Frame identification
Any specific subsections of frame identification? Thanks!
|
You're Welcome
Originally Posted by JmanBuilder
(Post 22557514)
Any specific subsections of frame identification? Thanks!
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...b6a80e0a95.jpg https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...7ed92d44c2.jpg https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...c0d463a8e3.jpg https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...52fc2c2f69.jpg https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...3ce8bd4308.jpg OP's Album. |
But Wait, There's More
|
Frameset details
I was told by seller that the original owner claimed it's a Limongi with SL tubing. Only markings are on the Silva brake bridge and "644" stamped on what looks to be a Silva bottom bracket shell. Headset is a Stronglight and apparently original to the bike. Paint is not original. Seatpost diameter is 26.8mm. Any help in identifying the frame would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
|
Very nice frame set interesting to see a frame of this quality with no identifiers on It. The alternative cable routing through the rear chain stay is a bit unusual other than that I see nothing that can really ID this bike, very nice find.
|
Seems like there was a red bike that came through in the past year with the extra cable guide on the BB. It also had similar BB cable guides, but they were rounded loops and not as professional looking. Might have had similar seat stay caps as well.
Edit: I went back and found those threads. I was wrong The extra cable guide was on a red bike with a Cinelli BB that has a shield over the cable guides. The looped guides were on a blue bike. Neither had similar seat stay caps. |
I'm no Limongi expert, but his frame details were extremely varied, yet nothing seen on this frame jumps out as typical with any of the examples I have seen online.
I don't know for example that he favored Silva frame bits (brake bridge and/or BB shell), and tho I do see one that has this fork crown, many do not, and have not seen any with that staycap treatment which is distinctive, but then Limongi did a great variety of seat clusters, quite a few fastbacks. Maybe one of our Canadian members have some more experience with ID-ing Pepe's frames. Are you located in Quebec, @JmanBuilder? Note: if 26.8 is the correct seat post size, then this is not Columbus SL, might be Aelle, might be another brand |
Originally Posted by zukahn1
(Post 22557851)
The alternative cable routing through the rear chain stay is a bit unusual….
|
Originally Posted by ManekiNico
(Post 22558162)
Are you sure the cable is routed into the chain stay? I think that's just an optical illusion in the picture of the BB shell and there's clearly a cable stop under the chain stay in the first picture.
|
Originally Posted by ManekiNico
(Post 22558162)
Are you sure the cable is routed into the chain stay? I think that's just an optical illusion in the picture of the BB shell and there's clearly a cable stop under the chain stay in the first picture.
|
Originally Posted by unworthy1
(Post 22558127)
I'm no Limongi expert, but his frame details were extremely varied, yet nothing seen on this frame jumps out as typical with any of the examples I have seen online.
I don't know for example that he favored Silva frame bits (brake bridge and/or BB shell), and tho I do see one that has this fork crown, many do not, and have not seen any with that staycap treatment which is distinctive, but then Limongi did a great variety of seat clusters, quite a few fastbacks. Maybe one of our Canadian members have some more experience with ID-ing Pepe's frames. Are you located in Quebec, @JmanBuilder? Note: if 26.8 is the correct seat post size, then this is not Columbus SL, might be Aelle, might be another brand |
-----
the false acorn nut brazed into the drive side seat binder ear almost looks like it could be a Gripfast item this would be an odd choice since Gripfast seat binders are Whitworth thread ----- |
This may help what city and country are you located , most high end limited production bikes never leave the city wear there made?
|
Originally Posted by unworthy1
(Post 22558127)
I'm no Limongi expert, but his frame details were extremely varied, yet nothing seen on this frame jumps out as typical with any of the examples I have seen online.
I don't know for example that he favored Silva frame bits (brake bridge and/or BB shell), and tho I do see one that has this fork crown, many do not, and have not seen any with that staycap treatment which is distinctive, but then Limongi did a great variety of seat clusters, quite a few fastbacks. Maybe one of our Canadian members have some more experience with ID-ing Pepe's frames. Are you located in Quebec, @JmanBuilder? Note: if 26.8 is the correct seat post size, then this is not Columbus SL, might be Aelle, might be another brand |
With the exception of the numbers stamped into the BB shell, this reminds me very much of a Miele. They used that BB shell, with later versions having the Miele logo embossed on it. Also, the stay end treatment is that used by Miele on their better models. Finally, those dropouts are see on many Miele models.
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...eab68fabcd.jpg |
T-Mar getting close! And, that FD cable in the pic needs to be adjusted.
|
I will say whatever it is, it's a beautiful frame.
|
Originally Posted by T-Mar
(Post 22559049)
With the exception of the numbers stamped into the BB shell, this reminds me very much of a Miele. They used that BB shell, with later versions having the Miele logo embossed on it. Also, the stay end treatment is that used by Miele on their better models. Finally, those dropouts are seen on many Miele models.
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...eab68fabcd.jpg |
good thing you got the proper size seatpost in this and that it's a 27.2.
Sure seems like T-Mar has gotten very close to the mark, maybe even hit the bullseye, and that Doug Fattic adds fuel to this fire makes it all the more likely it's a Miele (or built by them for another brand, if they did such). Did you check in the base of the steerer for "rifling" in that tube? |
It is starting to smell like a Miele. I hadn't even thought of Miele which is funny because I own an early-to-mid 1980s, lower end Tange, Suntour/SakaeRingyo equipped model (workmanship, weight and general feel are not comparable between the two frames). The rear dropouts are practically identical. I guess with Miele I expected the usual engraved "Miele" on the fork crown and serial number on the lower seat tube. I'm guessing the model can't be identified with the limited information we have? Perhaps a Lupa? Thanks again for helping out!
|
Originally Posted by unworthy1
(Post 22559428)
good thing you got the proper size seatpost in this and that it's a 27.2.
Sure seems like T-Mar has gotten very close to the mark, maybe even hit the bullseye, and that Doug Fattic adds fuel to this fire makes it all the more likely it's a Miele (or built by them for another brand, if they did such). Did you check in the base of the steerer for "rifling" in that tube? |
Originally Posted by JmanBuilder
(Post 22559881)
It is starting to smell like a Miele. I hadn't even thought of Miele which is funny because I own an early-to-mid 1980s, lower end Tange, Suntour/SakaeRingyo equipped model (workmanship, weight and general feel are not comparable between the two frames). The rear dropouts are practically identical. I guess with Miele I expected the usual engraved "Miele" on the fork crown and serial number on the lower seat tube. I'm guessing the model can't be identified with the limited information we have? Perhaps a Lupa? Thanks again for helping out!
As previously noted by Doug, not all Miele models had brand embossing. The Miele models with serial numbers on the lower seat tube tended to be the lower end models that were contracted manufactured in Japan. The bridgeless BB shell and 27.2mm post diameter points to one of the higher end models, manufactured in Canada by Guvin. If you find some ridges inside the the bottom of the fork's steerer tube, make note of how many there are and whether they are straight or helical, as other manufacturers such as Ishiwata and Tange were employing them by this date, though each had their own configuration. |
Originally Posted by T-Mar
(Post 22560117)
As previously noted by Doug, not all Miele models had brand embossing. The Miele models with serial numbers on the lower seat tube tended to be the lower end models that were contracted manufactured in Japan. The bridgeless BB shell and 27.2mm post diameter points to one of the higher end models, manufactured in Canada by Guvin.
If you find some ridges inside the the bottom of the fork's steerer tube, make note of how many there are and whether they are straight or helical, as other manufacturers such as Ishiwata and Tange were employing them by this date, though each had their own configuration. |
Originally Posted by zukahn1
(Post 22557851)
Very nice frame set interesting to see a frame of this quality with no identifiers on It. The alternative cable routing through the rear chain stay is a bit unusual other than that I see nothing that can really ID this bike, very nice find.
note the derailleur tab is more aft than the Campagnolo form factor. |
I still have a bunch of 1" threaded steerers that came from Miele. They include several brands including several with internal ribbing. Columbus steerers are easy to identify because they are spiral. I haven't bothered to identify the Japanese ribbed steerers but my recollection (without going to check) is that there are 2 kinds. They are vertical instead of spiral. I also have some steerers without any reinforcing ribs. All of these steerers came from Miele. It appears to me that what brand of steerer they used was related to frame size.
I also have a lot of Miele fork crowns. I've been really thankful for them. They are perfect for brazing practice for my framebuilding class students before they braze their real fork. These full sloping crowns are the easiest for learners to braze. It is necessary for training purposes to start easier and build on success. Beautiful twin plate crowns require greater brazing mastery. As their instructor, I have to manage their emotions so they don't get discouraged or disappointed while on their learning curve. Starting with something too difficult can really hurt learning motivation. |
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:37 AM. |
Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.