Looking to confirm Campy ID off an early to mib 80's Guerciotti on eBay. Thanks for the help!

I see a nuovo record rear derailleur and record shifters.

fwiw- the guerciotti is more like very late 70's to early 80's- no later than approx 1982 based on the downtube detail pic (only 2 of your 4 photos download for me)

Can you see these pictures and are these the ones you couldn't see before?

Super Record chainring, but the front derailleur and brake levers are definitely Nuovo Record. The opening bid price for that bike is, uh, extremely optimistic, IMO.

https://www.velobase.com/Default.aspx

Curbtender, thanks for the link, maybe now I won't have to bother you guys so much, or at least I'll investigate first and offer a good guess which you guys can comment on. And Picchio Special, what do you think this bike is worth. The overall condition seems pretty good.

got the new pics- the clamp-on record front derailleur means 81 or earlier. a close-up of the right rear dropout to show if it has the tiny holes for mounting a campy super record portacatena chain hanger and details of the seatstay & chainstay bridges would help pinpoint the date a little more.my hunch is that it's a 1980 or 81 frame. not sure why i think that, tho. rusty neurons.

k


edit/ps- looked at the auction- the short flute sr seatpin and 3 hole record front would confirm 80/81

i agree that opening is high- i'd think 750-800 would be a great deal, 1000 would be tops-if it had full pantographing, imo, it could fetch maybe $1100 to a motivated bidder-as is, i wouldn't get into a bidding war unless it's something you've lusted for.

Caterham:

Picchio Special thinks the front derailleur is Nouvo Record and I thing he might be right based on what I saw on VeloBase. On the Nouvo Record there is a small shiny barrel piece leading to the mount. The Record derailleur has a darker piece in that place. If it is a Nouvo Record clamp on rather than Record, what, if anything, does that say about the vintage?

the front is definately nuovo- i used 'record' to mean 'not super record'

I said Nuovo Record, but should have written "Record," especially since I'm the first guy to call people on that sort of thing. I'm not sure what you're getting at with your distinction between Nuovo Record and Record in this case (unless I'm missing something). The Record three-hole front derailleur has a silver pivot arm, while Super Record has a black anodized one. That's why I indicated it is not a Super Record deraileur. Maybe that's what you are referring to. Prior to that derailleur being introduced in the very late 70's-very early 80's, the derailleur had four holes for both Super Record and Record (or Nuovo Record if you prefer) versions. That three-hole Record front derailleur was available during a fairly wide time period, from the late 70's or very early 80's until Campagnolo discontinued the Record/Nuovo Record group. If the bike was earlier than 1979 or so, and the front derailleur was original, I would expect to see a four-holer.

Incidentally, to clarify, I'm not convinced there ever was such a thing as a Nuovo Record front derailleur, technically speaking. Though there certainly was in common parlance (and regardless of what it says in Velobase), Campagnolo from what I have seen continued to consistently call the derailleur that went with it's Record/Nuovo Record gruppo "Record."

It does look to be in good shape, and I think late-70's is a good period to own. But I don't think that's a thousand dollar bike, especially as a starting bid (instead of a "heck why not" Buy It Now). Guerciottis are nice bikes, but second-tier for Italy. It's not a full Super Record group (or even a reduced one), and it doesn't have any of the cool pantographed parts. I personally wouldn't pay more than about $500 for it, but I think its fair value might be in the $650-750 or so range.

Actually velobase doesn't have a shot of a Record FD for that time frame, only the Super Record and Nouvo Record. There wasn't any point to my distinction between the two, just trying to determine the proper level for the FD. Thanks for all the info. Very helpful and informative.

Well, Velobase may be the Wikipedia of vintage bike parts, for what that's worth. Not saying it's not helpful, I'm saying take it with a grain of salt. Little commonly held false assumptions die hard and worm there way into even the best-intentioned enterprises.

Right on!!!

guerciotti's from this time period were highly variable in quality- tho generally the pre-78 bikes were very nicely finished, demand must have increased dramatically with ten speed drive distribution. some would be quite nicely crafted with finely thinned lugwork & crisp brazing and others showing indifferent build, file marks and overly heavy paint. ime, handling (at least on 53 cm c-t & smaller frames) was very quick -ie- more like a ciocc or cinelli than say a colnago or masi from the same time period

I'm not a huge fan of Guerciottis generally, and I think they were somewhat inconsistent even before TSD. Do you know if, at the time the OP's bike was built, Guerciotti was still using pressed lugs? In "The Custom Bicycle," (written late 70's) it says they were chamfering the seatstay topeyes, which would be interesting if true, since a lot of folks were using plugs by that point.

afaik, they continued to use pressed lugs and chamferred seatstay 'topeyes' right up thru 83.by the time the auction bike was built, they had at least reduced the size of the btm bkt 'star' cutout

fwiw- the author of the book was my 'coach' at the time