Sorry for all the questions, I'm fairly new to biking and I want to finish my Road Bike build over the winter. #1. Is their a major difference between the Chorus, Centaur, and Volece cassettes, #2. is their a major difference between the cheaper Campagnolo cassettes and the Miche cassettes. I appreciate any info.

Joe D

The lower line Campy cassettes (Centaur and Veloce) are a bit heavier than their upper crust brothers and have all steel cogs rather than the Ti cogs available on Record cassettes. Otherwise they shift every bit as well and are at least as durable. I've used Chorus and Veloce 10-speed cassettes and I defy you to tell the difference without weighing them (or seeing the invoice).

I have no experience with Miche cassettes but the reports I've read are mixed. Unless Campy doesn't make a cog range you need and Miche does, I see no reason not to use Campy.

Thank You for the quick reply. Just what I thought. just needed some confirmation. Thanks Again...

Joe D

Chorus cassettes have the last 2 (11-21, 11-23, 11-25, and 12-23) or 3 (all others) pairs of cogs on aluminum carriers. The cogs have a nickel-chrome finish.

Centaur has the last pair on carriers except all loose cogs were used for all years' 14-23 and all combinations in 2009-2010. The cogs have a nickel-chrome finish.

Veloce has all loose cogs. 2009 and newer are galvanized which is shinier and more yellow. Older are nickel-chrome.

Record has the four large cogs made out of titanium. Some combinations were available in all titanium. Construction is otherwise the same as Chorus.

The ramps are the same and they shift the same. The nickel-chrome cogs are identical across all levels. The hard nickel-chrome finish lasts a long time although I haven't a clue how the galvanizing holds up.

The Campagnolo shift ramps are in different rotational positions depending on what cogs are being combined. For instance, there's 21A cog after the 16A-17A-19A sequence; 21C which follows the 18C-19C combination; 21D behind 20D; and 21G cog which continues 15A-17G-19G.

I followed a 13A first position cog in the 8 speed era with a 14B and noted sluggish shifting compared to the correct 13B-14B or 13A-14A combinations but couldn't say how that works now.

Miche makes one cog configuration for all positions (and actually sells cogs separately for arbitrary combinations). Some people are happy, some not, but I couldn't speak to that personally.

I generally buy the least expensive nickel-chrome Campagnolo cassettes I can get but have a couple of used Chorus and Record units on my parts shelf.

The most important difference is that Miche cassettes are all loose sprockets going directly to the hub with spacers in between. Better Campy cassettes have the larger sprockets on carriers (spiders or what have you) with only the smaller sprockets sliding on the hub.

This can be important because Campy hums have aluminum freehub bodies, and at high torque sprockets can cut into the body a bit. Sometimes it's only minor, but I've seen many hubs where the raised metal this causes makes it near impossible to remove sprockets.

So if you're not in a hilly, use 23t cassettes, and don't pound biggish gears up short steep hills, you needn't worry. But if you want a 28t and climb steep hills in your 39/28 combination you really want to use the Campy cassettes so you don't beat up the freehub as much.

I have used the miche and all the campy ones but the chorus.

Miche has two types of cassettes, the normal ones made of steel and the supertype that is the super nice one with titanium cogs i believe.

Never had a problem with the miche one, since is steel can be kind'a noisy compared with a record 10 for example but they work. The nice about the miche is that are not clusters but individual cogs so you can make your own combination of cassette. But functionally miche works just fine paired to record stuff, no idea about the lower groups sorry.

I've been using Veloce 10-speed cassettes for the past few years and found they wear very well so the galvanizing isn't much of a negative. As to Veloce cassettes being all loose cogs, that's absolutely right but even with the 13x29 set I use and hills I climb every day, I've never had any damage to the Chorus' hub's freehub body splines.

If money is an issue, the Veloce cassettes have worked very well. If cost isn't an issue, go as upscale as you want.

Have you seen that with Campagnolo splined freehubs, especially of Campagnolo construction and not just other manufacturers Shimano/SRAM splined parts?

Campagnolo 9/10/11 cog splines are _much_ more substantial than Shimano.

Out of curiosity I used my dial caliper on both flavored Powertap freehubs and got .120" deep on the Campagnolo splined example which is over twice the .050" height of the Shimano/SRAM splined part.

Aluminum hardness also varies with the alloy; Campagnolo brand Campy splines could be tougher than aftermarket Campy splines.

My 97-98 Record freehubs remain unscathed in spite of a steady loose cog diet. While I run 23 big cogs I've done so with 34 and 30 small rings which result in the same torque as a 39x26 and 39x30 respectively including rides in the Colorado Rockies.

I was Campy's east coast service tech for a number of years. I routinely saw cassettes with spline damage from large loose cogs. Note that the damage was rarely severe, and I never saw one cut through. But I did see many where the sprockets were difficult to slide on or off over the raised burrs.

I don't know if the Shimano pattern would fare better or worse, and lack the experience data anyway. On one hand Shimano splines are shallower, but OTOH there are 6 vs. Campy's 4.

As I said, I wouldn't sweat loose sprockets up to 23 or so, but prefer carriers for the larger ones. Then, of course, it depends on where and how you ride.

Campag made e spline driver for using Shimano cassette, steel interface. now 'just' 9 speed.
Cambria Bike, claimed to stock them.

This thread reminded me that I'm due for a new cassette. Ouch, these are expensive. It's the one thing I hate about having a Chorus 10 speed setup. They are also harder to find, most of the online sellers have spotty supplies of the various levels, with Chorus being the hardest. Centaur and Veloce are available.

Another difference is that Shimano freehub bodies are all steel or Ti so they are much harder than any Al alloy and, therefore, not subject to the same damage. When Shimano made it's brief move to Al freehub bodies (the short-lived Dura Ace 7800 hubs and DA and Ultegra wheel sets) they increased the spline depth significantly and became 10-speed only.

I have a set of 7700 (9-speed era) Dura Ace hubs with 50,000+ miles on the Ti freehub body using mostly 105 loose cog cassettes and there is no spline damage.

There's no good reason for you to track down a discontinued Chorus 10 cassette.

If you're light enough and in a position where the 0.04% speed increase on steep climbs (nearly 1.5 seconds per hour of riding) from a 30g weight savings (this assumes a 140 pound rider and bike just approaching the 15 pound UCI minimum weight; the impact will be less noticeable for heavier combinations) something like Specialites TA aluminum cogs are a better idea.

(Starbike 12-25 weights are Veloce 270g, Centaur 254g, Chorus 226g, Record 197g, and Record all cogs titanium 156g. 155 pounds is 70kg or 70,000 grams; just divide the weight savings into that to get your potential savings).

Where you're not a powerful flyweight likely to race off the front to a mountain top finish you're just concerned about shifting performance, finish, etc. They shift the same.

Centaur will look identical unless some one squints and looks real closely between the sprockets to notice plastic spacers instead of metal. Most combinations will run $64 from Ribble. With 25/26 ending cogs those and the 23 will be on a carrier except for the 14-23 Junior cassette which is always loose and not available as a Record/Chorus part. 13-29 will have 26-29 on a carrier plus a loose 23.

Veloce will be a bit more yellow which is not a perfect match for the polished nickel chrome Campagnolo lock-rings, although most combinations will only set you back $42 from Ribble.

Divided by 20,000 miles neither price tag is very interesting.

Agreed. Cassettes are the last place I would blow money, even on my race bike. I am perfectly happy with the "good enough" model such as Centaur. Depending on the year, I think sometimes Veloce & Centaur are the same, except Centaur comes with a lockring.

As for Miche, a teammate broke his lightweight Miche 12t cog on a ride, requiring a creative use of zip ties to be able to ride home.

Oh, definitely wouldn't spend the extra money for chorus, and they're generally unavailable anyway. It's just that Ultegra is so much less (or was the last time I looked) and I like the way they shift better. I'm pretty sure I have a Centaur on my bike now. I think I'll stick with Centaur 13-26, although I might consider 12-25 instead, not that it'll make that much difference. I think this time I'll have a pro do the adjustment, I never seem to get it perfect. The bike is due for a full tune up and my usual mechanic doesn't do a great job (that would be me). The bike is a 2006 Kuota Kredo, with Chorus 10 speed, Easton Ascent/Orion F/R wheels, FSA SLK crank, and assorted other bits of the same caliber and vintage.

The new Veloce 10-speed cassette I installed this summer came with a lockring as did it's predecessor a couple of years ago.

shimergo.

Nope. Then I'd be paying $44 for 10 speed cassettes (105) instead of $42 (Veloce) or the same $64 for Ultegra that I spend on Centaur. On top of that I'd be spending a few hundred dollars for new freehubs (more to replace hubs, perhaps with spokes too) and $40 for a Shiftmate. Then there's the cassette availability problem - Shimano doesn't have interesting 10 speed combinations like 14-23 or 13-26 (with an 18 cog, just like 12-23).

For contemporary cog counts you'll effectively spend the same money for Campagnolo and Shimano provided that you have the sense not to buy your Italian or Japanese cassettes from an American retailer.

You can spend more and send your LBS owner's children to college if you want, although I'm more concerned about getting my children through their odyssey years.

An Ultegra cassette would run me $64 just like Campagnolo Centaur. Both shift pretty much instantly with decent adjustment, cables that haven't gotten sticky, chains without 5000 miles of side wear, and derailleurs that aren't worn out and wigly so they sit in different places on the big and small rings.

Have the derailleur hanger checked. If you can't get it "perfect" after an eyeballed adjustment in your stand and a test ride to tweak for reasonably equal speed up and down shifts for both cassette end x ring combinations there's something wrong mechanically.

Right, it depends on vintage.

Campagnolo hubs used to come with a 12+ tooth lock ring and cassettes didn't include one.

Lock rings shrunk with the move to 9 cogs in 1997, then expanded from 26 to 27mm with the 1999 over sized aluminum axle, then all hubs used the new lock ring for 2000, and one lock ring would not do the trick for both hub flavors.

IIRC later 11T starting cog cassettes added a lock ring and hubs still came with a 12+ tooth lock ring.

Eventually cassettes all came with lock rings (in the standard 27x1mm format) like Shimano.