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Thru to QR conversion

Old 03-03-18, 02:56 PM
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jwh20 
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Thru to QR conversion

Hi All, I picked up a set of Oval 327CX Disc wheels which I'd like to put on my Specialized Diverge. The front is no problem at all, both the wheel and the bike use 12mm thru-axle.

The rear is a problem as the bike has:

135mm QR

But the wheel has:

142mm/12mm thru-axle

I did some searching for adapters and converters but there is a bewildering spectrum of pieces and parts and I'm not totally sure what I'm needing here. First of all the axle is too long but it extends quite a distance beyond where I believe it needs to in order to work right. So is there a replacement axle of some sort that I can get that will work here? I suppose I could grind down the end pieces (not sure that's the right name) and cut part of the axle out but that seems messy and I'd like to find the right pieces to just make this drop-in. Probably going to need a 12mm to QR adapter but that won't work until I get this width problem resolved.

Thanks in advance! This is my first foray into thru-axle mechanics. Hoping to learn something new here.
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Old 03-03-18, 03:58 PM
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The first thing you need to specify before any meaningful advice can be given is what brand/model hub you have.

Some hubs are convertable, some are not.
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Old 03-03-18, 04:04 PM
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there are widgets for truing stands , to service those wheels....

but you went down the TA rabbit hole, maybe N+1 time, get another bike without that specification.


Off road the rear wheel goes first.. I see QR rears and TA forks, so when you trash your rear wheel , it will cost less to replace..





....
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Old 03-03-18, 04:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Kapusta View Post
The first thing you need to specify before any meaningful advice can be given is what brand/model hub you have.

Some hubs are convertable, some are not.
It just says "Oval" on it. Any tips on how to better identify it?
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Old 03-03-18, 05:42 PM
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Website says.......

* Thru Axle or Quick Release axle (not convertible)

https://www.ovalconcepts.com/aero/wheels/327d-wheels
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Old 03-03-18, 06:16 PM
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Originally Posted by cobba View Post
Website says.......

* Thru Axle or Quick Release axle (not convertible)
I'll just point out that if everything a manufacturer said couldn't be done really could not be done, a whole lot of popular and useful bicycle mods would never happen.
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Old 03-03-18, 08:16 PM
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Originally Posted by jwh20 View Post
I'll just point out that if everything a manufacturer said couldn't be done really could not be done, a whole lot of popular and useful bicycle mods would never happen.
In this case I would go with what the manufacturer states, unless you have a precision metal lathe in your basement.
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Old 03-03-18, 08:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Kapusta View Post
In this case I would go with what the manufacturer states, unless you have a precision metal lathe in your basement.
I don't have one but I have considered buying one in the past. My problem is that I've not touched a metal lathe since shop class in the 8th grade. If I can't find something off-the-shelf I may take the parts to a local machine shop and see if they can make it work. If the threaded axle was cut down to 135mm by taking 3.5mm off each end, and the two end nuts were "shaved" down by 3.5mm each, the entire assembly would fit and then using a 12 x 135mm thru axle to QR adapter (these seem to be pretty common) it should work.

Any thought on why this wouldn't work?
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Old 03-03-18, 08:45 PM
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Originally Posted by jwh20 View Post
I don't have one but I have considered buying one in the past. My problem is that I've not touched a metal lathe since shop class in the 8th grade. If I can't find something off-the-shelf I may take the parts to a local machine shop and see if they can make it work. If the threaded axle was cut down to 135mm by taking 3.5mm off each end, and the two end nuts were "shaved" down by 3.5mm each, the entire assembly would fit and then using a 12 x 135mm thru axle to QR adapter (these seem to be pretty common) it should work.

Any thought on why this wouldn't work?
I am not really following you.

IF you can shave off 3.5 mm off each side of the hub, then I have seen thru axles that let you run a 135x12mm TA hub in a 135mm QR frame. Like this: https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/us/en/nukeproof-conversion-kit-qr-rear/rp-prod34779

I am not sure how you could fit the current 12mm axle into the QR dropouts. It is not just a matter of cuttig the length down, it is too thick (12mm) to fit in the QR dropout (10mm).

Last edited by Kapusta; 03-03-18 at 08:54 PM.
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Old 03-03-18, 08:45 PM
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Originally Posted by jwh20 View Post
I don't have one but I have considered buying one in the past. My problem is that I've not touched a metal lathe since shop class in the 8th grade. If I can't find something off-the-shelf I may take the parts to a local machine shop and see if they can make it work. If the threaded axle was cut down to 135mm by taking 3.5mm off each end, and the two end nuts were "shaved" down by 3.5mm each, the entire assembly would fit and then using a 12 x 135mm thru axle to QR adapter (these seem to be pretty common) it should work.

Any thought on why this wouldn't work?
You'd have to disassemble the wheel, then pay the $100+ an hour for a machinist, so at least $80 shop time.

Then you'd have to rebuild the wheel. If a shop does this that's another $40 at least.

Best bet would be to post the rear wheel for trade.
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Old 03-03-18, 08:46 PM
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Some hubs have removable end caps that switch between QR and quick release. Email oval with the exact model of your wheels and they should be able to let you know.

Otherwise, buy the right wheels.
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Old 03-03-18, 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Kapusta View Post
I am not really following you.

If you can shave off 3.5 mm off each side of the hub, then I have seen thru axles that let you run a 135x12mm TA hub in a 135mm QR frame.

I am not sure how you could fit the current 12mm axle into the QR dropouts. It is not just a matter of cuttig the length down, it is too thick (12mm) to fit in the QR dropout (10mm).
I guess I'm not following this fully. If I reduce the length of the threaded part that goes through the hub, it comes out easily and is just a threaded rod with a 12mm inner diameter, then the hub will fit perfectly between the dropout on my bike. So I just need something like the URL you posted to go inside the threaded rod and leave a 5mm hole for the skewer and the short extensions on each end that fit into the dropout slots.

I'd post a picture but I'm too new to this forum, although a couple more posts and I should be able to.
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Old 03-03-18, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by jwh20 View Post
I guess I'm not following this fully. If I reduce the length of the threaded part that goes through the hub, it comes out easily and is just a threaded rod with a 12mm inner diameter, then the hub will fit perfectly between the dropout on my bike. So I just need something like the URL you posted to go inside the threaded rod and leave a 5mm hole for the skewer and the short extensions on each end that fit into the dropout slots.

I'd post a picture but I'm too new to this forum, although a couple more posts and I should be able to.
I think pics would help here.
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Old 03-04-18, 05:28 AM
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If you manage to remove 7mm off the width of the hub, all you would need is .......

https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/u.../rp-prod34779?
and
https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/u...ar/rp-prod5855


They would basically turn the 12mm thru axle hub into something like......

https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/u.../rp-prod155163
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Old 03-04-18, 06:13 AM
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These thru axle hub converters have o-rings on them, they would be a tighter fit in the hub.

https://www.mtbtools.com/product/ada...ear-hub-frame/
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Old 03-04-18, 03:37 PM
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I have some photos but still can't post any of them. I have developed a plan on how to modify the parts to make it work and the measurements I've made indicate to me that it should work.

I could probably do the work myself but the results would be less than desirable. I believe the proper tool here would be a mini lathe. While I've wanted one for a while, the $500 price tag is more than I want to pay for something that I might use once in a blue moon.

I'm a member of a motorcycle forum where there are a number of amazing machinists who seem to be able to work some real magic with their tools. I've posted there looking for one of them who would be willing to take on this, probably relatively simple, job.

Once I get to the magic 10 post threshold, I'll post what I've got and what I'm thinking so your bicycle gurus can point out any problems with my thinking.
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Old 03-05-18, 06:51 AM
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Here's a photo of the wheel:



Here is the axle shaft assembly removed from the wheel:



Here is the axle shaft disassembled:



As shown in the photo, I think that removing 3.5mm from each end will make this the right length.

This is the end cap:



And I think removing 3.5mm from each of these as shown here will make the whole thing work:


Last edited by jwh20; 03-05-18 at 06:55 AM.
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Old 03-05-18, 07:00 AM
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Here is a photo of my current wheel from the bike, the axle flat extends 1mm beyond the cassette lock nut:



And the brake side, the flat extends 15mm beyond the brake rotor mounting flange:



So here's what the Oval wheel looks like with a cassette installed. Note that it extends 4.5mm out from the lock nut:



So 4.5 - 3.5 = 1.0 mm. That should match the stock wheel. And then the brake side where the end extends out 18.5mm:



So removing 3.5mm leave 15mm which also matches the stock wheel.

Thoughts?
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Old 03-05-18, 07:44 AM
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Does this hub have sealed cartridge bearings or cup and cone loose bearings?
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Old 03-05-18, 09:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Kapusta View Post
Does this hub have sealed cartridge bearings or cup and cone loose bearings?
Sealed cartridge bearings. No cup/cone.

The axle slides into the inner bearing races and the black pieces (not sure whey they are called) hold the bearings in place.
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Old 03-05-18, 09:49 AM
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May be an Idea to start a Company, making what you want, and perhaps others may too..

Ideas:
a tandem axle is available .. 145 * is a common length, 10mm x 1 thread per MM,,is Shimano's , and thus a common thread spec.

then you have to sleeve it out, to 12mm for bearing support so a threaded sleeve needs making...

Its solvable.. with a machine shop..

*There are longer as well..




...

Last edited by fietsbob; 03-05-18 at 11:04 AM.
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Old 03-05-18, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by jwh20 View Post
Sealed cartridge bearings. No cup/cone.

The axle slides into the inner bearing races and the black pieces (not sure whey they are called) hold the bearings in place.
OK, I now get the gist of what you are thinking of doing and why it should work. Sounds reasonable on its face, though to be honest, i donít completely folllow everything you are covering here, and probably wonít without the hub in hand, as it seems a little differently configured than my 142x12 rear hub.

That said, it seems to me you have scoped this out as well as anyone could, and if you feel confident that these mods can be done with a reasonable amount of accuracy and precision, I say go for it.

Would love to see pics of the process, as well and the result.

Good luck!
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Old 03-05-18, 09:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Kapusta View Post
OK, I now get the gist of what you are thinking of doing and why it should work. Sounds reasonable on its face, though to be honest, i don’t completely folllow everything you are covering here, and probably won’t without the hub in hand, as it seems a little differently configured than my 142x12 rear hub.

That said, it seems to me you have scoped this out as well as anyone could, and if you feel confident that these mods can be done with a reasonable amount of accuracy and precision, I say go for it.

Would love to see pics of the process, as well and the result.

Good luck!
It seems there is a wide variety of styles when it comes to thru-axle hubs. For years they were basically all the same. Now, all bets are off. Of course I'll document what I'm doing as best I can.

As far as precision is concerned, I don't think it's all that critical. There are several mm's of adjustment in the assembly now and there will continue to be after. I think the biggest thing will be getting the L-R position of this to match the original wheel since I'd like to be able to swap them without having to re-adjust everything.
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Old 03-06-18, 07:09 AM
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I've located a local machinist and discussed this with him. He's quoted me a price is $50 to modify the parts as required.
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Old 03-06-18, 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by jwh20 View Post
I've located a local machinist and discussed this with him. He's quoted me a price is $50 to modify the parts as required.
Sounds like a winner.

Heck, I spent more on the parts to convert a hub that was designed to be convertible.
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