Today, I was sorting through all of the frames that were to be stripped and recycled and my eye caught the fluted seatpost and dropout hanger, tell tale signs of a nicer frame.

after I was able to dig it out, i noticed it came with a nice Campy headset and shimano dropouts, after inspecting the lugs and fork crown, rear brake bridge. my breathing started to get excited.. could this be a paramount ? I quickly asked if this frame was to be saved or not, and was given the ok to take it.

so after i got the frame home i quickly took some pics so i could get everyone's opinion too see if they have any idea what this thing is.

also i noted that the seatpost is stuck so i will have to deal with that, but at least it's my size, and i can begin to plan the restore.. looks like red isn't its original color.

pics...

I don't think it is a Paramount but I am no expert. Is there a serial on..... I think the left dropout?


Welcome to the "It looks nice but what is it club"

Can you take a picture of the BB shell?

yeah ill grab some more pics, ill look for the SN, its hard to see any markings due to the paint job. forgot to mention it came with a beat up brooks pro

I don't envy you dealing with those axle adjusters. Do you have a sharp drill bit and a steady hand?

Weird- cable stops on the downtube, not shifter mounts. That would indicate a 'cross frame, but it's set up for sidepull brakes, not cantilever. Shimano rear dropouts. The upper rack bolts are at an odd angle, too.

I doubt it's a Paramount, but it looks nice. 1980's custom-built?

I was thinking the same thing but touring rather than 'cross.

Again I am not paramount expert but look at the inside of the seat stay, looks like the builder used caps on the inside and outside.



I would try and soak those adjusters in penetrating oil for a few days before even touching them.

no luck on the serial number, there is no evidence of it on the left dropout. the down tube guides instead of braze ons for shifters and the multiple water bottle mounts is leading me towards it being a touring frame, did schwinn make an 80's touring paramount?

+ 1 as all above. The cable stops are odd, so are the upper rack bolts. This looks to be more of a custom bike. Well worth saving in any case.

Cool find, it's a mystery frame. No Paramount.

took the forks out, the steer tube had " Reynolds 531 Butted 16/13 " stamped into it. So definitely not a paramount. Weird indeed, no sign of any serial number anywhere, can't get the bottom bracket out either. everything seems stuck

With those cable guides, I'd guess it's no newer than late 70's or maybe very early 80's.

i can't believe this is a custom frame, it looks like its designed after a paramount, the lugs, cable stops and brake bridge all look similar to late 80's paramount, I had another frame like this last year that was painted and needed iding. it had a lot of the same attributes so thats what made me think it was a paramount. did any manufacturers use shimano dropouts on higher end frames? did schwinn have other models that looked like this?

It looks like it has been neglected for a long time. Go easy you don't want to damage the frame in case it is something nice.

Spray the BB, any threading info on it? OH us spray the BB, seatpost and dropout adjusters and just let it sit for awhile.

I am sure some one must have used them but most manufacturers didn't list dropout brands in their catalogs.

On a repainted frame which this appears to me to be, any braze ons are suspect as to being original.
Shimano dropouts front and rear, with soft fillet type brazings of the stay and blade ends.
Appears built for allen key fittings for brakes…
Decent bits for the brake bridge, but nothing for the chain stay bridge.
Might be an investment cast bottom bracket shell, but little appears to have been done to the lugs.
Looks a bit Henry James… head lugs might be too.
Campagnolo headset may not be original, nor the Campagnolo rear axle adjusters.
Reynolds steerer…

Just does not look production to me.

thanks for the info.. now what ?

Squirt everything down and wait.

Strip it to the bare metal and repaint.

Soak the drop out adjusters for a few days the heat up the area with a propane torch, the'll come right out. (blast the area for about 5 seconds and remove the plastic ends first)

I like Kroil, but in this case, for expjediency, I think I'd go with 50/50 ATF-acetone, put in a suitable container and soak the bottom bracket. Try it in a week.

You're going to paint? Some heat too. Same with the rear drop outs, but I'd soak even longer.

Good luck.

Neat and a nice canvas to work from. Temporarily put some wheels on it, check the stance and pull dimensions.

(From your opening, its seems you have a massive pile of bikes to pick thru

yeah it was at the coop where i volunteer, they have tons of frames that get stripped and recycled, most are usually BSO's and old gas pipe ten speeds ... but i can't tell you how many diamonds i've pulled out of them

I agree that it doesn't look like a Paramount, but it still appears to be a very nice frame. The lugs and bottom bracket shell look like Henry James, which were used by many American custom builders. The fork crown looks like a Cinelli MC, again popular with custom and high-end frame builders all over the world. The mix of frame components -- Henry James, Cinelli, Shimano -- suggests to me a North American custom builder.

It looks strangely like a frame from Albert Eisentraut's shop/training academy in Berkeley, CA. Albert and his students built a lot of quirky frames during the 70's and 80s. I have a frame that was built in his shop by one of his students. The lugs look the same, but the bottom bracket is different and it has fastback seat stays. Weird that it got to New York since his following was primarily on the west coast.

Just my observation.

Regards,

Van

thanks for all the input.. never would have suspected it was a custom job... this will be on the back burner for now, i have no idea what to make of it, or how to badge it when it's done