Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Classic & Vintage
Reload this Page >

Help! Identify this little guy

Notices
Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

Help! Identify this little guy

Old 08-17-18, 04:45 PM
  #1  
Broke Joke
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 34
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Help! Identify this little guy

I bought this a couple months ago and I’m trying to figure out what brand it is? I know the wheels/ tires are not original.

Stands 24” at seat height
Broke Joke is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 04:55 PM
  #2  
juvela
Senior Member
 
juvela's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Alta California
Posts: 8,653
Mentioned: 248 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1798 Post(s)
Liked 126 Times in 112 Posts
-----

Blades the recipient of "customisation."

Adult saddle could not have been original.

Chainwheel pattern might possibly give readers a clue to at least country of origin.

​​​​​​​-----

Last edited by juvela; 08-17-18 at 04:56 PM. Reason: spellin'
juvela is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 05:13 PM
  #3  
thinktubes 
weapons-grade bolognium
 
thinktubes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Across the street from Chicago
Posts: 4,948

Bikes: Battaglin Cromor, Ciocc Designer 84, Schwinn Superior 1981

Mentioned: 31 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 527 Post(s)
Liked 252 Times in 151 Posts
Interesting that it has a pump peg.
thinktubes is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 06:16 PM
  #4  
Unapomer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Left Coast, U.S. of A.
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 21 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 8 Times in 6 Posts
Looks to me like it has been fabricated from a full size mixte frame and a few other bits and pieces by some enterprising metal worker who wanted a first bike for his kid. Chain guard has been cut down, crank arms have been shortened and rewelded at the ends. Someone did a workmanlike job I'd say.

Last edited by Unapomer; 08-17-18 at 06:59 PM.
Unapomer is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 07:12 PM
  #5  
Fahrenheit531 
Carbon Curious
 
Fahrenheit531's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 3,571

Bikes: Schwinn Paramount ('71) and Volare ('78); Raleigh Competition GS ('79)

Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 584 Post(s)
Liked 117 Times in 70 Posts
Can't decide if it's a kid bike or a clown bike...
__________________
A race bike in any era is a highly personal choice that at its "best" balances the requirements of fit, weight, handling, durability and cost tempered by the willingness to toss it and oneself down the pavement at considerable speed. ~Bandera
Fahrenheit531 is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 08:12 PM
  #6  
Broke Joke
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 34
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
@unapomer, Thank you sooo much for a clue about this! I am really glad I joined this site. So much knowledge.
Broke Joke is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 08:16 PM
  #7  
Broke Joke
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 34
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
@fahrenheit531, That’s funny because the gentleman that sold it to me called it a “clown cycle”!
Broke Joke is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 08:33 PM
  #8  
michael k
Senior Member
 
michael k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Portland,Or
Posts: 1,160
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 43 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
That may be the worlds longest reach caliper brake.
michael k is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 09:39 PM
  #9  
michael k
Senior Member
 
michael k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Portland,Or
Posts: 1,160
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 43 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Check out post #1057
Show us your mixte (mhendricks' new happy place)
michael k is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 09:59 PM
  #10  
Insidious C. 
Crash Test Dummy
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: PNW
Posts: 948

Bikes: Dawes, Williams, Raleigh, Daccordi, Scott, Univega, Mercier, Vitus, J. Anquetil, Specialized

Mentioned: 36 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 221 Post(s)
Liked 31 Times in 19 Posts
The wheels look capable of handling some weight. Probably not for a child.
__________________
I.C.
Insidious C. is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 11:16 PM
  #11  
Unapomer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Left Coast, U.S. of A.
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 21 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 8 Times in 6 Posts
Originally Posted by Fahrenheit531 View Post
Can't decide if it's a kid bike or a clown bike...
I think Fahrenheit 531 called it..............on a second look I think it's a clown bike.
Unapomer is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 11:51 PM
  #12  
Broke Joke
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 34
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Updated picture ... this happened today, PO sent me the original handlebars. So all I need is a long spring juvinile seat.
Broke Joke is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 11:52 PM
  #13  
Broke Joke
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 34
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Broke Joke is offline  
Old 08-18-18, 12:31 AM
  #14  
rhm
multimodal commuter
 
rhm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NJ, NYC, LI
Posts: 19,248

Bikes: 1940s Fothergill, 1959 Allegro Special, 1963? Claud Butler Olympic Sprint, Lambert 'Clubman', 1974 Fuji "the Ace", 1976 Holdsworth 650b conversion rando bike, 1983 Trek 720 tourer, 1984 Counterpoint Opus II, 1993 Basso Gap, 2010 Downtube 8h, and...

Mentioned: 475 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1624 Post(s)
Liked 62 Times in 53 Posts
How do you know the wheels are not original?

How does the front brake work, if at all?

Is there a rear brake, hub brake, freewheel, or fixed gear?

I don't see any of the signs of "customization" mentioned by other viewers; neither to the fork blades, the chain guard, nor the crank arms. The brake lever on the handlebar looks like it should work with a rod brake, and there appear to be hooks on the fork to hold the brake stirrup (better photos, please?). The rims are Westwood pattern, that would suit the rod brake.

The integrated headset style --headset cups resting in the bulged head lugs-- went out of fashion ca 1950, so it's at least that old.

The aluminum caliper brake does not belong.

I would check the bottom bracket threading, headset threading, tube diameters, cotter pin size, etc; anything that can be measured. I suspect it will all be English, like the wheels.

Last edited by rhm; 08-18-18 at 12:41 AM.
rhm is offline  
Old 08-18-18, 01:26 AM
  #15  
juvela
Senior Member
 
juvela's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Alta California
Posts: 8,653
Mentioned: 248 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1798 Post(s)
Liked 126 Times in 112 Posts
Originally Posted by michael k View Post
That may be the worlds longest reach caliper brake.
-----

cycle's brake caliper is Weinmann model nr. 1080 with a reach range of 84.5-108mm.





​​​​​​​-----
juvela is offline  
Old 08-18-18, 07:59 AM
  #16  
thumpism 
Bikes are okay, I guess.
 
thumpism's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Richmond, Virginia
Posts: 5,145

Bikes: Waterford Paramount Touring, Bridgestone RB-T, Trek 510 city build, Giant CFM-2, Raleigh Sports 3-speeds in M23 & L23, Schwinn Cimarron oddball build, Marin Palisades Trail dropbar conversion

Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1411 Post(s)
Liked 167 Times in 123 Posts
The thing looks OEM to me.
thumpism is offline  
Old 08-18-18, 08:49 AM
  #17  
T-Mar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 18,728
Mentioned: 490 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2839 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 287 Times in 249 Posts
You certainly wouldn't be able to fit those rims/tyres into a standard frame. They would be too wide. They look like they're about 3" wide. The only time I can recall seeing tyres like that on a bicycle, was an early 1970s Sekine Boonbike-GT, which was the bicycle equivalent of the motorized mini-bikes that were popular at the time.
T-Mar is offline  
Old 08-18-18, 08:53 AM
  #18  
Broke Joke
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 34
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
@rhm, Thank you for taking the time to respond!
I only assumed the wheels/ tires were not original.
The front brake does not work in this configuration, I did have it working fine with the other handlebars and lever. Rear hub is a free wheeler. The forks do have tabs for another kind of brake but I do not have any of those parts.
Broke Joke is offline  
Old 08-18-18, 03:54 PM
  #19  
rhm
multimodal commuter
 
rhm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: NJ, NYC, LI
Posts: 19,248

Bikes: 1940s Fothergill, 1959 Allegro Special, 1963? Claud Butler Olympic Sprint, Lambert 'Clubman', 1974 Fuji "the Ace", 1976 Holdsworth 650b conversion rando bike, 1983 Trek 720 tourer, 1984 Counterpoint Opus II, 1993 Basso Gap, 2010 Downtube 8h, and...

Mentioned: 475 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1624 Post(s)
Liked 62 Times in 53 Posts
Ok! I really don't know what your bike is, but I can tell you a couple things. The main missing part of the front brake is a stirrup, something like this:

https://m.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-BIKE-BRAKE-FRONT-STIRRUP-ROLLER-LEVER-ROD-BRAKE-ROADSTER-BIKES-COMPLETE/183373438444?hash=item2ab1e89dec:g:GycAAMXQVT9TAz7E

I don't know whether that will fit your bike or not, and I don't know what parts you'll need to connect that to the existing lever. These brakes are primitive and setting them up is not rocket science.

The whole system is called a "rod brake." This is obsolete technology, with good reason.

Can you find any writing on the bike? "British made" or anything like that? I can see the tires are English and this leads me to suspect the whole thing is English. If so, you may hit pay dirt in old catalogs-- Raleigh, Hercules, Phillips, also Armstrong, Norman, I don't know what else. Don't expect to find an exact match, but if you find a similar bike made by any English manufacturer, then you can safely assume it's English.

Just out of curiosity...: Why? What's your goal here? Want to restore it? No matter what it is --even if it's exceedingly rare (which is not that unlikely)-- the resale market for things like this is not good. I don't want to dissuade you from whatever it is you have in mind, but I'm curious what that is (and why).
rhm is offline  
Old 08-18-18, 08:49 PM
  #20  
Broke Joke
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 34
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
@rhn, I appreciate all the education on vintage European brakes! That’s exactly why I joined this site, I have learned more in the last two days on here! I’m not too worried about the brake as the bike will be for display only. To answer your question... why? Dang, I don’t know? I have been collecting bicycles since 1983 and have gone from post war balloon tire to prewar Schwinn’s and early Stingrays to vintage BMX but I also like the unusual small bikes.
Broke Joke is offline  
Old 08-18-18, 08:55 PM
  #21  
Broke Joke
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 34
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts

Late 1930’s Sidewalk bike and a Speed O Byke. These bicycles stand 24” at seat height.
Broke Joke is offline  
Old 08-18-18, 08:59 PM
  #22  
Broke Joke
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 34
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts

Another Speed O Byke, this one is completely original from 1933 ...
Broke Joke is offline  
Old 08-18-18, 09:10 PM
  #23  
Broke Joke
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 34
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts

Late 1920’s Pierce, the gentleman I bought this from called it a “monkey bike” because it was used by a monkey in a circus act! 24” at seat height.
Broke Joke is offline  
Old 08-18-18, 09:14 PM
  #24  
Broke Joke
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 34
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts

As far as resale value, again I’m not worried because I have a “selling problem”
Broke Joke is offline  
Old 08-18-18, 09:19 PM
  #25  
Broke Joke
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 34
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Broke Joke is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.