Help needed with leather saddle
08-11-16 | 02:28 PM
#26
Senior Member
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,667
Likes: 29
From: Cambridge UK
Bikes: Trek Emonda SL6 .... Miyata One Thousand
That '38 Swallow is really neat!
FWIW, I have tried the water soak treatment mentioned by [MENTION=185335]Big Block[/MENTION], and was pleased with the results. The saddle, an Ideale 90 with alloy rails, was is poor condition and I thought of it as something of a last resort. It's the only one I've done, so I don't consider myself an expert on the topic, but I do feel that I saved a "lost cause" and turned it into a beautiful and still very functional saddle. My saddle did not have the pronounced sit bone indentions from the first post, but it did have a noticeable sag throughout the middle and uneven, flared sides. The saddle leather still shows its age and use, but the leather remains hard and firm and has retained more flat top after the reshaping.
I soaked it in a bucket of water for about an hour and a half, then stuffed rags between the rails and leather to flatten the top, wrapped more rags around the top and taped the rags tightly with duct tape to reform the flared out sides. Then I let it dry slowly over a couple days rotating to dry rags a couple times. Then added a bit of proofhide to finish. I haven't graduated to realsteel's beeswax-carnuba wax-neat's foot oil solution, but I'd like to try that next time I try a saddle restoration.
To rhm's good point, I used smooth cotton rags on the leather top (rather than a knobby bath towel) so as not to leave indentions in the leather.
Before:
After:
FWIW, I have tried the water soak treatment mentioned by [MENTION=185335]Big Block[/MENTION], and was pleased with the results. The saddle, an Ideale 90 with alloy rails, was is poor condition and I thought of it as something of a last resort. It's the only one I've done, so I don't consider myself an expert on the topic, but I do feel that I saved a "lost cause" and turned it into a beautiful and still very functional saddle. My saddle did not have the pronounced sit bone indentions from the first post, but it did have a noticeable sag throughout the middle and uneven, flared sides. The saddle leather still shows its age and use, but the leather remains hard and firm and has retained more flat top after the reshaping.
I soaked it in a bucket of water for about an hour and a half, then stuffed rags between the rails and leather to flatten the top, wrapped more rags around the top and taped the rags tightly with duct tape to reform the flared out sides. Then I let it dry slowly over a couple days rotating to dry rags a couple times. Then added a bit of proofhide to finish. I haven't graduated to realsteel's beeswax-carnuba wax-neat's foot oil solution, but I'd like to try that next time I try a saddle restoration.
To rhm's good point, I used smooth cotton rags on the leather top (rather than a knobby bath towel) so as not to leave indentions in the leather.
Before:
After:
I'd put a Brooks Cambium C17 Carved on that bike .... not leather, and it's not old, but at the end of the day, it's class and it's very comfy for long rides (and it's waterproof and comes with a 10 year guarantee if you register the serial number online on the Brooks website)
08-11-16 | 02:47 PM
#27
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 7,723
Likes: 4,152
From: Berkeley, CA
Bikes: 72 Cilo Pacer, 72 Gitane GT, 72 Peugeot PX10, 73 Speedwell Ti,l, 75 Peugeot PR-10L, 80 Colnago Super, 81 Zinn, 85 ALAN Cross, 85 De Rosa Pro, 86 Look 753, 86 Look KG86, 89 Parkpre Team, 90 Parkpre Team MTB, 90 Merlin
^No offense taken, and thanks for the compliment, but I think you're off-base to suggest it looks wrong on this bike. It's totally fitting with the rest of the early-70s period-correct build imho. It's a '73 titanium bike and these alloy-railed Ideale 90s were prized weight weenie saddles at the time. The saddle has been on this bike for about 40 years. I would like to try a Cambium, but perhaps on another bike.
08-11-16 | 02:50 PM
#28
over the hill
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,405
Likes: 6
From: florida
Bikes: 72 maino-76 austro daimler inter 10-? giant kronos
IMO I'd pass for the reasons previously stated. I'll add that a new Brooks saddle can be had fairly cheap when you hit a sale. I bought a new Brooks pro for around $60 bucks back in May. They were 25% off and they were running an additional 25% web sale at the time. Yep, timing is everything. I hit the site out of dumb luck.
I've got about 700 miles on that saddle now and it's getting just about there. I had a Brooks for the better part of 20 years and it got lost in a move. I used to really miss that saddle as it was part of me but now that my new Brooks is almost 100% broken in I'm golden.
Take the time and break in a new one. If you don't lose it you'll get years out of it. That saddle also looks like its better days may be behind it but without handling it I can't tell for sure.
Saddles are a very personal thing, especially all leather saddles like Ideale and Brooks. Would be cool for a commuter or MTN bike though if it is truly cheap...as in around $20 bucks or less.
As a side note, some guys in France are coming out with a new Ideale saddle this Fall. Here's the link:
The come back of Idéale saddles | Cycles Victoire
I've got about 700 miles on that saddle now and it's getting just about there. I had a Brooks for the better part of 20 years and it got lost in a move. I used to really miss that saddle as it was part of me but now that my new Brooks is almost 100% broken in I'm golden.
Take the time and break in a new one. If you don't lose it you'll get years out of it. That saddle also looks like its better days may be behind it but without handling it I can't tell for sure.
Saddles are a very personal thing, especially all leather saddles like Ideale and Brooks. Would be cool for a commuter or MTN bike though if it is truly cheap...as in around $20 bucks or less.
As a side note, some guys in France are coming out with a new Ideale saddle this Fall. Here's the link:
The come back of Idéale saddles | Cycles Victoire
08-11-16 | 03:29 PM
#30
Senior Member
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 746
Likes: 22
That '38 Swallow is really neat!
FWIW, I have tried the water soak treatment mentioned by @Big Block, and was pleased with the results. The saddle, an Ideale 90 with alloy rails, was is poor condition and I thought of it as something of a last resort. It's the only one I've done, so I don't consider myself an expert on the topic, but I do feel that I saved a "lost cause" and turned it into a beautiful and still very functional saddle. My saddle did not have the pronounced sit bone indentions from the first post, but it did have a noticeable sag throughout the middle and uneven, flared sides. The saddle leather still shows its age and use, but the leather remains hard and firm and has retained more flat top after the reshaping.
I soaked it in a bucket of water for about an hour and a half, then stuffed rags between the rails and leather to flatten the top, wrapped more rags around the top and taped the rags tightly with duct tape to reform the flared out sides. Then I let it dry slowly over a couple days rotating to dry rags a couple times. Then added a bit of proofhide to finish. I haven't graduated to realsteel's beeswax-carnuba wax-neat's foot oil solution, but I'd like to try that next time I try a saddle restoration.
To rhm's good point, I used smooth cotton rags on the leather top (rather than a knobby bath towel) so as not to leave indentions in the leather.
Before:
----
After:
FWIW, I have tried the water soak treatment mentioned by @Big Block, and was pleased with the results. The saddle, an Ideale 90 with alloy rails, was is poor condition and I thought of it as something of a last resort. It's the only one I've done, so I don't consider myself an expert on the topic, but I do feel that I saved a "lost cause" and turned it into a beautiful and still very functional saddle. My saddle did not have the pronounced sit bone indentions from the first post, but it did have a noticeable sag throughout the middle and uneven, flared sides. The saddle leather still shows its age and use, but the leather remains hard and firm and has retained more flat top after the reshaping.
I soaked it in a bucket of water for about an hour and a half, then stuffed rags between the rails and leather to flatten the top, wrapped more rags around the top and taped the rags tightly with duct tape to reform the flared out sides. Then I let it dry slowly over a couple days rotating to dry rags a couple times. Then added a bit of proofhide to finish. I haven't graduated to realsteel's beeswax-carnuba wax-neat's foot oil solution, but I'd like to try that next time I try a saddle restoration.
To rhm's good point, I used smooth cotton rags on the leather top (rather than a knobby bath towel) so as not to leave indentions in the leather.
Before:
----
After:
08-11-16 | 04:17 PM
#31
Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 813
Likes: 170
From: Adelaide, Australia
good to see someone with actual experience being involved.
On Classic Lightweights
"Use a toestrap round the narrow part of the saddle to keep the shape intact while it is drying."
You don't need to bind it up. Drying leather does not exert significant force. Just move the strap so the leather dries evenly.
As Rudi has written, I also have hand moulded the saddle flaps when they are drying.
This is part of the satisfaction of recovering them yourself, you get what you want; reshaping the cantleplate, choosing the thickness of the leather, trimming to shape, making and installing your own rivets. Then using the saddle.
"Use a toestrap round the narrow part of the saddle to keep the shape intact while it is drying."
You don't need to bind it up. Drying leather does not exert significant force. Just move the strap so the leather dries evenly.
As Rudi has written, I also have hand moulded the saddle flaps when they are drying.
This is part of the satisfaction of recovering them yourself, you get what you want; reshaping the cantleplate, choosing the thickness of the leather, trimming to shape, making and installing your own rivets. Then using the saddle.
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