Hi, I bought a Schwinn Paramount at an estate sale. I have tried locating the serial number but have not found one on the B.B. or dropouts. It is full Campy, (the crank arms are stamped Strata) including the dropouts and wheels and hubs. It also has a St. Christopher medal attached to a small block on the down tube between the shifters. I have not seen one like it on-line. I have read that it might be a PDG bike, but how would I know. It has a fade paint job mostly red in color. Any info would greatly help. Thanks, MrBuz.

Two answers (and I mean this to be helpful not pissy)

1) Classic and Vintage Forum

2) Waterford Precision Cycles web page, specifically the history section.

If you can post some photos with details of the frame (lugs, seat cluster, dropouts, fork crown, any decals, etc.) and components (derailleurs, crankset, freewheel or freehub cassette, shifters, headset, etc.) it would be a big help.

P.S. For future reference, starting two threads with identical titles and content in the same forum is very confusing for everyone; not a good thing...

Whoops, that was my fault. I moved this thread in from Road and didn't see the other post.

Hi, Thanks for the tips. I am new at this and need some help. The bike is full Campy, including drop-outs, hubs, wheels. I measured the seat tube when I first got it and I beleive it was 22 1/2" from the B.B. to the top of the seat tube. I could not find a seriel number on the B.B. or drop-outs. It is missing the rear cluster, chain and does not have tires and tubes. The wheels are made for clinchers. It has Campy pedals, toe clips and straps, but on of the clips is broken. The paint is scraped off in various places, it appears from normal use.

Hi, Thanks for the tips. I have tried the Waterford site. The decals look like the ones from the PDG bikes made in Japan, but this bike has all Campy components and Campy drop-outs. I can't seem to locate a frame number. Someone told me to look inside the seat tube. Thanks again

+1

Without a serial number, it's going to be difficult to tell what you have.

My guess - and it's only a guess - is that you have a pre-1980 frame that someone has put a great deal of effort into making it look like a late eighties/early nineties Waterford frame. I'm basing this on the Campy dropouts and Nervex Professional lugs (indicating pre-1980) and the internal top tube cable routing, bottle cage bosses, the large radius fork rake bend, and paint/decals (which would not have been on a pre-1980 Paramount frame).

If it is a pre-1980 Paramount, the serial number would be on rhe left rear dropout. These pre-1980 frames had chrome plating on the rear triangle, and the serial number would be stamped into the dropout like this:



Since your frame has painted dropouts, the painter may have applied the paint so thickly that the serial number got filled in with paint.

The frame does look like a pre-eighties Chicago built Paramount, but everything else is inconsistent with that. Look closely at the left rear dropout and see if you can make out any indentations in the paint that may indicate there's a serial number there.

It is a pre-1980 Paramount from the Nervex era - no earlier then 1971 - with a repaint and post-'84 PDG decals. Granted, I'm assuming it isn't a repainted Superior, as that would mean that whoever repainted it would have had to chrome the rear drops for the effect it has now.

It has also been subject to some considerable frame modifications. While the '78-9 Paramounts did have an option for brazed-on shifter bosses, not a single machine of the Nervex era used through-the-top-tube cable routing - that is entirely new (so is that badge between the shifters, which I fear might be screwed into the downtube).

I'm going to go out on a further limb and reduce the effective range to 1971-1977, as I note pre-CSPC revision (1978-on) Nuovo Record brake calipers on it. They are likely original.

That said, most of the components appear original, as a matter of fact, with exception to:

The second-gen C-Record RD and FD
C-Record headset
Chainrings (Record crankset has replacement SR rings on it, but as the stamping on the crankarms has the earlier pre-CSPC font. I will venture to say the arms are original)
C-Record pedals
Super Record seatpost

If the bars and stem are Cinelli old-logo, they probably are original.

Take a photo of the same dropout Scooper pointed out. If the paint is too thick, drop the fork - the serial should be stamped there as well (looks to be the original fork).

-Kurt