texaspandj

Man o man. I put the bottom bracket that I took from an 87 MV and put it on the New 89 and the spindle is too short. What gives? Initially I measured the spindle to put the longer side on the drive side, but there was no difference that I could detect. So i put it on and hoped I chose the correct side. It was too short, so I reinstalled with the other end of the spindle on the drive side, same thing. The chainring doesn't rub but with chain it would . The 89 Bottom bracket shell measures 68 mm and the spindle from the MV is 112 mm. Either I'm doing something wrong, the spindle is too short, or crank arm is wallowed out. I did notice the chainring wobbles a bit. However initially it was fine on the MV. Maybe some of y'all may have an answer. Your opinions may vary but will certainly be appreciated by me. Thanks.

rccardr 

Same crank? If not, that could be your issue. Different models of crank often have different offsets.
112 BB should always be symmetrical, so that shouldn't be a problem.
Pics would help, but even if the chainring itself is only 2mm from the chainstay, the chain will clear because it never rides on that section of the ring, only the top, front, and bottom.
Possible too that the geometry change from one year to the other included a change in the chainstays.

texaspandj

Awesome, great point. I was checking with the chain next to the chain stay which as you pointed out is not where the chain will be near.
It is the same crankset with BB.
I will reinstall BB and crankset .....again. And continue with the build. I'll hope for the best and take a pic.
I'm looking forward to seeing if there is a geometry change.
Mystery solved. Thanks so much rccardr.

RobbieTunes

You need to stop drinking and wrenching. Leave that to me and Doc.
Your '87 MV Ironman had a Shimano 105 crankset on a Tange BB, I believe.
Your '89 Smoke on the Water Ironman had a Suntour GPX crankset, I believe.

Yes, there is a difference between the spindle length for Shimano 1050 and Suntour GPX.

However...

If it fits, and the chain does not rub, and you're OK on the rear. go forth young man.
You should have 2 mm clearance from the chainstay to the small ring. Everything else is gravy.

Yes, there is a geometry change. Even if it's just in your mind, now that we've planted it there.

I have a 7410 crankset, with matching bb, but it'll cost you dearly.

RobbieTunes

Perhaps we should renamed the Purple Haze to the Purple Rain....the irony is not lost on me, as Prince sometimes gigged as a Hendrix tribute guy. I'm sure he got a kick out of it. I rode my Purple Haze/Rain Ironman today for 34 miles. Actually went faster with the 48/34 compact than 2 days ago on the Carbon R, and it was windier today. Something tells me my legs like spinning a bit better.

One problem though. I wore my HR monitor (actually followed doctor's orders for once) 2 days ago, and uploaded results today.
Average HR was 161 and max HR was 212. That's a bit high for a workout ride.
On a treadmill test I once ran 218 bpm for 15 minutes and then fell over.

As a result, I left the damn thing off today.

Reminds me of Thunder Ridge. I had my Garmin HR alarm set to 210, and the speed alarm set to 4mph.
Climbing the Ridge, the speed alarm would go off, so I'd speed up, then the HR alarm would go off.
Can't win.

poke em

Picked up a Carbon Ironman last night:

rccardr 

Robbie, that's way too high on the heart rate monitor. I slow down once I hit 150 or so, even though I'm somewhat more chronologically mature than you.

But you already know that, right?

Right?

texaspandj

Beautiful. Excellent. Pure envy from me. Congratulations and welcome. What are your plans with that beauty? Keeping it stock or not?

texaspandj

Contrary to appearances I only drink when I'm performing with my band. Which sadly has dwindled down to once a month. However tonight I thought if you and rccardr do it while wrenching dammit I can do it too. And maybe just maybe I can have better results like y'all. And it worked. Also I figured out what the plate on the bike stand is for.
In fact I figured out a lot of uhhh stuff . The Chainring is closest to the chain stay at the long section of the biopace ring, Duh. And also the chainring needed a little tightening, doh!
Beer the answer to, and the cause of all of life's problems, also makes you a better wrencher. Later Irongents.
Still looks a little close.
Side note: I agree we should change it to purple rain as some other bike brand has adopted purple haze.

RobbieTunes

When they find me in the ditch, I'll still be smiling, and that HR monitor will still be beeping, even if I'm not.

RobbieTunes

Score of the year, folks.

markwesti

poke em , nice machine . How much does it weigh .
I don't always drink beer when I wrench but when I don't I drink JD .

fleslider 

ohh nice.. it looks great. Post some more pics when you get a chance!

orcas island 

Ooh- I'm all in on that one! Beautiful bike; i'd love to find one in a 54cm!

markwesti

You don't see these every day , prolly a good price too . What do you say tex , It's your size buddy ..... Nudge nudge . But you know on the other hand , this is a Velo Drome bike . Why did centurion put a water bottle mount and drill it for brakes ?
1983 Centurion "Trac" 54cm track frame This one has been messed with , should look like this .
https://www.google.com/search?q=cent...rhN2tAMEVzM%3A

RobbieTunes

Friday:
30.07 mi

Heart Rate
161 bpm
Avg HR

212 bpm
Max HR


Today (didn't have as much time, walked 2 miles with Mrs. T in the AM, going to do 2 miles now...
21.05 mi

Heart Rate
154 bpm
Avg HR

198 bpm
Max HR

At this rate, by August, it will be in the teens...

texaspandj

Very cool and clean. I actually was gonna post that for you, although I know you prefer a 56. Currently I'm saving my pennies for an 85 Ironman. Besides I don't have good leg speed or explosive power in my legs. Still I might have taken a shot at it if it was cheaper. It's really nice.
I wonder what the frame geometry is?

jetboy 

Carbon ironman and robbies carbon have me trolling the webs. Not easy bikes to find! You guys scored.

RobbieTunes

Patience is a virtue.

triitout

Robbie, you may get some comfort from Joel Friel's HR article.
Joe Friel - High Heart Rate Questions

texaspandj

+1

RobbieTunes

Thanks, good reading. When I was young and fit, I was a treadmill guinea pig for Ross Laboratories (Ensure, Exceed, among 9 or 10 million other products).
We did body fat measurements 3 or 4 different ways: under water, pinches, weights, etc. Wearing nothing but a thong among grad students, that was different.

We then went into VO2 max testing to establish thresholds. Bear in mind, this was the 80's, and the computer controlling the industrial treadmill was an AT386.
We started out at 6-min miles on even ground, wearing the helmet, breathing through the hose. The speed and incline were gradually raised until you fell over.
You could give up earlier if you wanted to, but once the first guy bragged about his VO2, it was "on," trying to beat the best figures or die trying.
This, of course, resulted in my 15 minutes at 218, at which point many things went blank. The treadmill was at 11% grade and sub-5 miles.
My VO2 max was 78.6

Then, two double-blind trials, with the computer setting the treadmill speed (no incline) to result in 80% of your VO2 max.

To prep for this, we had to run our normal workouts the 5 days prior (for me, 10 miles a day).
We also had to eat nothing but 5 granola bars provided by the study, and 5 cans of Ensure Plus. All the water we wanted.

You ran with the helmet/tube on, blood taken every 10 min, staring at a wall chart that asked how you were "feeling" on a scale of 1-10.
Also every 10 min, 4 oz of their new sport drink, or the placebo, and neither the grad students nor you knew which.
The result was massive hematoma's because they used a PhD to take blood instead of a nurse.
I went 3:49 at about 5:35 pace and yep, fell over. I looked like a heroin junkie and could barely move my arms.

Two weeks later, we did it again. Same routine, but with a nurse taking the blood samples, as they were facing a mutiny on that front.
I went 3:19 at about 5:30 pace and simply said "no mas." I was tired of the tube, the needles, and staring at that stupid wall chart.

The results of the study were that the runners were too human. They competed on VO2 max, speed, and time on the treadmill.
Also, most of us were so in tune with our bodies that we picked up on the placebo/sports drink difference right away.
The study director concluded that the sports drink may work, but there was no real way to tell with that study.
Ross made it, anyway. I'm sure they had other studies that showed it worked. Called it Exceed.

Shortly thereafter, I had a heart attack in a 5K race. I was 26 years old. It was probably my 2nd, as I had chest pains the week before in a race.

The result of that was being banned from the human performance lab, and being told not to run more than 3 miles at faster than 8 minute pace.

The result of that was I stopped doing the hectic 5K's and concentrated on marathons and longer distances, notching many under 2:30 in the next years.

So, long story short, I don't worry about the high heart rates.
I've had poor synapse since I was little, so my pain threshold doesn't kick in very quickly.
The gist of that is I will get little warning, and it will be quick. To counter that, I stay in some resemblance of shape.

texaspandj

Interesting article. I bought a HR monitor in 88 but only used it for a month. Now that I'm older maybe I should reinvest in another. In Dave Scott's book he said he had one but it just sat on a shelf. In Mark Allen's book he lived by it. He described a test in which he ran a mile on the track at a certain HR then after training with his monitor for a month or so in his aerobic zone, at the same heartrate he was able to run a faster time. He said it helped him back off when his body needed to and consequently stay healthier. But I also remember him saying that initially he felt embarrassed having to run slow to keep in his aerobic zone and started running in hours he wouldn't be seen by fellow competitors. Pretty funny.
Like most competitors, I've been training in blocks. Like a triangle. My first layer is base. Long slow miles, no hurry, just getting my tendons,ligaments,and muscles used to it. Second layer is strength. Hills, wind, weights, trying to get stronger. Finally the top layer is speed. Intervals,time trials,pick ups trying to get faster. I will begin speed training in May. Unfortunately I had a mental set back when my plans to complete a full ironman fell through. So I'm starting my speed phase late. But I picked myself back up,got reinspired by y'all and have resumed my triathlon training and goals. Speed training is absolutely no fun on the track but kinda fun on the bike. Racing for me is my reward. For whatever reasons I love pushing myself in a race no thinking just monitoring and staying focused on the task is somehow freeing to me. And just seeing how well I can do on that particular day is intellectually stimulating.
It's weird the stuff that pops in your head when giving your best effort. Try as you might it's challenging to focus and block out the pain. You start thinking about what shirt you should wear tomorrow or what someone said that made you laugh.
But being an older dad, ultimately and hopefully this will pay off for my 20 month old daughter. I'll be here longer or healthier for her sake. However Whatever floats your boat Irongents, let's keep those wheels on Those underated Ironman turning.

texaspandj

DANG RT! Sure explains a lot about your mental health status.
Wow totally impressed. But your torture was not in vain. Exceed was the best rehydration product on the market in the 80s clinically speaking. And the one I used. And so much better than Gatorade at the time. I think they were bought out. I haven't seen any in years. Oh yeah, btw WOW R.T.

Your vo2 max is on par with the big four in triathlon Dave Scott, Scott Molina, Scott Tinley, and Mark Allen. I have their vo2 max listed in a book I'll try to locate it. Also of note, BF members say Lances vo2 max was low until he started doping. But not true, I have an article stating his vo2 max Pre cycling in a magazine somewhere. It was the highest recorded at that facility. Geez I need to catalog my reading material. I always wondered what Miguel Indurain vo2 max was. I think olympic marathon gold medalist Frank Shorter was only 72. Oh yeah, Daaaaaang RT

rccardr 

Interesting story, Robbie. I guess some of us just have a higher (or lower) HR than others.