Traveldave

I'm hoping to get into bike commuting at some point in the near future. Possibly 10-15 miles each way, in varying weather. Just started checking out the forums. I don't see much discussion of the Novara Transfer. Given that this was Bicycling Magazine's editors choice for commuting bicycles, I was a little surprised.

It looks like an interesting bike, especially the internal rear hub. Has anyone had any experience with these hubs? Are they as good as REI makes them out to be (very low maintenance)?

Is this bike an editor's pick just because it comes tricked out with all the accessories, or is it a good choice because of the quality of the bike itself. I'd rather have a decent bike which I can add accessories to over a mediocre bike that comes with good accessories.

Other suggestions? I don't want to spend a ton of money on a commuter, especially since I will be leaving it outside while working.

Also, does Novarra still make the Randonee? I don't see it on the REI website.

Thanks,
Dave

DoB

The transfer looks OK to me, but it depends a lot on how you ride and how long your commute is. For me the flat bars are a non-starter. I run 25 miles round trip and flat bars have me too much up into the wind and make my wrists hurt too much.

I generally want a bike with a moderate forward lean when I'm on the hoods that becomes a fairly agressive lean on the drops so I can manage headwinds.

For this reason I started with a Bianchi San Jose. Then I had the rear wheel rebuilt with a Shimano Nexus 8 Redline hub.

The internal hub is great for commuting. I was replacing chains at 2000 miles with a derailer. Now I just run the whole package for about 15000 and replace. I apply lubrication about once per whenever I think of it which is approaching never.

cbass

I own two bikes with Shimano IGH systems, one with an Inter-7 hub with roller brake and the other with an Inter-8 with coaster brake. I use these bikes for a year-round 10 mile R/T commute. I can attest to the fact that the hubs indeed very low maintenance; clean and weather-proof. You can also shift gears at a complete stop. The hubs are a good choice for city/utility bikes or bikes ridden in wet or snowy weather. However, they are heavier and slightly less efficient that a cassette & derailleur system. Another drawback is the IGH wheels are very difficult to remove if you have a flat tire (especially in the dark by the side of the road because you have to keep track of various small nuts, bolts and washers).

For a 20-30 mile R/T commute I would advise you to look for a quality cassette & derailleur system. I think you will be happier with the drive train efficiency and ease of wheel removal. In my mind, IGH hubs are better suited to shorter commutes and city riding in start & stop traffic.

You are on the right track…sometimes it's better to buy a good bike and then add the accessories that you want later on. At a minimum, plan to spend extra $$ on fenders, lights and a good lock(s). I've also found a kickstand to be very helpful for commuting.

I've not ridden the Transfer but I have seen & handled the bike many times (I live 5 minutes from an REI store). The frame & wheels look OK but some of the other components -- stem, crank set, brake set, rack, lights. -- did not seem like they would hold up well to all-season riding. That said, they would probably be fine for most commuters' needs.

As far as I know REI still makes the Randonnee. REI is in the process of switching over to its 2009 bike line so they are likely updating their web pages at the moment. REI's bikes are currently on deep discount and can be a great bargain (if you can find one in your size). Add some fenders to the Safari and you've got yourself a fine mid-distance all-weather commuter bike.

JeffS

The Transfer and Fusion always come up in discussions of internal gear bikes. They're both good bikes for the money (assuming you're buying them during a sale).

Considering the price, the only valid complaints are:
- Novara as a brand doesn't have the appeal of the LBS brands
- These have got to be about the heaviest aluminum frames in existence. I know the line about how it's a utility bike, and it shouldn't matter, but there's still no reason for them to weigh as much as they do.

savethekudzu

+1 on the heavy. However, they are on sale right now, at least through Monday.

My Trek 7000, outfitted for commuting with lights + fenders + rack, is a lighter bike for a lower price. But I certainly see the appeal in having a bike that is properly outfitted from the start.

JeffS

It's not fair to compare a dérailleur bike to an IGH one based on price though. Typically, someone is looking at this bike because they've already made the decision that they want an internal hub.

savethekudzu

Fair enough. Not trying to sell anybody on my bike, just pointing out how surprised I was by the weight of the Fusion and the Transfer.

ShinyBiker

I would prefer that this Novarra bike be steel. I've ridden a lot of all aluminum bikes in the past and find that all-aluminum bikes tend to be rougher on the hands.

Torrilin

A friend has a Transfer. He seems to like it. It's fairly similar on paper to my Breezer Villager. The main differences are the Transfer has a generator hub, and the Villager has a standlight, loooong chainstays, a steel fork, and a chainguard. Since I haven't ridden both, I can't give a direct comparison.

I get use out of most of the Breezer's bling on a daily basis, and it would be a good bit heavier if I'd built up the same sort of bike piecewise. Judging from the comments above, the Transfer might not have as nice a design in that regard... the friend who owns it really wouldn't care much, since he rides a great deal and has a zippy bike for fun rides.

I'm really pleased with the internal hub. For my purposes (city riding, lots of stops, lots of bike/ped traffic) it's very near to ideal. There's so much inefficient on my usual routes that the minor inefficiencies of the hub just don't matter. Most time I lose is from making sure pedestrians feel safe crossing or from making sure a driver can *see* that I've stopped. For someone who doesn't deal with snow or who rides a more rural route, the hub will matter a lot more.

DoB

There's a lot of wino's along the last 2 miles of my commute to work, so I get my share of flats. To me flats are not a reason to avoid internal hubs. I carry a small allen wrench in my pannier to wind the shifter back and release the cable. It adds about 30 seconds to the entire tube change.

I do have to carry a wrench too though, since you cannot have a quick release with an internal hub.

chaadster

I don't have a Transfer, but I ride a Novara Buzz and love it as a commuter. I will, however, offer my opinon all the same!

I prefer the 700c wheel of the Buzz to the 26" Transfer's because they roll faster, can be fitted with a narrower tire, and are great in slush if you ride in the winter.

I prefer the disc brakes of the Buzz; they're always stopping at max power, irrespective of temps, rain, or snow. Not to mention sleet. When you need 'em, they'll be ready, and thats something you cant say about V-brakes.

I prefer standard derailleurs to IG hubs because they're quicker and more precise on the shift and lighter. I can't stand the vague, slow shifting of IG hubs, and I don't think any aggressive or power rider would. Don't you still have to ease off the pedal pressure to get a shift off on one of those things? Anyway, if you like to pull off from lights and jump into the city bus's draft with alacrity, look elsewhere than IG hubs.

I'd rather save weight and use a battery operated, handlebar mount LED than have the generator hub of the Transfer. I know batteries are environmentally ugly, and see the obvious benefits of the front generator hub, but when bicycle headlight batteries become a major waste issue, I'll go with their simplicity, weight, and versatility.

The Transfer is appealing in that it's kitted out with fenders and rack and lights right off the floor, but those are easy add-ons to any bike at any competent bike shop, so there's not really any added value there.

BUT, at $500, for the right rider, it looks like a pretty cool option. I think I'd like to have one to skip around on, but when I gotta get somewhere, I think I'd go with the Buzz.

YMMV.

chaadster

DoB,

This is a setup issue, not a bar issue.

If you have the right frame geometry, the right fork, the right stem, and the right size frame, you can achieve any riding position you want with any type of bar.

My posture on my commuter is forward leaning and gives me a good aero position. Bar extensions give me the extra stretch and rotated wrists similar to being on the hoods on drops. If I had drop bars on this bike, I probably couldn't even reach the drops! Okay, a bit of hyperbole, but hopefully you get my point:



Furthermore, the extra width of of your hand stance on flatbars, compared to the narrow one while on the flats of drops, slows down the steering reaction and makes the bike more stable, a benefit, I feel, for the rough and tumble world of the urban commuter. Big guys, like me, will also feel it's easier to breathe while putting the power down on a flatbar (compared to dropbar flats) because their chest is more open and breathing unrestricted.

dynaryder

Are you in the US? Cause that's not an '05 Buzz or Big Buzz. Buzzes have 26" wheels and the '05 BB's were green. Waited until '06 to get mine because the '05's had a cross double(your rings also look like the compact road double on my BB). Just curious because I've never seen one in that color.

chaadster

Dynaryder,

Hmmm, I guess I don't exactly recall the model year. I don't even recall exactly when I got it, but I think it was three years ago. In any case, I am in Michigan and it is a 700c Buzz I picked up right off the floor at an REI. The crankset and rings are not stock, I fitted those. It's a TruVative Elita with a 39/53 combo and an 11/34 9spd cogset.

PHT

I own a Transfer and I love it. I was weary of the Alex brand rims (I'm what they used to call husky) but so far they've been great. I drop it off curbs and push it through Boston sized potholes and the wheels have stayed true.

I understand it's easy to add fenders and racks to most any bike, but this site rates the Transfer rack as one of the better quality racks available. The dynohub is a nice feature and the light is adequate. I'd like to upgrade the light eventually but I have other lighting projects in the works so that's on the back burner.

As a bit of a homebrew fanatic I dig that the handlebar comes with 3 brazeons for attaching your own items. (One braze-on is used for the light, one for the reflector bracket, and one is empty) Still, I put some Nashbar trekking bars on it for additional hand positions and I'll be swapping the stem for a fixed version. I just dont like adjustable stems, but I appreciate the ability to fudge around until I find the correct angle.

I feel a little weird about buying a brand new bike in the summer and then using it in the winter, but that's what I intend to do with it....I think...maybe...I guess....hmmm *eyes old neglected trek 820 frame*

chaadster

PHT,

Wow, the handlebar has braze-ons?! That's pretty cool!

ActionJeans

I just got a K2 Merge from REI, which is supposed to be a commuter specific bike. Drop bars, flight deck type shifters, it rides very nicely, has, what seems to be so far anyway, a pretty tough wheelset, and it pretty fast when it gets up to speed.

I was going for $640 last I checked; the bike retails for $1200. Also another plus as a commuter bike, it has that matte powercoat finish on it that just doesn't seem to wear. I had a Sirrus with a similar paint job, road it into the ground (until a thief decided to take it), and it still had no real scratches on the frame.

I'll go with pluses first:

Not that heavy for a commuter bike
Decent drive train, cranks are pretty stiff too
Comfortable
Has eyelets for rear rack
Easily mount fenders with 700x32 tires (have planet bike fenders on mine)
Drop bars
Good adjustability, the front stem slides up/down for taller/shorter riders, on the top tube, so it doesn't change the handlebar geometry, it just slides... You'd have to see it maybe to understand
A lot of bike, imho, for the money.
Stock seat ain't bad.
Handles pretty well for a truck

Minuses

Pedals are crap, and will need to be replaced (horrid resin toe clip things)
Tires... ymmv, but I had a flat yesterday, and I've had the bike for 4 days... Vittoria Adventure Tour or some such... they give massive confidence in the rain, but... dunno about the flat resistance yet. I will attribute that to bad luck... for now...
Wheels are tough (seeming) but quite heavy. I was running OpenPro/Ultegra, and these are maybe close to twice the weight as built. Very heavy gauge spokes though, so if they are as tough as they seem, I will forgive the weight.

I would at least give it a shot, maybe even compare it with the Novara while you're in the store, and see what you really like. You may hate both of them, and will look for something else. G/L

PHT

Yeah, they're underneath the bars.

Unfortunately they are located juuuuust too far apart to mount a bottle cage....or at least any of the cages I have.

Another pic to give you a better idea of where they're located



I still have 'em kickin' around if anyone is interested in them *shrug*

chaadster

Thanks for the pic, PHT. They're not quite what I imagined, and rather inelegant, but interesting. There's probably more sweep back than I like, too, but in any case, I don't know what I use the mounts for anyway. If I can think of a cool app, I'll hit you up for 'em!

Hmm, come to think of it, I've often wanted a front mounted machine gun...!

Chop61

I've had my Transfer for 2 years, got it cheap as a left over last year's model. $350. It is not nimble, but it is bomb-proof. I slimed the tires, so flats are not a worry. The rack is really tough and the fenders don't rattle. Ditched the seat and put on a Brooks B68. Very comfortable.