1974 UO-8.

Late-70's upgrade Sugino Idol cranks are shot. Still using the original Lyotard pedals, they're still in great shape. Pulled one to double-check the size: they're on Sugino cranks, and Sheldon sez 9/16-20, but... they measure 14mm according to the calipers, no numbers on crank nor pedal. Pedals are marked L & R. Anybody know fer sure what which would be on a '74 UO-8? Sure looks like 14mm to me, but then why mark it in English?

Also, I have a new spindle; how can I tell if the spindle I have here is JIS or ISO? Can't find the actual dimensions, or even a side by side photo.

Also, I'm guessing there's 2 chances of finding a 175-180mm vintage Nervar, TA, or Stronglight crankset with clean tapers and threads and a useful BCD for a cheapskate price, ennit?

How acurate are you calipers? 9/16 is 14.2875mm so they are pretty close. My guess would be 9/16-20 if they say L & R. My French Lyotards say D & G for droit and gauche (right and left). Your best bet for the spindle is to look at the brand and any markings. Euro brands except Campy are usually ISO, Campy (this could start a religious war) has its own proprietary standard until '94 and ISO thereafter and most Japanese are JIS (with some exceptions). I can't just look at them and tell.

I was using little brass General Tools caliper cause it was the only one I had metric.

Dial caliper sez .547"

9/16" = .5625"
14mm = .551"
pedal = .547"

HW store didn't have anything 9/16-20, nor 14mm - 1.25, but I was able to find a bolt in a diferent dia. w/ 1.25 thread, and it lined up fine by eye (yes I took the RH pedal to the HW store). Really looks like 14mm with L & R markings.

Found a faint "FIRST" logo on the spindle. I'm guessing First Components in Taichung. It's marked 3T and Boron and First, don't know why they wouldn't have added one more stamp to make clear which taper it is.

I'll find a known 9/16-20 or 14mm crank to try the pedal on and see if it fits.

Yep, probably the simplest way to do it.

I can't say I've heard of a standard thread marking actually stating 14 mm. 99.9% the English 9/16x20 is the thread you have. Not everything on a '70s UO-8 was French or metric. Peug were building a highly mass-produced bicycle, and in that business you have to spec out parts that you can get a lot of. The whole rest of the world was already mainly using the British thread.

Another point is that your Sugino crank is not the original, if it was a 1975 bike. Mine is possibly 1971 thru 1975 according to Miami Jim's site on Peugs, and it came with a very rusty steel cottered crank. My extremely clear recollection of these bikes, and the catalog pics, is that this is actually the original equipment. Someone along the way did a cottered to Sugino cotterless upgrade on your bike.

Now after up to 34 years you think that Sugino is at the end of its life, but that's not all so clear from what you've said, "they're shot." What's actually wrong with the cranks? About all that can happen to the crank arms is cracking or breakage. A swaged spider (swaged to the right crank arm) may be coming loose from the crank arm, as well. A crunchiness while spinning is a bottom bracket problem, and chainwheel or tooth problems can be cured by replacing the chainring. Be careful with those pedal threads, you will need them intact if you decide to keep using the Sugino.

Tell us more, it doesn't sound like you've described the real problem.

Re the thread, take a very finely-graduated scale and carefully measure across the group of thread peaks, and accurately count the number of threads. Do some simple arithmetic with a calculator to find the number of threads per inch. You should come up with something between 18 and 22. If you do, I really think you have, as we said, English 9/16 x 20.

I wouldn't make too much of the First of Taichung identification. Get a good measurement of what you have instead.

Regarding period correct, your Lyotard pedals are probably as correct as anything can be. I recall rattrap-style pedals on those bikes, and the catalogs agree.

Thanks for the info, Road Fan.

The bike is a '74, and I'm the original owner. THe cotterless cranks, the weinmann hubs, new winner freewheel, tall seatpost and bar stem, all my doing. All done in the mid-late '70's & my memory of all the specs is a bit hazy.

The cranks are shot in that the chainrings are very worn, and the large ring is swaged on. THe non-drive crank is now bottomed out on its taper and starting to creak, it's on so far the dust cap hits the bolt threads before seating. Also, they are 170mm & I have a 36" inseam, and would really like longer cranks. And it's very hilly here and the 42T small ring is to large for me these days. I've gotten good use from this crankset and am satisfied I've gotten my moneys worth from them.

However, I'd really like to put on some longer French cranks with at least a 53/39 chainrings.

The new winner freewheel is a 13/28 and in fine shape, but I'm swapping it out for a 6speed winner ultra that's 13/30, again for that little extra help up some of the hills in the neighborhood. 42/28 is a 1:1.5 gear ratio, 39/30 would give me 1:1.3, which I think will be just enough to get me up and over. I'd also be willing to try even smaller rings; would hate to loose anything off the top end, but really need help up the hills. 1:1.5 was fine 30 years ago, but the bikes a little older now, and it's harder to get her to go over the hills.

As far as measuring the taper, that's exactly what I'd like to know: the dimensions of JIS and ISO tapers.
The taper on the new spindle is .50 at the small end and .55 at the shoulder, taper length is .74 from the shoulder to the end of the taper.
It's a 3T which is prolly too long anyway. I can turn it around if it is too long, I guess, until I can get the exact length I need.

Pedal threads do look like 5 per 1/4".

How about a Sugino XD600 triple and Grand Cru 113mm threadless bottom bracket from Velo Orange?.

That would be a very nice option, but a bit pricey for me. And I don't actually need a BB, the original is fine, and I already have a new spindle for it, once I find a new old crankset I'll just figure out what size spindle gives the best chainline and swap it out. And the Sugino, for all it's value and practicality is a bit, well, modern-looking.

Measuring the taper is not easy. If you have a Campy crank, it's almost certainly ISO. Anything Sugino, SunTour, or Shimano would be JIS.

It sounds like not only are arms broken, but either they've been overtorqued badly over the years, or there's an ISO crank spindle in there, Campy or perhaps another brand.

Guilty. "Mongo tighten bolt good." SNAP! "Awww...bicycle break in half. Mongo sad."

When you get your new stuff, get a torque wrench, too. It'll cure Mongo.

Post a picture of your spindle. I think a lot of us can tell if it's ISO or JIS just by looking at it. JIS is the stubby one. Your crank is Japanese, so that's probably what you've got, but not necessarily.

Good luck finding a vintage French crank with rings in decent condition for a reasonable price. Make enough low ball bids on eBay and eventually you'll get one, but it could take a while.

Got one hanging in the shop, right next to the 5lb. crank extractor tool.

>8^)

This is a new spindle, not installed yet, so it may or may not match what's in there now. I just want it to match the new crankset:





Bought an old Dura Ace on ebay that looks to be in pretty good shape. When that arrives I'll have a known quantity: JIS taper & 9/16-20 pedal threads; also it has the smaller chainring I wanted to try, and the cranks are 177.5mm , so I can see how I like longer cranks. That'll give me a better idea of what I really want/need as far as rings and crank length, before I bid on some NOS Stronglight someone just found in an attic in Paris.

And I really appreciate all the advice/help/assistance/suggestions everyone has given.