Same here, haven't been hit while riding a bicycle in over 40 years.

One doesn't need to be a Richard to be safe.

:thumb:

Huh, I guess I've never thought too hard about this.

In the morning, the only left turn I make is onto a side street up to the office. So I usually take the entire turn lane for myself. The lane has always been empty, so I signal and make it clear where I'm headed. My left turn home is on a busy street onto a busy street that leads to a pretty congested bridge. Usually, I just go to the front of the row. I signal, and try to make it clear where I'm headed, regardless of if people are looking at me or not. Though the past few days, I've hit the light just as its turned green, so I've been able to slide on through and not worry about the oncoming traffic too much.

Edit: I feel like I have a bad track record! I've been biking "seriously" for about 2 years, and have been in 1 accident. It was ruled that the driver was to fault. Its really impressive to hear about cyclists who been at it for decades and never been in an accident!

I didn't mention anything about the statistically highest chance of being injured as a cyclist in traffic, not sure where you're getting that from. You are more than welcome to pull some stats for me if you want, but that's your burden not mine. I also never said that motorists run over cyclists for no reason...not clear where that is headed either.

A car most certainly would have room to pass you during a left turn if the oncoming lane is clear and no median separates the two. This is apparently not the case for any of the roads you cycle on, which is unusual but possible I suppose.

Surely you understand the nature of stop light traffic; ie it's like a reverse slinky insofar as a vehicle will not begin moving forward (creeping doesn't count) until the vehicle in front of it moves forward, the lead vehicle notwithstanding of course. Therefore, when waiting in a line of traffic, upon the green (the context here is a light, not a sign) there exists a moment where you are waiting in a line that is moving. Unless you just happen to always cycle amongst friendly, unhurried drivers (not the case in Denver, as anyone in Laramie or Cheyenne will tell you) then you end up holding up the line when the wave gets to you...especially once the turn starts to straighten out and vehicles begin more rapid acceleration.

I am willing to give a qualifier here: if you are only 2 or 3 cars back, it doesn't matter, at least in my experience. In busy traffic, high congestion, rush hour, near the local college, etc, I find it better to filter up to the front and get out of the intersection and out of the way quickly. Makes everyone more agreeable, and bonus - you don't have to wait as long either or get stuck because of a wonky 5 second green light.

Influence and control are, as you have observed, not the same. Not mutually exclusive, but not the same.

I think there are two left turns on my daily commute.

I am slow. I ride a slow, crappy, heavy bike-usually strapped down with various things like work clothes, makeup bag, and groceries. I feel almost rude sometimes on a road with no bike lanes.

I'm also in OC, where nobody has patience for anything and most people will gladly run you over just because it's Tuesday.

If I know it's a short light, I'll try to get to the front of the line, on the right of the car. That way, I lessen the chance of still being in the intersection when the light goes red.

If it's a long light, I'll wait my turn behind a car, because I know I'll have time to safely cross the intersection. Positioning is really a matter of not being in a blind spot/watching out for people who can't drive and make unnecessarily wide turns.

Yours is a logic that I just don't get when it comes to filtering either on the right or, since it appears to be a thing now, on left turns. If, as you say, "people will gladly run you over just because it's Tuesday" what do you accomplish by filtering to the front of the line? Do you want to give them another shot at running you over?

In most of my commuting, I'm being passed by cars all the time. Often I will catch them at a stoplight. If I filter to the front, they just have to pass me all over again. If the motorists in your area drive with such murderous intent, why give them a second bite at the apple? Additionally, I would think that someone shoving their way to the head of the line would be more likely to set off their murderous tendencies.

Think of it this way, if you were in a car at a left turn and someone in another car came along side of you, pulled in front of you and tried to get around the corner before you did, how would you feel towards the other driver? I couldn't think of anything that would more instantaneously set off road rage than that kind of boneheaded maneuver.

Same thing I do if I'm in a car. Get in line, though in the left tire track. If everyone else in line in front of me is going straight and the way is clear, I'll move up on the left side of all the cars and take my place behind any left turning cars.

Just this past Saturday I was making a left turn onto a major road, before making an immediate right into a parking lot by the LBS. I contemplated filtering to the right of the cars in the left lane. But then I came to my senses and waited my turn in line. This is a large intersection with those diagonal yield/merge lanes for right-turning traffic. The arrow is relatively short there, but there were only a few cars in front of me. Not much of a gap had opened up by the time I got through the intersection, not much more than if I had been in my car, really. I had no problems. As I turned right into the right lane, I immediately stuck my right hand out to signal to the motorists waiting at the right turn yield/merge lane to wait until after I passed before starting to merge into the through lane.

[MENTION=21724]cyccommute[/MENTION], thanks for the link; I have one left turn signal on my ride to work in the early a.m., and I've never been able to trip the sensor; I'll give these a try.

Also, can someone please clarify something for me? When you filter up to the first car in line, do you make an effort to get the driver's attention? It's probably just me, but even when they're aimed away from me, I don't trust drivers, and try not to assume what they're going to do.

I don't make many lighted left turns, but when I do I try to sit behind the last vehicle in line; usually the next car slides up next to me, and less often they'll wait behind me. I am slow, so I try not to take the lane in that instance; so far, so good.

Yes, my method for trying to get driver's attention is to pull in front (and to the right) of them.

If I'm going to be first in line (and going straight) I will go to the left edge of the right lane.

If I were to filter as you described, I would just turn and look towards the driver, whether they see me or not. When I'm waiting in the lane and a car comes up behind me, I turn and look towards them to make sure they stop.

As for waiting behind the last car in line, you NEED to be centered or left of center in the lane if you're going to do that. I'm slow, too (11-13 MPH average for commuting usually) but I never have problems turning left while waiting in line. Waiting in line to turn left, but being at the extreme right edge of the lane or on the lane line is not a safe place to be.

I also do this. I'm just a vehicle.