Everybody has at least one problem intersection on their commute. Typically for me this is one very wide(6-8 lane) east/west cross-street. The side-street I take which is perpendicular to that street has unfortunately filled with aggressive "short cut" taking motorists. They're trying to beat the traffic on the large capacity cross-streets by detouring up my side-street to the next large capacity north/south road which runs parallel to my side-street.

My side-street is one lane each way only, it's narrow, misaligned and the green light at the major intersection is brief. Despite it being a 50km/h zone motorists regularly charge the stale light well in excess of the limit.

Any attempt to go with traffic results in intimidation, being passed in the middle of the intersection or simply a near death experience on the opposite side of the intersection when the stream of motorists suddenly realizes they can't squeeze between me and the oncoming car making a left(but decides they'll go for it anyways). Lately i've found the only way to make it across "safely" is to filter up and jump the red(cross while all 4 directions are amber/red or red). Life seems better, I'm usually clearly positioned on the opposite side of the intersection in a manner to make passing me impossible while i clear the oncoming traffic backup. Sure I can get a ticket and it does propagate negative stereotypes, but really things are so much better jumping the red at that light that I don't think I could go back to the old way.

Anybody else discover this? I can see why advanced greens for cyclists make such a difference.

I'd be concerned about getting hit by a car whilst crossing the intersection on the 'all-red' phase - The phase is there for a reason, which is that cars tend not to stop immediately when the light turns.

Cross-traffic isn't going that fast and the pause is long enough to allow you time to judge which car won't stop. Some don't. Using a bit of observational skill and your ears you can observe which cars are stopping.

Ever thought of stopping the traffic using the pedestrian walk signal?

John

I don't know about Toronto, but where degnaw and I live the cops would love to see you jumping that red so they could ticket you. I feel for you though, motorists on "short cuts" are the worst lawbreakers around, at least in my experience.

What about detouring over to the street they are avoiding, which sounds like is probably multi lane, making it easier and safer for them to pass you while you control a lane?

I could do that, however it is time consuming and there is no easy way to rejoin traffic on the other side unless I were hop off a curb(not an option in the winter).

Probably one would receive a ticket if the police were undetected. I would be less inclined to jump the light if a cruiser was nearby since motorists suddenly remember their traffic manners in those cases.

No way, i've used that road for a while because it was more direct.. it is even wilder with many large trucks - i gave up. Controlling a lane there was just too dangerous.

I'm a self-confessed light jumper.

However, there are several things to consider.

I'm very particular about lights I'm willing to jump. Never six lanes. Never if a lane is coming off of a freeway. Only if I have a real clear line of sight. Only if the intersection is completely clear. Only if going is more safe than waiting.

I always stop.

I also have learned to watch the patterns and the lights in the other directions.

And I'm well aware I might get a ticket and I'm prepared to have to explain my actions to a judge if need be.

One option is to head for the far curb and wait there for the queued traffic to pass.

I'm a little confused.....

the OP can't cross an arterial road while riding on a 50 km/hr, 1 lane road, because of all the aggressive road users?

I haven't felt endangered on a green or even yellow light by motorists who have previously waited behind me at a red light. They may feel frustrated that I can't always accelerate as fast as the car in front of me if we are queued a long way back, but I'm pretty confident that they aren't going to hit me. I get in the center of the lane when waiting at the red light, and I stay in the center of the line of traffic until we get across the intersection. I haven't been passed in the middle of an intersection by same-lane traffic since I started doing this.

So your solution to other's breaking the law is to break the law yourself? Doesn't strike me as an optimal solution (or even a good one) to the problem you describe.

I agree that waiting in the center of the lane in the traffic stream helps, but many places similar to what the OP describes are indeed very problematic. I regularly cross a road that is 8 lanes wide + 2 center turn lanes + grassy median. And the green cycle on the cross streets is VERY short, with no pedestrian improvements or signals at all. From a standstill at the front of the lineup of cars, I can just barely clear the intersection before it hits red if I accelerate all-out. Motorists get very frustrated by these intersections, because only a few cars usually get to go per light cycle from the cross streets (and usually only 1 or 2 if they're behind me). I ALWAYS get passed in the middle of the intersection, or right after, and there is little I can do to prevent it. I find this kind of intersection is among the most dangerous places I ever ride, but I have to cross the big road somewhere because it's an enormous physical barrier separating different neighborhoods. It's just really problematic when the planners make the cross-street green cycle so short that even motorists have trouble getting through (because they're so concerned with not causing traffic backups on the main street). It's bad for bicyclists and even worse for pedestrians, most of whom cross mid-block by looking for a gap in traffic and running for it. A number of pedestrian and bicycle improvements have been promised for 5 or so years now, but the projects have never moved forward (they always cite lack of funding). So in the meantime, some of us just have to deal with these dangerous situations somehow.

The worst road rage incident I ever experienced was at one of these intersections, because I chose to stop at a yellow rather than head into the intersection (since I obviously would not be able to clear the wide intersection before the opposing green, and really neither could a motorist - but I would have been stuck out there longer). A middle-aged woman behind me leaned on her horn and started screaming because I was preventing her from flooring it to get across. I told her that it wasn't safe for me to go, and she just kept cursing at me, and so I cursed her back (probably not a good idea, but her sustained tirade was annoying me). She actually GOT OUT OF HER CAR and tried to start a fight with me. Then she backed down when she realized that I wasn't intimidated by her. The whole thing was just absurd because she was an older woman trying to start a physical fight with a young guy (me).

what's wrong with getting passed while transecting a major intersection?

I don't suffer under the delusion that motorists never pass while a bicyclist takes the lane across intersections. This is unrealistic.

A cyclist knows the road is too wide to control effectively when the motorists start passing them on both sides.


The pinch at the far side? Shouldn't be a problem, but i guess it could be. Shoot for a safe road position once the stripes and the curb starts again, and keep an eye on what going on behind/to your sides with a mirror, perhaps.

By using tools like hand signals, a mirror, fairly assertive road position, some high viz/daytime visible blinkies, while communicating their intentions clearly to motorists (hopefully!), a cyclist can have some effect on respect for their right of way.

My favorite, insouciant traffic tool? the 'magic fingers' hand signal- hand extended down and to the left, like a slow/stop signal, but with wiggling fingers.

Isn't it illegal to pass in the middle of an intersection? I always thought it was, but I could be wrong. When I'm driving I never pass other cars in intersections because I believe it is dangerous. By passing in an intersection you're introducing another dynamic element into a situation that already has a number of other variables (including people turning, etc). In these wide intersections, motorists who pass are going way outside of the bounds of their lane in order to do so, which is quite dangerous also because it makes it unpredictable where they will end up on the other side.

The problem happens when the road is too narrow to share on the other side. Many times the side road will be too narrow to share, but the intersection on the main road will be huge and wide. So the cyclist needs to control the lane to prevent the pinch on the other side, but can't effectively do so because of all the cars trying to dangerously pass in the intersection (some of whom will attempt to pass at unpredictable or late moments). I agree that communicating with the drivers is key, but that often breaks down at some of these wide intersections with brief green cycles because the drivers get so impatient and road-ragey just from the traffic situation. They're more concerned with making sure they get through without having to wait for another cycle than with doing so safely.

This traffic signal violates MUTCD timing requirements for pedestrians. If there's no ped head, then the green plus yellow time is supposed to be adjusted long enough for pedestrians to cross the intersection safely before the other traffic gets a green.

Lots of DOTs violate this requirement, even in places where there is significant pedestrian volume. However, they make themselves liable to a lawsuit if there is a pedestrian collision due to inadequate time. One such collision in Durham, NC motivated me to start serious advocacy work for pedestrians about 12 years ago. Most of the places I've seen the timing requirement violated are roads with no sidewalks, although there are oftent pedestrian trip generators on both sides of the road. Other places there may be sidewalks. Regardless, if pedestrians may cross the road, the engineers are supposed to comply with MUTCD, and are guilty of professional neglect if they do not.

Since traffic engineers often do not want to delay arterial traffic for such a long time when there is no pedestrian present, they usually employ ped detectors and only provide the ped signal with clearance interval when the button is pressed. Usually the only resistance to this by the engineers is money. But I've seen NCDOT refuse to do this even when the city offered to pay, because the NCDOT engineer didn't want to provide safe timing for pedestrians even when they were detected, and believed that not providing the signal would discourage pedestrians from crossing, which would be good for motorists on the arterial. Needless to say, such engineers get a real earful from me.

Note that activating a pedestrian signal increases the green time for vehicular traffic on the side street. It may not be possible to activate the ped signal and then get back in line with traffic, but sometimes a ped signal is the only way to stop arterial traffic long enough to cross safely.

There are a number of sensor configurations and signal settings that can be used to detect the length of the queue at cross streets and provide a longer green time for vehicle traffic as required. California has been studying ways to automatically detect the speed that vehicles clear intersections, or to detect bicycles specifically, to ensure adequate clearance time. Again, the lack of deployment of solutions mostly about money.

It is in Missouri. No passing within 100 feet of an intersection. It rarely stops it from occurring though.

This sounds like a very accurate description of what we've dealt with here on this road I'm talking about. The thing is, the local planners acknowledge that it's a really serious problem that needs major improvement, but the implementation has been tied up for years due to lack of funding, political infighting, and NIMBYism. Ultimately, the plan is apparently to grade separate the whole arterial as a sort of parkway with ramps and overpasses at all the current intersections. But that plan will cost hundreds of millions of dollars, and so it hasn't happened despite being in the planning stages for several decades. A lot of local advocates have asked for some sort of more minor improvements along the lines of what you just suggested in the interim since the major rebuilding plan is only going to possibly happen at some indeterminate point in the future. So far, that hasn't happened, and I first heard people ask for it about 5 years ago. I've even seen a pedestrian get hit at this same intersection after they got caught in the middle when the cycle changed (why people just plow into someone in the middle when the light turns green is beyond me, but there you go). Luckily they weren't seriously injured, but it's a disaster waiting to happen.

The arterial even has sidewalks, and a fairly significant level of pedestrian traffic (there are grocery stores and other retail along with residential areas on both sides). And I got the same reasoning when I complained about the lack of safe pedestrian crossings or timings: they felt their liability would increase if they "encouraged" pedestrians to cross by putting in cross walks or pedestrian signals, and they claimed that no one would actually try to cross on foot as it is because it would be "suicidal". In other words, they claimed there was nothing they could do short of totally realigning the intersections. I know that people cross on foot quite frequently right now, but they didn't seem too convinced by my anecdotal evidence of that. It's a frustrating situation.

I jump lights often and even do so in front of cops. The one time I was pulled over for doing it, I didn't get scratched. There's the law and there's the spirit of the law. The last time I did it in front of a cop was to get the jump on some dingus who was eating a bowl of cereal behind the wheel at a light. He saw me looking at the dingus, looked at the dingus and shook his head. There's no way he was going to pull me over for that light jump.

There is a lot to be said for the statement when in Rome - do as the Romans do. My solution is only one of three, though i have used all at this intersection under different circumstances.

1. Jump the red
2. Dismount and walk cross-walk
3. Stop near curb at other side(I would be required to cycle into the cross-walk at some point)

#1 Is the fastest, though you may get ticketed. (So far most motorists seem happy I am simply out of their way and could care less if i jumped the light. I am also happy to be out of their way.)
#2 Is time consuming... even walking i would have to jog across the intersection with bicycle in hand
#3 Sounds a bit dangerous because you're exposed on the corner(if a left turner hit somebody going straight you're in the kill zone) and also not good if somebody on the cross-street is turning right.

If you're in possession of the optimal solution, myrridin get off your high horse and post it.

To the people who think crossing this intersection is easy and being passed is no problem, I want to remind them it's misaligned with one narrow lane each side(worse now with snow banks and deeply recessed sewer grates) with lots of left-turners on the other side. The oncoming left-turners immediately move into the intersection and being to creep left once the light turns, further narrowing the traffic lane. This means most people who decide to pass me will have to engage in significant weaving motions. Scary because people can't drive. Taking the lane results in frequently being passed in an even more aggressive manner. I'm sure if I really "took the lane" i'd be passed on the left. A while ago I began to filter-forward because traffic is piled up pretty good and if i don't filter close enough to the intersection i'll usually be right-hooked at the last moment because the distance between the stop-line and the end of the queue is long enough to allow people to get going 50km/h plus.

In short, have no doubt, it's a dangerous intersection.

This explains another arterial intersection I traverse. I can not make it across this light and it is on a downhill(i don't dare run the green, instead if it's a late green i just wait), I often wondered how on earth would a pedestrian get across if they started to cross near the end of the green signal if i can't clear the intersection on my bicycle if i enter near the end of that cycle.

I often times found acting like a vehicle was much safer than first thought.




can we get a google location for this thread?

No. The cross-street was actually widened another two lanes after Google drove by anyways, so it's useless.

so now its an actual 2 lane, each direction road you ride on to cross this more major road?

I'm still terribly confused why simply taking the lane and charting a safe line thru the intersection isn't working for you.

Do you: use a mirror? ride in high viz clothing? confidently take the lane? run a daytime bright LED blinkie like a Minewt 150, vis360 or other high powered LED bike safety light, to mitigate oncoming traffic conflicts? Attempt to signal some passing clearance or lane claiming with the holdback signal?

Are you trying any of these tactics? Endorsed by many high mileage cyclists.....

I don't see why passing during the intersection is such a problem. sure, it may not be legal many places. but it IS inevitable if there is speed differential and there's room to pass.

This is one irrefutable element about US bicycling. if there's a speed differential and there appears to be room (and even when there isn't) many motorists will attempt to pass a bicyclist. it can be in a double yellow, no passing school zone, and a motorist will try to pass. you can be doing the speed limit, taking the lane approaching a red light, and many motorists will attempt to pass.

Passing is inevitable. Cope.


you choose a safe line, and let the faster traffic pass. hopefully on the desired side. Trying to control a North Carolina style, superwide lane? Cars will spool on either side of you approaching the intersection.