Ol Danl

So, did Panasonic just build frames for Schwinn, or were they complete bikes? A lot of the bikes had Maillard hubs -- I had sort of assumed Japanese manufacturers would have most likely used Asian made hubs.

wrk101

Panasonic did both, mainly complete bikes. Prologue is the only exception I am aware of.

Steve Whitlatch 

Does your Prologue have decals showing it was made in Japan?

rhenning

Sorry Scopper I was thinking Waterloo and typed the other. Maybe I need to proof read more. Roger

Steve Whitlatch 

What indicates a Greenville model? Both of my Schwinn Circuits would indicate Japan built by serial number?

Steve Whitlatch 

How does this article tell us what was made at the plant after it was printed? Schwinn changed things up every year. Is there a Schwinn produced list, or Panasonic list anywhere that confirms anything or is everything just speculation mixed with deduction?

zazenzach

in the late 80s, the Paramounts and anything made with Tenax tubing was made in Greenville, Mississippi. i believe everything else was japanese. does your circuit have tange tubing? if so its definitely made by panasonic.

if i remember correctly, the circuit/prologue was top of their normal line (ie everything but Paramount), and was outsourced to Japan to make a high quality bike at a more affordabe price. The Paramounts had all the frills, were made in USA, and had the pricetag to prove it. sometime later (i believe in the early 90s), the paramounts eventually started getting outsorced to japan (as only the top end paramounts were made in waterford)

Whit51 

The 87,88 and 89 Circuits have Columbus SL main tubes and Tange forks and stays. 23 cm and above frames had a Columbus SP seat tube. This article, and everything else I've read on the subject, says 80's Circuits were made in Greeneville.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/hairle...3280/comments/

Steve Whitlatch 

[QUOTE=Whit51;17320380]
That is my understanding as well. So from my personal experience, is why I believed what indicates a Greenville built bike is the Chicago head badge. My wifes old Schwinn Le Tour, my old Prelude, both of my Circuits all have had the Chicago head badge. The serial numbers on my Circuits could make them Japan but the Chicago head badge and the fact that they do not have Schwinn Approved decals. Now I have a Voyageur that follows the same marking scheme. Can anyone produce pictures of mid to late 80`s Schwinn`s that have the Chicago head badge and decals showing it was imported?

rhenning

Zazenzach in the 1980s Paramounts were built in Waterford WI at the same plant that builds Waterfords today. In the early 1990s until Schwinn was bought out most OS Paramounts were made in Japan with the best ones built in Waterford or other USA manufacturers. Roger

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Here's a summary of what I know or have learned up to this point, plus some questions I'm still wondering about. (Thanks everyone for all the info you've provided.)

My 86 Voyageur has a Columbus (Tenax) frame, a Tange fork and Japanese (Sansin?) hubs. It's the one with the "Schwinn Voyageur" badge and the "Made in Japan" label on the seat tube. My 87 also has a Columbus frame and Tange fork, but has Malliard hubs. It's badge says "Schwinn Chicago" and there's no trace of a "Made in Japan" label. The 87 apparently has a Japanese serial number, but the source confirming that predates the Mississippi factory.

So apparently it's possible for a Columbus frame to come from Japan. Is a Tange fork an indication a bike wasn't made in Mississippi? Are Malliard hubs an indication a bike wasn't made in Japan?

Is there anyone out there with a bike they know came from Mississippi? What's the serial number?

Is there anyone out there with a bike that has a "Schwinn Chicago" badge and a "Made in Japan" label? Is there anyone out there with a bike that has a non-Chicago badge and a "Made in USA" label?

dddd

Maillard hubs were popular on Taiwan-produced bikes such as later Nishikis, and the Maillard hubs were eventually produced in Taiwan under KK branding.

It does seem likely that Maillard hubs are indicative of a non Japanese-made bike.

The Maillard hubs are something I dread to see on a used bike purchase, as on many 1980's Schwinns. I rarely find such hubs without pitting defects in the bearings, even on exceptionally low-mileage ones.
Even my Taiwan/Costco 1987 Motiv Defiant road bike has these hubs, and with apparently only a hundred miles on the bike, the front hub cones were both pitted! I lucked out and was able to adjust the hub so that both cone's defects are atop the axle when so positioned in the dropouts (with each cone marked for defect position), so perhaps I'll be able to get some good few thousand miles out of the wheels. It would have helped greatly if the factory set the bearings looser, with just enough "tension" so that all freeplay disappeared only as the QR lever came to a full close against the dropouts. No such worries at the rear as the solid-axle freewheel hub sees no increase in bearing tension as the nuts are tightened.

zazenzach

You may well be right. after looking at the headbadge gallery and studying various threads/posts here of other's bikes, an 80s schwinn with a "Schwinn Chicago" headbadge appears to indicate american.

they seemed to have used a "Schwinn Approved" for their late 70s - early 80s japan bikes, and the "Schwinn Quality" for their japanese/taiwan bikes from the late 80s to 90s.

SVG's post about his 86 japanese voyageur having just a "Schwinn Voyageur" headbadge seems to fit into this scheme. Very odd though because until recently, i thought schwinn columbus frames were exclusively american built.

link to headbadge gallery: VeloBase.com - Head Badge Gallery


Yes, I'm aware of this. my poor grammar made it sound like the tenax schwinns and the paramounts were from the same shop, when in fact they werent.

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I know this thread is old, but I finally got around to taking a picture of the bike. This is with new bar tape, chain and (half) toe clips. I also added the rack and lights, and switched to a lighter pair of wheels (gift from a friend who took them from an old Trek) for summer riding.

The Golden Boy 

The Voyageurs are really cool bikes!

Here's a couple of head badges:

Panasonic built 86 Voyageur:






And a Panasonic built 84 Voyageur SP.

zazenzach

I have a question.... do you know what Mississippi made bike serials look like???

I just came across an '87 Prelude (stamped on headbadge as 87 and matches to catalogs) but with a serial of I621932.

So it has 7 digits and a letter followed by a number. Clearly that fits the Japanese serial pattern. Except it says 'I' is never used. And there is that news article claiming 86 preludes were made in the US so I would assume the 87 was too.

Based on all the comparisons, I still think "Schwinn Chicago" headbadges indicate american made and "schwinn quality" or other specialized headbadges (except "Paramount) indicate imported. But I could be wrong.

The Golden Boy 

I believe you would be incorrect- see the Cimarron.

lord_athlon

My Super Le Tour has a Schwinn Chicago headbadge and the serial is SL403314

KZBrian

This is a 1986 Super Sport, made in Mississippi.

zazenzach

That's a really good point. D'oh.

That's interesting. Do you know if it was American? That certainly doesn't have the japanese serial style mentioned

I'm referring to the serials on the bottom bracket.

According to the people here, a Japanese made bike can also have that same badge with digit stamp. Apparently it's the serial format on the BB (on 80's bikes) that can determine what is or isn't japanese.

Metacortex

That I62xxxx serial no. corresponds almost exactly to my '87 Cimarron (0297 badge). The I6 indicates the frames were built in Sept. '86. Note that Greenville did not adhere to the no "I" in the serial number rule, but neither did Panasonic.

My MS-built '87 Cimarron also has a "Schwinn Chicago" badge, so you may have something there. It might have been a change made in '85 or later though.

The Golden Boy 

I also seem to recall my Giant made 84 World Sport had a "Schwinn Chicago" badge. While the "Schwinn Approved" badges made it relatively clear- (except for the seat tube graphic with the Chicago and zip code)- it appears the compass point badge was a little loosey goosey.

Do you think those 'country of origin' laws got a little stiffer around 85 or so?

Metacortex

I couldn't say for sure, but the badge use does seem to have been more consistent after that time.

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Here's the '87 Voyageur's "Schwinn Chicago" head badge, and the bottom of the seat tube where it doesn't say "Made in Japan for Schwinn..." Comparing this to my '86 Voyageur, which has the "Schwinn Voyageur" head badge like Golden Boy's and does say "Made in Japan..." ...that's what prompted me to start this thread.

I may post a picture of the '86 after I get it back from a friend whose working on the bottom bracket. It looks pretty much like others' '86 Voyageurs, but I like looking at those pictures, so maybe they'll like looking at mine

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The serial number underneath the bottom bracket is K605369, in case anyone's interested.