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Ironman Information Thread

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Ironman Information Thread

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Old 10-17-15, 09:17 AM
  #1  
RobbieTunes 
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Ironman Information Thread

Before my memory fades, and while enthusiastic cult members remain, perhaps a thread would be in order to assist and inform the masses. There are many Ironman bikes out there in the hands of the enlightened, and many more in the wild, seeking intelligent captivity. While the "80's paint job" thread has about everything you could think of about the Ironman models, this one is simply about "what came on what, and when."

By no means do I know everything, or can remember everything, about the changes in the iconic bike from the beginning until it left us in 1989. There are subtle differences, even in the same model years, that we geek over, discuss, and let each other know. Once in a while, one of us runs across an all-OEM model, and can fill in gaps. The 80's were a time of change in bike production, and those affected the Ironman, as well. My suggestion is we stick to what we know as fact, or supported rumor, like geometry changes, etc. My suggestion is we leave the debatable opinions in the "main" Ironman thread, so as to keep this an informative location.

As we all know, it was done right. Please post a catalog page or magazine ad, or as close to an OEM model as you can. We still have the "...Ironman...80's" thread to post the hot rods, all other Ironman gouge, but this thread is for those who want to reference OEM information. (As if I make the rules...)
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Old 10-17-15, 09:17 AM
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The Predecessor

1984 Comp TA.
Frame: Tange 2
Fork: Tange sloped crown
Wheelset: Bronze Suzue sealed hubs laced to bronzed Araya A20 rims.
BB: Tange
Crankset: 6207 with bronze 53/39 rings. 53/42?
Calipers: 6207
Levers: 6207 non-aero.
Hoods: black or gum?
Bars: SR
Stem: SR CR
Headset: 6207 star nut
Shifters: 6207 friction 2x6 Shimano old-style bosses aka. Shimano Brazed-On A Type
FD: 6207 28.6 clamp
RD: 6207short cage
Seatpost: SR Laprade fluted 27.0
Saddle: Selle Italia Turbo
Tires: IRC
Freewheel: Shimano UG 13-24 6sp
Colors: Metallic Red/Silver and Titanium Silver/Blue Grey
Scheme: Contrasting head tube color
DT Decal: Thick Centurion with joined UR, un-shaded font.
TT Decal: Comp TA
Headbadge Decal: "C" in same font as DT
Seat stay Decal: Centurion on the caps
Seat tube Decal(s): Black Tange Champion at top, Quality from Japan/Designed in USA at the bottom
Fork Decal: Black Tange Champion at top, Centurion on fork crown
Touch-up paint:

(Add changes in PM's or this thread, and I'll try to get them into the post)



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Old 10-17-15, 09:18 AM
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The Beginning

1985 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman. The "Original"
Frame: Tange 1
Fork: Tange sloped crown
Wheelset: 6207 hubs laced to bronzed Araya A20 rims
BB: Tange
Crankset: 6207
Calipers: 6207
Levers: 6207 non-aero
Bars: Nitto B115-390 (<=54cm) -420 (=>56cm)
Stem: Nitto
Headset: 6207 star nut
Shifters: 6207 friction 2x6 Shimano old-style bosses aka. Shimano Brazed-On A Type
FD: 6207 28.6 clamp
RD: 6207 SIS short cage
Seatpost: SR Laprade fluted 27.0
Saddle: Selle Italia Turbo
Tires: Panaracer Technova
Freewheel: Shimano
Colors: Metallic Red/Silver and Titanium Silver/Blue Grey
Scheme: Contrasting head tube color
DT Decal: Centurion with joined UR, "heavy" shaded font.
TT Decal: Ironman logo with Dave Scott Signature
Headbadge Decal: "C" in same font as DT
Seat stay Decal: Centurion on the caps
Seat tube Decal(s): Blue Tange 1 at top, Quality from Japan/Designed in USA at the bottom
Fork Decal: Centurion on fork crown, Red Tange on the top of the legs.
Touch-up paint:

(Add changes in PM's or this thread, and I'll try to get them into the post)

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Old 10-17-15, 09:19 AM
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Moving Modern

1986 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman. The "Classic"
Frame: Tange Champion 1 48-60cm even sizes.
Fork: Tange Champion 1 sloped crown
Wheelset: New 600EX 32 or 36h laced to Araya 20A bronze rims or Wolber Alpine, Ashai 14g stainless spokes
BB: Tange
Crankset: New 600EX BioPace 52/42, Shimano UG chain
Calipers: New 600EX
Levers: New 600EX or DiaCompe AGC aero
Bars: Nitto B115
Stem: Nitto Young
Headset: New 600EX
Shifters: New 600EX
FD: New 600EX 28.6 clamp
RD: New 600EX SIS short cage
Seatpost: Sugino SP-KCL graduated fluted 27.0
Saddle: Selle Italia Turbo
Tires: Panaracer Vertex
Freewheel - 13-15-17-19-21-24T New 600EX
Colors: Guards Red w/White duotone, Anthracite w/Siver duotone.
Scheme: Contrasting head tube and seat tube color.
Graphics: Geometric shapes in the DT decal and on headbadge.
DT Decal: Centurion in a new un-shaded font, slightly graduated thickness.
TT Decal: Ironman logo with Dave Scott signature
Headbadge Decal: New heavy "C" without shading
Seat stay Decal: Centurion on the caps
Seat tube Decal(s): Blue Tange 1 at top, Quality from Japan/Designed in USA at the bottom
Fork Decal: Centurion on fork crown, Red Tange on top of the legs
Touch-up paint: Testor's Red, Duplicolor bright red, Krylon short cuts SCB-005 Red Pepper , the short cuts comes in a 1 oz. bottle

(Add changes in PM's or this thread, and I'll try to get them into the post)










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File Type: jpg
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Old 10-17-15, 09:19 AM
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The Year of the Split: Experts and Masters

1987 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Expert. The "Classic" & the "Miami Vice"
1987 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Expert. Georgena Terry design.
1987 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Master. A "Classic" Master
Frame: Tange 1
Fork: Tange sloped crown on the Master, Unicrown on the Expert.
Wheelset: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Wolber Super Champion Alpine rims
Wheelset: Shimano 1050 on the Terry Expert, 700c rear, 520c front, Wolber Super Champion Alpine rims
Wheelset: Shimano 600EXon the Master, Wolber Super Champion Alpine rims
BB: Sugino
Crankset: Shimano 1050 52/42 on the Expert, Shimano 600EX 53/42 on the Master
Calipers: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 600EX the Master
Levers: Shimano 1050 aero on the Expert, Shimano 600EX aero on the Master
Bars: Nitto B115-390 (<=54cm) -420 (=>56cm)
Stem: Nitto
Headset: Shimano 105 on the Expert, Shimano 600EX star nut on the Master.
Shifters: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 600EX on the Master
FD: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 600EXon the Master, both 28.6 clamp
RD: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 600EX on the Master
Seatpost: Sugino SP-KCL graduated scale 27.0
Saddle: Vetta Mundial on Expert, Vetta Turbo on Master, women-specific Vetta on the Terry model
Tires: Panaracer Technova II
Cassette: Shimano UG
Colors: Expert "Classic" Red/White. Expert "Miami Vice" Magenta/Yellow
Colors: Expert "Terry" Peach
Colors: Master "Classic" Yellow/White, Bright Marine Green/White..others?
Scheme: Contrasting head tube and seat tube color.
Graphics: Geometric shapes in the DT decal and on headbadge.
DT Decal: Centurion in a new un-shaded thinner font, more graduated thickness.
TT Decal: Ironman logo with Dave Scott signature, "Expert" or "Master" added over Ironman
Headbadge Decal: New heavy "C" without shading
Seat stay decal: Centurion below the caps
Seat tube decal(s): Blue Tange 1 at top, Quality from Japan/Designed in USA at the bottom
Fork decal: Centurion on the crown (including the unicrown), Tange Red on the fork legs
Touch-up paint:

(Add changes in PM's or this thread, and I'll try to get them into the post)

















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Last edited by RobbieTunes; 10-27-15 at 02:23 PM. Reason: lord_athlon's '87 Master, thanks for the updates.
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Old 10-17-15, 09:20 AM
  #6  
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The Year of the Fades

1988 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Expert. "Straight Fades"
1988 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Master. "Purple Haze" and "Straight Fade"
Frame: Tange 1
Fork: Tange unicrown
Wheelset: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Araya CTL-370 rims
Wheelset: Shimano 6400 on the Master, Araya CTL-370 rims
BB: Tange ball bearing type.
Crankset: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 6400-53/42 on the Master
Calipers: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master
Levers: Shimano 1050 aero on the Expert, Shimano 6400 aero on the Master
Bars: Nitto B115-390 (<=54cm) -420 (=>56cm)
Stem: Nitto
Headset: Tange Levin CD on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master
Shifters: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master
FD: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master, both 28.6 clamp
RD: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master
Seatpost: Sugino 27.0 fluted on the Expert, smooth on the Master
Saddle: Vetta (Turbo copy) on the Expert, Selle Italia Turbo on the Master
Tires: Panaracer Technova II
Cassette: Shimano HG 2x7 cassette. 13-24.
Colors: Expert: Red/White, Marine Green/White "straight fades" (possibly a yellow/white)
Colors: Master "Smoked" purple fade, and see below, a Yellow/White "straight fade" Master. Only one I've ever seen.
Scheme: "Straight Fade" on the Experts. "Smoked Fade" and "Straight Fade" on the Master, see above.
Graphics: Squiggles and Geometric shapes in the DT decal and on headbadge.
DT Decal: Centurion in an even more graduated font, from very thin to bold thickness.
TT Decal: Ironman logo with Dave Scott signature, "Expert" or "Master" added over Ironman
Headbadge Decal: New heavy "C" without shading, geometric shapes in the logo
Seat stay decal: Graphics below the caps, but no text
Tange Decal: Clear decal on ST and fork
Seat Tube Decal(s): Clear/colored Tange at the top, Clear/colored Made in Japan/Designed in USA at base.
Fork Decals: dropped the Centurion from the crowns, Clear/colored Tange at the top of the legs
Touch-up paint: For the 88 purple haze I found that Pure Ice name brand nail polish 542cp "No Means No" is a perfect match for the dominant purple. The fading purple is either Sally Hansen brand hard as nails nail polish 370 "No Hard Feelings" . Or L.A. colors name brand color craze nail polish cnp507 "Wisteria".

(Add changes in PM's or this thread, and I'll try to get them into the post)






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Old 10-17-15, 09:20 AM
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Going Carbon, winning the Ironman, again.

1988 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Carbon
Frame: Carbon main triangle, carbon stays inserted into aluminum lugs
Fork: Aluminum sloped crown
Wheelset: Shimano 7400 hubs laced to Araya CTL-370 rims.
BB: 7400
Crankset: Shimano 7400
Calipers: Shimano 7400
Levers: Shimano 7400
Bars: Nitto B115-390 (<=54cm) -420 (=>56cm)
Stem: Nitto
Headset: Shimano 7400
Shifters: Shimano 7400
FD: Shimano 7400 28.6 clamp
RD: Shimano 7400
Seatpost: American Classic 25.4
Saddle: Vetta Turbo
Tires: Panaracer Technova II
Cassette: Shimano HG 2x7
Color: Alloy lugs, clear coated black carbon fiber, alloy fork
Scheme: none
Graphics: Squiggles and Geometric shapes in the DT decal and on headbadge.
DT Decal: Centurion in a new un-shaded thinner font, more graduated thickness.
TT Decal: Ironman logo with Dave Scott signature, "Carbon" added over Ironman
Headbadge Decal(s): New heavy "C" without shading, with geometric shapes
Seat stay decal: Squiggles below the caps, no text
Tange Decal: Clear/colored decal on top of fork legs only.
HT Decal: Made in Japan below the headbadge
ST Decal: Centurion on the sides, nearly same size as DT decal


An Ironman Carbon used by Dave Scott.


An Ironman Carbon model upgraded... I wanted an OEM pic, but there aren't many "good" pics of the Carbon out there.
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Old 10-17-15, 09:21 AM
  #8  
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Last of the Legend, Suntour's last gasp...and twin sons of different mothers.

1989 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Expert. "The Black Dog" and "Smoke on the Water"
1989 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Master. "Hard Rock" and "The Red Menace"
Frame: Tange 1
Fork: Tange unicrown
Wheelset: Suntour GPX on the Expert, Araya CTL-370 rims
Wheelset: Shimano 6400 on the Master, Araya CTL-370 rims
BB: Tange on the Expert, 6400 series on the Master?
Crankset: Suntour GPX on the Expert on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master
Calipers: Suntour GPX on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master
Levers: Suntour GPX on the Expert, Shimano 6400 aero on the Master
Bars: Nitto B115-390 (<=54cm) -420 (=>56cm)
Stem: Nitto
Headset: Tange Levin CD on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master
Shifters: Suntour GPX on the Expert, Shimano 6400 SIS on the Master
FD: Suntour GPX on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master 28.6 clamp
RD: Suntour GPX on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master
Seatpost: SR Laprade fluted 27.2
Saddle: Avenir Turbo Gel
Tires: Panaracer Technova II
Cassette: Shimano HG
Colors: Expert in solid black and smoked blue fade
Colors: Master in solid red and marbled grey fade
Scheme: All solid color or smoked fade or marbled fade
Graphics: Squiggles dropped for geometric shape bookends in the DT decal and on headbadge.
DT Decal: Centurion in a consistent, same-size thickness and spacing, and no squiggles, just "bookend" shapes.
TT Decal: Ironman logo with Dave Scott signature, "Expert" or "Master" added over Ironman
Headbadge Decal: New heavy "C" without shading, geometric shapes in the logo
Seat stay decal: back to Centurion below the caps, no squiggles
Tange Decal: Clear decal on ST and fork
Seat Tube Decal(s): Clear/colored Tange at the top, Clear/colored Made in Japan/Designed in USA at base.
Fork Decals: dropped the Centurion from the crowns, Clear/colored Tange at the top of the legs
Pedals: Sampson/SR clipless
Touch-up paint: Testor's Red, Duplicolor bright red, any shade of black (on the solid colors)

(Add changes in PM's or this thread, and I'll try to get them into the post)









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Old 10-17-15, 09:26 AM
  #9  
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Things I absolutely don't know about the Ironman models....

The actual seat post size. I know what was specified, but I've put a 27.2 in all of mine.

The actual bottom brackets used in any of them. I go with what people tell me.

The correct headsets used in some of them.

Why they simply didn't use complete groups (i.e. headsets and bottom brackets and pedals)

The prices.

Colors I haven't seen.

Why the changes in saddles, but all basically Turbos.

Spoke count changes.

If pedals were part of the package, or additional.

Non-Aero vs. Aero brake levers.

Why the heck they ever stopped making them.
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Old 10-17-15, 09:34 AM
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Little things I've picked up about the Ironman models....

BF Goodrich's threatened legal action and Dave Scott's endorsement pretty much came together to cement the name. Scott was an icon of the beginning triathlon trend, and the Ironman became pretty much an iconic bike. Centurion's folks envisioned a training/racing bike, affordable and with excellent stuff for the price point.

Alan Goldsmith, a long-time influence in American cycling for 50 years, had a hand in the design of later Ironman models. Dave Scott had a hand in specifying them, as well.

The Ironman created sales in other models of the Centurion line-up, just by getting folks in the door and then being a bit more expensive than some could afford. The Lemans/Lemans RS and the Elite RS benefited from this situation, to the point where the Lemans/Lemans RS was a sales leader for Centurion.

The rumored geometry change in 1989 was sparked by Centurion telling a bike magazine that it had occurred, but then not producing the numbers. The only evidence is that magazine article and anecdotal evidence.

The unicrown fork was probably Tange Prestige, for the convenience of the manufacturing facility.

The Panaracer Technova/Technova II tires were so hard that the test bikes for magazines often had wheels that went out of true after each hard ride. This resulted in some testers criticizing the light Araya CTL-370's as "too light," and others simply swapping tires and getting on with the praise.
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Old 10-17-15, 10:02 AM
  #11  
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Bikes: 1974 Paramount ~ 1974 Raleigh Pro ~ 1978 Trek TX900 ~ 1992 Klein Pinnacle ~ 1997 Klein Stage Comp ~Centurion IronMan 85,87:E/M,88:M,89:E ~ 1992 Cannondale T1000 ~ 1988 GT Avalanche ~

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1987
Headset
Expert: 105 (1050)
Master: 600 (6200)

Wheelset: Shimano 6200 on the Master, Wolber Super Champion Alpine rims

Levers: Shimano 1050 aero on the Expert, Shimano 6200 aero on the Master

Master: Cranks Shimano 600 (6200)

Master: Brakes Shimano 600 (6200)

Saddle
Master: Turbo
Expert: Vetta

Color
Expert: Magenta with Yellow Duotone , and Guards Red with White Duotone
Master: Bright Marine Green with White Duotone, Lemon Yellow with White Duotone

Spokes/Wheels 32 Hole 48-60 CM, 36 Hole 62 CM
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Old 10-17-15, 10:27 AM
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My guess for shifting>

1985 (Shimano 600 6200 Series) Pre SIS Both Friction, 6 Speed Freewheel

1986 (Shimano 600 6200 Series New SIS ) SIS introduced Rear only, Friction Front, 6 Speed Freewheel

1987
Master: (Shimano 600 6200 Series New SIS ) SIS introduced Rear only, Friction Front, 6 Speed Freewheel
Expert: (Shimano 105 1050 Series SIS) SIS Rear only, Friction Front, 6 Speed Freewheel

1988
Master: (Shimano 600 6400 Series SIS Introduction of 7 Speed ) SIS Rear only, Friction Front, 7 Speed Cassette
Expert: Expert: (Shimano 105 1050 Series SIS) SIS Rear only, Friction Front, 6 Speed Freewheel (?)

1989
Master: (Shimano 600 6400 Series SIS Introduction of 7 Speed ) SIS Rear only, Friction Front, 7 Speed Cassette
Expert: Expert: (Suntour GPX Accushift 7 Speed) Accushift Rear only, Friction Front, 7 Speed Freewheel (?)
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Old 10-18-15, 09:10 AM
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Comp TA 56cm - I bought from original owner. It matches up with above specs, except for rear derailleur, tri color. Bar tape is OEM as well. Shown with new tires which I put on.


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Old 10-18-15, 09:12 AM
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Yes, yes, yes. The ad for the 1987 'Vice would be a good one, too.
I think sometimes the absolute best reference is box-stock models.
I plan to post my '89 when it gets into my grubby mitts.
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Old 10-18-15, 10:32 AM
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Back in the 80's, I managed the first triathlon store in the US in Berkeley California, called, naturally, The First Tri. We never called Mr. Scott by his name. He was simply referred to as "The Man".

The store only lasted a few years. Had we been a Centurion dealer, perhaps it would have lasted longer. Seemed like every runner or swimmer that decided to do a triathlon went out and bought one of those "The Man" bikes.
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Old 10-18-15, 12:29 PM
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Now we know there's no "/" in TA. Thanks so much.

Originally Posted by oddjob2 View Post
Comp T/A 56cm - I bought from original owner. It matches up with above specs, except for rear derailleur, tri color. Bar tape is OEM as well. Shown with new tires which I put on.

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Old 10-18-15, 05:53 PM
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1987 Ironman Expert - Magenta/White Duotone. Mostly All original except for Tires/Toe Clip Straps/HandleBar tape/ Chain
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Old 10-18-15, 06:00 PM
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1989 Ironman Expert "The Black Dog" (not the best specimen to represent) but some what original (not stock Rear Wheel, Tires, Handlebars, Stem, Brake Levers, Seat, Pedals)

Shot taken before restoration, Currently in Progress.
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Old 10-18-15, 06:27 PM
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Bicycle Guide magazine Ironman spec sheet from 1986 review.

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Old 10-18-15, 06:49 PM
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Originally Posted by RobbieTunes View Post
1985 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman. The "Original"
BB: 6200?
Seatpost: SR Laprade fluted 27.0 vs. 27.2 is debatable
Seat stay Decal: Centurion on the caps
Tange Decal: Red? Blue?
Bought my 85 as a frame w/original headset and BB

BB was Tange
Seatpost size is 27.0
Tange 1 blue decal on seattube
Tange 2 red decals on forks
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Old 10-18-15, 07:01 PM
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Originally Posted by RobbieTunes View Post
1988 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Master. "Purple Haze"
BB: 1050? 6400?
Seatpost: SR Laprade fluted 27.2
Saddle: Vetta Turbo
Tange Decal: Clear decal on ST and fork
My 88 Purple Haze, as purchased:

BB: 6400
Seatpost: Sugino non-fluted 27.0
Saddle: Selle Italia Turbo
Tange 1 blue decal on seattube
Tange 2 red decals on forks
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Old 10-18-15, 07:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Vintage_Cyclist View Post
My 88 Purple Haze, as purchased:

BB: 6400
Seatpost: Sugino non-fluted 27.0
Saddle: Selle Italia Turbo
Tange 1 blue decal on seattube
Tange 2 red decals on forks
I've never seen a Purple Haze with those type of Tange decals.

I have seen these:

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Old 10-18-15, 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by RobbieTunes View Post
Every Ironman came with a fluted seatpost.
I've never seen a Purple Haze with those type of Tange decals.

I have seen these:

Quick trip to the garage, you are correct. I remembered wrong on the decals!
Seatpost is definitely a non-fluted Sugino and is 27.0 (27.2 won't fit). Perhaps the bike shop I got it from did a switch.
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Old 10-18-15, 11:18 PM
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Great summary. I am looking forward to completion of the photo record and I think it would be great to have a picture and description of the first Diamondback following the demise of the Centurion brand to serve as a bookend to the saga. Wasn't that Diamondback basically a rebadged Ironman?
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Old 10-18-15, 11:48 PM
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I took the liberty of transcribing the above into a spreadsheet on google:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...gid=1927924249

I'm sure there are errors. What I'd like to do is open this up to editing control by "the brain trust" to be determined. I never did one of these online spreadsheets before, so I have to figure out the sharing function. I think I'll need emails to send editing invites.

Review and Comment before I proceed.

I think this document could be used to wrangle together a lot of info in one place, including images (already started, see year tabs on bottom of sheet).

Additional info like known touch-up paint options struck me as one thing that would be helpful. I keep seeing that issue raised in the forum.
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