipcom
and in heaven, either cuz I am dead, or because the bimbo is cradling my broken body in her lap.
01-24-06, 10:46 PM
#75
----
whew! what was this thread about?
oh, yeah cut off by yet another of Boston's excellent drivers- don't you love 'em? Glad you're okay.
Not everywhere, and certainly not in CA. I don't know about MA. I'm pretty sure it is legal to pass a car turning left on the right just about everywhere.
But like I said before, passing on the right is a time to be extra vigilant and to slow down.
HH is right:
oh, yeah cut off by yet another of Boston's excellent drivers- don't you love 'em? Glad you're okay.
Originally Posted by Helmet Head
Originally Posted by dwightonbike
it is illegal to pass cars on the right.
But like I said before, passing on the right is a time to be extra vigilant and to slow down.
For exact requirements, please read the complete text of the laws pertaining to bicyclists and bicycling in Massachusetts. General Laws of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, Chapter 85, Section 11a, Chapter 85, Section 11b, Chapter 85, Section 11c, and Chapter 85, Section 11d.
Your rights
You may ride your bicycle on any public road, street, or bikeway in the Commonwealth, except limited access or express state highways where signs specifically prohibiting bikes have been posted.
You may ride on sidewalks outside business districts, unless local laws prohibit sidewalk riding.
You may use either hand to signal stops and turns.
You may pass cars on the right.
Your rights
You may ride your bicycle on any public road, street, or bikeway in the Commonwealth, except limited access or express state highways where signs specifically prohibiting bikes have been posted.
You may ride on sidewalks outside business districts, unless local laws prohibit sidewalk riding.
You may use either hand to signal stops and turns.
You may pass cars on the right.