dear friends,
i have tried for many years to identify this cycle of mine but can't do so , i therefore request the help of you experts. Kindly find the attached photographs.
Your help will be highly appreciated as i am restoring this bike and want to put the original name and monogram on it.
Regards,
carl fonseca.
Bombay, india

Well, it's clearly of British origin - says so on the BB shell. Those drop-outs suggest maybe a 1930's to 1940's Claud Butler with 'Continental' style drop-outs, but the wrap round seat stays don't seem right for that - all the Claud butlers of that era I've had came with the style shown in the picture below of my 1935 model. The rather crude but interesting cutaways in the lugs and fork crown again suggest an early frame. Sorry I can't be of more help - try https://www.classicrendezvous.com/

By the way Carl, what is the frame number and where is it located on the frame? Can you post a photo of that?

The fork crown is similar in style to my 1935 Claud as well - as far as I can see from your photos. Have a look at the Claud Butler catalogues on this site and see what details match up?

https://www.nkilgariff.com/

I know one thing for sure about that frame? It's AWESOME! Thanks for sharing it!,,,,BD

hello sir ,
the frame number is N 24733 and punched near the seat post or top of the frame where the seat post fits
thank you,
regards,
carl fonseca

The "Made in England" stamp on the BB shell is for the shell itself. I have seen that on a few different bikes. That being said, it does seem British and probably pre-war. I like it, you should build it up and ride it.

Then not a Claud Butler after all Carl, but almost certainly British and pre-1939 as vjp has pointed out. There were literally hundreds of small frame-builders in England during that period: every town had three or four craftsmen hand building high quality frames in tiny workshops, so unless someone else has, or has had, a similar frame, it's going to be difficult to trace it. The serial number might be a clue to its age, maybe the last two digits '33' mean 1933? Depends on the maker, they all used different systems. Try the British Isles section of this web site and look at the pictures and catalogues for clues: https://www.classicrendezvous.com/


Good luck, it's a really nice, interesting frame and should ride very well. My 1935 bike is both sporty and comfortable. Don't worry too much about fitting very old parts to it, just keep the build simple and don't alter/damage the frame in any way, so that if you do discover what it was like when new and can get the parts, you can then rebuild it that way if you want to. It's your bike, make it the way you like it - and please post pictures here, so we can all see!

Just a thought Carl, did you get the frame in India? Hopper Cycles of Barton on Humber North Lincolnshire (later to become Elswick-Hopper and then part of Falcon Cycles), exported thousands of bikes to India in the 1930's crated ten to a wooden box complete with tools, loaded onto ships direct from their factory, Maybe it's one of those? I've never seen an early model.

yes sir this frame is in india and i am in the process of restoring and painting it so just want to know the name so i can put it on the frame again thank you all for your lovely suggestions, am grateful for the time and trouble you have taken.
regards and warm wishes,
carl fonseca.
bombay.
india

dear friends,
one more thing i forgot to mention is that on the front fork midway there was a welded threaded nut for the light bracket which was removed before i could get that cycle does this make any relevance in identifying it.
regards,
carl fonseca

I have same or similar "made in england" stamp on my 1950s Dawes

https://www.flickr.com/photos/8276564...7631635396609/