Sorry for so many threads, I have so many questions

Do you think water/rust inside the frame compromises the frame's credibility? Is there a way to prevent this?

There was a thread on this in C&V last week, https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...bitor-Question

For rust inside a frame, yes it will eat through eventually, but for most frames, the frame will have been scrapped long before this happens. Would look in motorcycle shops suppliers for rust inhibitors which you can spray inside the frame.

frame saver, t9, lps3, amsoil hdmp

It depends how long the water damage has been going on and how thin the tubing is. thin wall, high quality tubing is far more suseptable to rust-caused failure than heavy wall Hi-ten frames. If the rust is still superficial or the frame is new, you can protect it very effectively by treating the tubes' interior with Weigel's "Frame Saver" that you can get at most bike shops or Amsoil HDMP which is available at many auto supply stores. They are both a rust-inhibitor treated wax dissolved in a volatile carrier and packaged in an aerosol can. They appear to be the identical product but the Amsoil version comes in a larger can for less money.

To do it properly, the frame should be stripped of all of it's components and all of the frame the tubes sprayed inside with a copious amount of the protectant and rolled around to distribute the liquid over the entire surface. Allow it to dry (outside on newspaper) overnight and repeat. Be sure to spray into the vent holes of the chain stays, seat stays and fork blades if it's a steel fork. Done properly, this treatment should protect the frame from rust damage for decades.

Check with Eastwood, an automotive restoration supplier. They have a rust converting primer with a long spray straw designed for spraying into hard to reach places. It chemically converts light rust into an inert substance that seals the surface against further corrosion. It is a paint (primer) so mask the outside of your bike as needed to prevent overspray from settling on the paintjob.

steel may, because of condensation, bring in water vapor, onto cold steel and
a inner coating mentioned above,may help.
as the water vapor is fresh water, i cannot see it being an issue inside aluminum stuff.

Frame Saver. Messy but works well.

I have no doubt that happens, just not nearly frequently enough to blip my radar.

How do you know Frame Saver works?

My retro grouch bike is over 20 years old. It shows some rust on the exterior cable guides, but none internally. If I had treated it with frame saver when it was new, I'd be saying that frame saver works too.

Frame longevity is also a function of how it is stored and treated. A steel frame ridden mostly in dry weather, not used near salt water and kept in temperate storage will indeed last for decades. A friend has a 1971 Raleigh Super Course built from Reynolds 531 tubing that has never been internally treated and is still structurally sound after 41 years so Frame Save or it's equivalent certainly isn't essential for most bikes. However, if you live in an agressively corrosive area, ride the bike in inclement weather and/or store it outside a lot, Frame Saver is cheap insurance.

I treated my new Surly Cross Check frame and fork with HDMP when I first got it as it is my rain/snow/beater bike and is ridden almost exclusively in lousy weaher. Would it have lasted a long time without the treatment? Probably, but now I don't have any worries and for the $2 or so in materials why not?

This discussion leads me to question whether or not the wonderful job I did with the framesaver on a bare metal frame was compromised when I had it powder coated? If the frame savers are mostly wax and if the frame was baked @ 450 degrees, how much protection do I have? I live on salt water and ride year round in Seattle-my curiosity is piqued. Next time I think I'll powder coat and then use framesaver?

I expect the heat did indeed melt out most of the Frame Saver coating but, of course, it can be redone at any time. It's work to do it right as the frame should be stripped nearly bare and then the cleanup afterward is a bit messy but I think it's worth the trouble for the peace of mind. BTW, kerosene or OMS will remove the overspray and drips very well and shouldn't damage the powdercoat at all.

This frame saver seems very interesting. Can you apply it on rusty frames with chipped off paint? Also, did you guys spray it inside the frame as well?

It shows some rust on the exterior cable guides, but none internally. If I had treated it with frame saver when it was new, I'd be saying that frame saver works too.

You spray it ONLY inside the frame tubing as it's a protective coating for bare metal. Paint goes on the outside.

I just spray one squirt of WD-40 into the vent holes on the frame about once every one to two months, and every time I overhaul the bottom bracket I give the seat tube a good coating of WD-40. Unless you already have serious rust going on in there, then WD-40 is sufficient to stop what's going on and protect from further corrosion.