Empty/torn up box at buyer?
 

Hey all, this isn't a C&V question, but I figure y'all do more shipping of goods than most people here, so I thought maybe you could help. I recently sold some goods to someone on the classifieds section of the site. Apparently, when they got to him today, he says the box was all torn up and the packing material was inside, but the seatpost and saddle I sent him weren't. I sent it via USPS. Any ideas of what can be done to rectify this? He e-mailed me some pictures of a torn up box. I personally wouldn't accept any box that was opened, but I don't know what to do in this case?

You should have sold them to me locally ;)

Did you have any insurance? I'm guessing if you don't, then whether the seller is lying or it was ruined in transit doesn't make a difference as you are SOL.

Good luck.

Not knowing what kind of box and how packaged, I cannot comment on that. Now whenever I have received an envelope or box via USPS with damage to the shell that exposes the inside, the Post Office places it in a bag with an apology to the recipient.
If it was insured, file a claim, if tampered with file a claim with the recipient's home zip post office, mail tampering is a Fed. deal, I am not sure how packages are handled exactly, but a postal inspector I bet will look into it. And one of the first questions will be to the carrier, "do you remember this?" A torn open package is a hot potato. It may not be the recipient, I have had mail stolen, it got ugly when they caught the thief, they have a new Federal address.

yes, I should have sold locally, or should have insured it, or should have not sold to someone with only 7 posts. Looks like I may be SOL. It was in a big brown box that I'd previously gotten something from amazon it, all seams double taped with packing tape and more across the top and bottom and filled with air pillows and other packing material (wrapped in bubble wrap). I figured I was safe. Guess I'm screwed. I can't imagine the post office would deliver something that had the end opened (like repechage, the one thing I had that was opened through the post office was repacked by them with a note), so I'm guessing something happened after delivery.

Those low count posters seem to show all kind of curious behavior as a group.

I think you should file a claim. I highly doubt a carrier would deliver a torn up box without any kind of notification...I wouldn't refund the money just yet.

who should I file a claim with? I can see him filing a claim with the post office, but I don't know what I can do from my end.

I would guess the PO in his town. If he's asking for a refund I'm guessing it's on you to file a claim.

Or you could tell him to #$%^ himself and file his own claim with the post office and refuse to refund...I would probably do the former unless I got a really bad vibe from the guy.

+1 Really curious. I have shipped a lot of stuff via USPS without incident. In my experience, as long as it is packed well, I don't have problems (and I have reused a lot of Amazon boxes, along with various grocery store boxes, cut down, etc.) Where I have seen problems like this is when sellers try to use a flat rate envelope for bulky stuff. Those envelopes just could not take the abuse, and it was common to have them arrive torn up (and sometimes missing parts). I understand the USPS has clamped down on flat rate envelope abusers.

I highly doubt the post office will do a thing on this one.

This to me looks like someone purposefully opened it rather than shipping damage, but what do I know?
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So does everyone else insure everything or just take the occasional loss as the cost of selling things on the interwebz? I thought I was being sage by getting tracking. Guess not.

That does look like someone opened it - I'm going to say the buyer, when he took out the goods.

Maybe I'm just a pessimist, but I definitely wouldn't give him the benefit of the doubt.

Let's see: One flap of the box open, bubble pack showing, and - quite curiously - no shots clearly indicating the box is empty. Right.

-Kurt

Neither the tape nor the box show much trauma.


You can reject delivery? How does that help, if it wasn't insured, etc?

The box looks like it was open and the contents removed. Or, the parts are there but not there, Bohr was referring to the concept known as the “wave collapse.” The act of measuring causes the “potentiality” of a particle to “collapse” into reality. Others have extended this to postulate the existence of parallel realities which offers sci-fi idea that a particle not only collapses into this reality, but also collapses into all possible particle states in parallel universes.

Next time insure the item, it cost a lot less and there's piece of mind!

Was the package left at the front door?

Does the last sentence sum up all that stuff above it?

i'm a letter carrier for the USPS in california.

anytime i/we receive a package or envelope that has been torn or opened and contents lost, we still deliver the item. i've received letters that have been torn from left to right (along with the contents, checks on more than one occasion) with the other half missing, and delivered it. the USPS does not hold onto mail (unless suspicious contents/sender, etc.)

99% of the time, a package that has been damaged in transit (whether contents are missing or not) will be marked/stamped by the USPS as such (ie. "received without contents" or "damaged in transit").

you can refuse any piece of mail for any reason. refusing this package would have done nothing to help either party involved.

sorry, this "happened" but this is why USPS/UPS/FEDEX/etc offer insurance coverage.


you'd be surprised what your letter carrier can remember, i've had a few different routes, all of which i've memorized the names of all 500+ residents.

i'd suggest contacting the recipient's post office and speaking to the carrier that carried that route on the day the package was delivered, chances are the carrier will remember delivering the package, especially if it were missing the contents, ESPECIALLY!

in my opinion, that box does not look like it was damaged in transit, the front of it would have to be smashed in, in order to pull that flap out of there, and it's not.

Just so I know for future, what does insurance cost me? 10% of the value? More, less? A set fee?

I agree I ship & get shipped a lot of stuff and for the box to show up looking like that it was damaged in transit it would be crushed & and show more damage. Looks to me like the tape was cut and the top pulled open, but it doesn't look like much tape was used. When I ship something I really pack it well, no movement when you shake the box and I use plenty of tape so that there is no chance of the contents falling out even if the box was run over by a truck ( it happens, tire marks and all).


Insurance I think ( my wife handles the postage when we are shipping ) is about $2 per $100 in value or something like that. When I ship something valuable (over $50) I add insurance but anymore if it is a $1-20 item I don't bother in the long run it is cheaper for me to refund one item that may be damaged then to insure 20 items I just shipped, I do how ever get delivery confirmation on everything I ship unless I really trust the person it is being shipped to.

Glenn

Any idea on the best way to get the contact info for that dude's local post office?

Yeah, with person to person shipping rejecting doesn't affect the outcome, but would provide some official verification that it was damaged in shipping and would make the sender believe it more.

eh, I'm an idiot, easily found and usps.com

Unless there was a substitute carrier that day, my experience is the carrier will remember if things were amiss.

The only times where I didn't receive my items and delivery confirmation shows I did was when we had a substitute carrier.

Glenn

I think the guy's wife opened it, she was pissed that it was MORE bike stuff, and threw it out.
Well, at least, that's the version in my head.

Sorry for you problems though. That sucks. I have no idea what you need to do....