Does anyone make the small co2 type cartridges with nitrogen in them??

Why are you trying to fill your tires with nitrogen? You ride your bike in NASCAR?

Nitrogen holds the correct tire pressure longer than air. 1psi over 6 months is one report I read.

Museums often pump their archival storage cases with argon for both its protective inertness and the longevity that you mention. Large molecules = less leakage. Hooray for Graham's Law of Effusion!

Putting sufficient nitrogen to fill a normal road tire to normal pressure (say 100 psi) into those small cylinders would require the nitrogen be under thousands of PSI and the cylinders would have to be much too heavy and dangerous to use. CO2 liquefies at reasonable pressure so the amount in the cylinders is much greater than if it were just a compressed gas and the cylinders can be suitably light.

BTW what makes you think nitrogen escapes much slower than air? Who ever told you is spouting nonsense. Air is 78% nitrogen already. This entire nitrogen in tires business is a scam for almost everybody.

Given typical bike tire pressures, even if the report you read was correct, you'll be waiting a number of years to notice any difference. The practical issue has more to do with moisture inside your tube, as the vapor pressure of water changes dramatically over (say) the 40-100F temp range. Even that will only affect the pressure by at most 1-2 psi.

Argon is used for it's inertness to protect valuable artifacts from oxidation. BTW, The Nitrogen molecule isn't larger than "air" since it 78% of air already.

You may have noticed that I mentioned the inertness already. In addition, Argon and Krypton have the added benefit of slow effusion due to large size. That is why they are preferred to smaller inert molecules, such as neon, for archival purposes.

Also, I never said that nitrogen offered any added size benefits, I was referring to Argon. Sorry for the ambiguity. I agree with you, this nitrogen theory is bogus. My post was meant to be sarcastic.

Of course, if someone insists on using nitrogen in their tires, it can be bought in liquid form and stored in open containers. It costs less than milk and is fun at parties.

Argon is much heavier than air. Drop a balloon filled with argon - it goes 'Thump' on the floor.

Me -

CEO of the Big-Bang Bicycle Company in Lakehurst, NJ - home of the hydrogen-inflating bike-pumps.

Nitrogen in car tires is a big scam.

The only reason why race cars use 100% nitrogen in their tires is so there is no water vapor in the tire. The tires get so hot that the water vapor will alter the air pressure thus throwing off handling. Normal car tires or bicycle tires will never get that hot.

They could if you filled 'em up with Hydrogen.

Argon has a lower molecular weight and smaller diameter than CO2. The permeability of rubber to a gas isn't completely defined by the size or mass of the gas in question.

Folks, I think before you start trashing an idea, maybe you should do a little research. I commute 40,000 miles a year. I run through a set of tires every 12 to 18 months. I put nitrogen in two new tires and air in the other two new tires on my Suzuki SX4. The left side, with air needs to be topped up or adjusted everytime the seasons change. The right side with N2 hasn't been touched in over a year and those tires are wearing better as well. I have been so pleased with the performance in my car's tires, I plan to try it in my bikes as well. Looks like the only way to do it is with one of those high pressure cylinders and a regulator to drop the pressure. This equipment could cost half as much as one of my bikes so I'll just take it to the shop where they inflate my car tires to test the idea.

I used to rent a lot of gas-cylinders with regulators from my chemistry labs. From what I've read, eperimenting with gases and gas combinations to inflate tires is a wide open field.

I wonder what chlorine would do.....

Highly subjective evidence there.

So each of us is supposed to spend money and time conducting 50K mile research tests on nitrogen, fuel magnets, duralube, etc. before we can conclude that these things are worthless scams based on solid scientific evidence of other people who have already done good research? Not to mention that most of these things can be discounted as scams using nothing more than plain old common sense.

Nitrogen in tires is one of those things that has a VERY tiny bit of effect that might make a difference in very demanding conditions like racing. But for consumer applications, it's a scam.

- Mark

If pure, it is non-reacting unlike oxygen. And it's a tiny bit lighter than air itself. If one ran air and nitrogen through a scrubber for water-vapor, there would be no significant difference in either's performance.

The problem is in 6-months, a 100psi bike-tyre is going to be at about 40-50psi. Using nitrogen so that you can have 41-51psi is absolutely irrelevant because you will still have to pump it back up to ride anyway. And if you wait 6-months between rides, I doubt the cost of nitrogen equipment will offset 30-seconds with a bike-pump.

Here's some articles of interest:

https://www.howstuffworks.com/question594.htm
https://www.straightdope.com/columns/...instead-of-air
https://ahotcupofjoe.wordpress.com/20...re-scam-part-3 (has deflation-rates compared to normal air)
https://www.nitrogendirect.com/N2Info.htm (marketing spiel to tyre shoppes)

Basically, if you're not racing your car, you'd get no performance benefits to using nitrogen. And on a bike, you never get the tyres very hot anyway. Even then, extra pressure doesn't change the shape of the bike tyre much (compared to a car's tyre), so there's zero benefits in terms of performance.

Your right side tires are wearing better because there is less weight on the right side of the car. Both the driver and gas tank are on the left side.

I understand the moleucular size benefit. Actually it's atomic size in this case as the inert gasses are all monoatomic. I also realized your posting was a bit sarcastic but wasn't sure the OP would.

Liquid nitrogen is stored in low pressure containers at cryogenic temperatures and evaporates over time. You would have to replace or refill the container/tank periodically even if it's not used so you better be servicing a lot of tires.

Actually, it's not particularly cheap. My former employeer used a lot of liquid nitrogen as an inert purge gas and it was as expensive as natural gas even in full bulk truck quantities.

I've also seen the party tricks of shattering bananas and rubber hoses after dipping them in the liquid. Be careful of storing these containers in a closed room. The evaporating gas could displace enough air to suffocate your guests. This is better done at outside parties.

As mentioned earlier, the sole advantage is that nitrogen is normally much dryer than simple compressed air, so it maintains the same pressure over a wider temp range.
The oft quoted arguement that nitrogen has a larger molecule so it does 'leak' out like compressed air is bogus. 'Air' is 78% nitrogen, so if low tires were caused by the other components migrating through the rubber, they'd leave the nitrogen behind. Which means that with about three top-ups, you'd have nearly pure nitrogen in the tire anyway.


Ken.

While there are no "scientific double blind studies" the article is interesting.


https://www.bicycling.com/article/1,6...ve+You+An+Edge

All the supposed benefits wouldn't be because Keith Bartleson, the USCF cycling coach, is spearheading a commercial operation of Purigen98 and its $5 to $10 per tire rate now, would it?

All nonsense.
The reason for pressure drop in road bike tires is microbes inside the tubes converting O2 into solids.
N2 suffocates them. Which is no more than they deserve.

"BTW what makes you think nitrogen escapes much slower than air? Who ever told you is spouting nonsense. Air is 78% nitrogen already. This entire nitrogen in tires business is a scam for almost everybody."

The other 22% is what you're eliminating, mostly oxygen,(which does escape faster than the nitrogen) as well as water vapor, & trace gases. It's PURE nitrogen vs air, not just having some nitrogen in there. Worth doing if it's cheap & easy, but for tire dealers it's a profit tool, hence their high prices for it.