The Ultimate!
11-21-12, 01:25 AM
#26
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Citroen 2cv= Pugeuot A0-8
Huffy Aerowind=Ford Aerostar
(It's a lot more interesting to equate family cars to production bikes)
Ford prefect=Raleigh Grand Prix
Land Rover= Raleigh M40
Ford Explorer= Cannondale
Huffy Aerowind=Ford Aerostar
(It's a lot more interesting to equate family cars to production bikes)
Ford prefect=Raleigh Grand Prix
Land Rover= Raleigh M40
Ford Explorer= Cannondale
11-21-12, 06:36 AM
#27
Fat Guy on a Little Bike
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Well, Rolls Royce is going to lead me to picking a Brit bike. I'd probably say Ephgrave. Hetchins seem more like Jaguars to me and Aston Martin would be SBDU Raleigh.
Any ultimate bike question is ultimately a what kind of bear is best.
Any ultimate bike question is ultimately a what kind of bear is best.
Last edited by KonAaron Snake; 11-21-12 at 07:00 AM.
11-21-12, 07:34 AM
#28
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11-21-12, 08:18 AM
#29
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Well, I take it to mean that if I could have any bike in the world (but for keeping and not for resale), I'd choose a late 60s/early 70s Cinelli. I'd ride it, love it, keep it. Call me boring, but I can't think of anything that I'd like better. I really want to see if they have that "magic carpet ride" that people talk about.
They ride differently in my book.
I have what is probably a '72. I like it, front end is longer than say a Colnago of the period, and pretty close to a Masi.
The reputation for the standard bikes being heavy is true. SP tubing and those cast fittings no doubt.
11-21-12, 08:47 AM
#30
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repechage - I had heard that these Cinellis ran heavy, but my 68/69' is fairly light...I would assume they would use different tubes for different riders, yes?
11-21-12, 08:57 AM
#31
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I think the Rene Herse suggestion was on target, but in more ways than are strictly relevant. That is, while I appreciate that they are both beautifully made and that no expense was spared in the interest of cutting costs and I'm sure they give the owner much pleasure, they are both so far out of my budget that I have no ambition of ever owning one. If by some freak chance of good fortune I should end up owning one, I would most likely sell it.
I have never seen a Herse in person. A friend of mine has one, or two, I forget which, but the bike he actually rides is a Centurion. Come to think of it, I have never even seen a photo of a Herse that wasn't in beautiful condition. I'm sure it would be wonderful to ride one, but the evidence seems to suggest people don't actually do so.
I have never seen a Herse in person. A friend of mine has one, or two, I forget which, but the bike he actually rides is a Centurion. Come to think of it, I have never even seen a photo of a Herse that wasn't in beautiful condition. I'm sure it would be wonderful to ride one, but the evidence seems to suggest people don't actually do so.
11-21-12, 08:57 AM
#32
Mixte Junkie
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My '84 Nishiki Century has been likened to a 1960's Fiat. I can't tell if it was a compliment or not.
11-21-12, 09:04 AM
#33
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I think the Rene Herse suggestion was on target, but in more ways than are strictly relevant. That is, while I appreciate that they are both beautifully made and that no expense was spared in the interest of cutting costs and I'm sure they give the owner much pleasure, they are both so far out of my budget that I have no ambition of ever owning one. If by some freak chance of good fortune I should end up owning one, I would most likely sell it.
I have never seen a Herse in person. A friend of mine has one, or two, I forget which, but the bike he actually rides is a Centurion. Come to think of it, I have never even seen a photo of a Herse that wasn't in beautiful condition. I'm sure it would be wonderful to ride one, but the evidence seems to suggest people don't actually do so.
I have never seen a Herse in person. A friend of mine has one, or two, I forget which, but the bike he actually rides is a Centurion. Come to think of it, I have never even seen a photo of a Herse that wasn't in beautiful condition. I'm sure it would be wonderful to ride one, but the evidence seems to suggest people don't actually do so.
The difference between a Rene Herse (or really any vintage bike, with a tiny number of exceptions) and a Rolls is that the average guy CAN afford to buy a used Herse if he chooses to prioritize it. The other difference is the relative impact of miles...mileage on a car will effect depreciation far more than that of a bicycle. Pulleys and freewheels cost a lot less than engines.
11-21-12, 09:11 AM
#34
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Rudi - most of the ones I've seen (an admittedly small sample size) do look ridden and most have patina. Also - there's really no down side to riding it, assuming it's not in perfect shape. If you buy it and ride it for 500 miles and then sell, you'll get the same money, +/- 10%, you would have selling it without riding it (assuming no incidents occur). Why not enjoy it a little before selling it?If an incident were to happen, well that's what insurance is for!
The difference between a Rene Herse (or really any vintage bike, with a tiny number of exceptions) and a Rolls is that the average guy CAN afford to buy a used Herse if he chooses to prioritize it. The other difference is the relative impact of miles...mileage on a car will effect depreciation far more than that of a bicycle. Pulleys and freewheels cost a lot less than engines.
The difference between a Rene Herse (or really any vintage bike, with a tiny number of exceptions) and a Rolls is that the average guy CAN afford to buy a used Herse if he chooses to prioritize it. The other difference is the relative impact of miles...mileage on a car will effect depreciation far more than that of a bicycle. Pulleys and freewheels cost a lot less than engines.
11-21-12, 10:04 AM
#36
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I've driven a Rolls. Very nice car but not my thing. I would make it a Ferrari. Now, I've never driven one of those, but my bicycle Ferrari would be a mid to late 60's Cinelli, I guess.
11-21-12, 10:07 AM
#37
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There is no right or wrong to bike preferences; like how it rides and looks? It's your ultimate bike. To me an ultimate bike is one that's built by a skilled builder for you.
11-21-12, 10:44 AM
#38
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11-21-12, 12:29 PM
#39
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It rises from the dead, this thread!
No bicycle rides like a Rolls Royce, because a Rolls and a bicycle are trying achieve diametrically opposite goals. The Rolls Royce wants to get you where you are going quickly and with as little effort as possible, with minimal exposure to the road, weather and noise. Also, their cars have undergone dramatic changes in the nearly 100 years of their manufacture, with the pre-WWII cars being at or near the cutting edge of technology and the post-war development slowed to the point of stagnation. Comparisons on the basis of function are impossible because of these facts.
If you are using Rolls as an example of the most elegant of its kind (which RR was at one time, or at worst on the short list), than you should be thinking of Toei, DiNucci, Confente, Weigle and maybe Konno-built 3Rensho.
As a leader in in-house technology design, development and construction (which Rolls was in the teens through the early 1930s, even making their own nuts and bolts): Singer and Herse.
For tops in the wretched excess department: Columbine, Hetchins, Bates, Ephgrave and the more out-there Colnagos.
For impressing the cognoscenti: all of the above, plus Cinelli, Masi, Chris Chance (road bikes), Richard Sachs, Eisentraut, Frejus & Legnano.
These are not opinions. Just facts. Simple, uncontroversial facts.
No bicycle rides like a Rolls Royce, because a Rolls and a bicycle are trying achieve diametrically opposite goals. The Rolls Royce wants to get you where you are going quickly and with as little effort as possible, with minimal exposure to the road, weather and noise. Also, their cars have undergone dramatic changes in the nearly 100 years of their manufacture, with the pre-WWII cars being at or near the cutting edge of technology and the post-war development slowed to the point of stagnation. Comparisons on the basis of function are impossible because of these facts.
If you are using Rolls as an example of the most elegant of its kind (which RR was at one time, or at worst on the short list), than you should be thinking of Toei, DiNucci, Confente, Weigle and maybe Konno-built 3Rensho.
As a leader in in-house technology design, development and construction (which Rolls was in the teens through the early 1930s, even making their own nuts and bolts): Singer and Herse.
For tops in the wretched excess department: Columbine, Hetchins, Bates, Ephgrave and the more out-there Colnagos.
For impressing the cognoscenti: all of the above, plus Cinelli, Masi, Chris Chance (road bikes), Richard Sachs, Eisentraut, Frejus & Legnano.
These are not opinions. Just facts. Simple, uncontroversial facts.
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11-21-12, 01:46 PM
#40
MIKE is my name!
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11-21-12, 01:50 PM
#41
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For me it would be a custom bike from Vanilla or Sachs.
11-21-12, 01:53 PM
#42
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It rises from the dead, this thread!
No bicycle rides like a Rolls Royce, because a Rolls and a bicycle are trying achieve diametrically opposite goals. The Rolls Royce wants to get you where you are going quickly and with as little effort as possible, with minimal exposure to the road, weather and noise. Also, their cars have undergone dramatic changes in the nearly 100 years of their manufacture, with the pre-WWII cars being at or near the cutting edge of technology and the post-war development slowed to the point of stagnation. Comparisons on the basis of function are impossible because of these facts.
If you are using Rolls as an example of the most elegant of its kind (which RR was at one time, or at worst on the short list), than you should be thinking of Toei, DiNucci, Confente, Weigle and maybe Konno-built 3Rensho.
As a leader in in-house technology design, development and construction (which Rolls was in the teens through the early 1930s, even making their own nuts and bolts): Singer and Herse.
For tops in the wretched excess department: Columbine, Hetchins, Bates, Ephgrave and the more out-there Colnagos.
For impressing the cognoscenti: all of the above, plus Cinelli, Masi, Chris Chance (road bikes), Richard Sachs, Eisentraut, Frejus & Legnano.
These are not opinions. Just facts. Simple, uncontroversial facts.
No bicycle rides like a Rolls Royce, because a Rolls and a bicycle are trying achieve diametrically opposite goals. The Rolls Royce wants to get you where you are going quickly and with as little effort as possible, with minimal exposure to the road, weather and noise. Also, their cars have undergone dramatic changes in the nearly 100 years of their manufacture, with the pre-WWII cars being at or near the cutting edge of technology and the post-war development slowed to the point of stagnation. Comparisons on the basis of function are impossible because of these facts.
If you are using Rolls as an example of the most elegant of its kind (which RR was at one time, or at worst on the short list), than you should be thinking of Toei, DiNucci, Confente, Weigle and maybe Konno-built 3Rensho.
As a leader in in-house technology design, development and construction (which Rolls was in the teens through the early 1930s, even making their own nuts and bolts): Singer and Herse.
For tops in the wretched excess department: Columbine, Hetchins, Bates, Ephgrave and the more out-there Colnagos.
For impressing the cognoscenti: all of the above, plus Cinelli, Masi, Chris Chance (road bikes), Richard Sachs, Eisentraut, Frejus & Legnano.
These are not opinions. Just facts. Simple, uncontroversial facts.
11-21-12, 01:59 PM
#43
car guy, recovering
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Biased? No way, Marnatihead!
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11-21-12, 04:44 PM
#45
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Actually, Aaron, leaving off DeRosa was an oversight. The omission of other bikes was cocking a snook at those benighted folk who think their particular fetish object is somehow good enough to be compared to Rolls Royce.
That said, Frejus & Legnano in their heyday were impressive marques indeed (though more like pre-war Alfa Romeo than Rolls) with many word championships to their credit, and the bikes are deeply loved and appreciated by their past and current owners (or ought to be!). Much as you love your Marnati and I my Olympia(s), these bikes aren't in the same league. Hummph!
Happy Thanksgiving, all!
That said, Frejus & Legnano in their heyday were impressive marques indeed (though more like pre-war Alfa Romeo than Rolls) with many word championships to their credit, and the bikes are deeply loved and appreciated by their past and current owners (or ought to be!). Much as you love your Marnati and I my Olympia(s), these bikes aren't in the same league. Hummph!
Happy Thanksgiving, all!
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11-21-12, 07:17 PM
#47
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