Which Jamis frame matches the Pacer? Is it available as a frame only? I was looking but I couldn't find any.

The Satellite is probably the best match for the Pacer, but Jamis doesn't offer framesets. The Satellite is Reynolds 520 (see my earlier post about 520 tubing. Anyone have more info?) and built up costs approximately what a complete Surly build does. I'm guessing that if Surly offered a Complete Pacer it wouldn't stock a mix of Sora/Tiagra though. They'd probably throw barcon shifters on it and mix Tiagra/105.

Thank you for correcting me. :D

I didn't like those silly graphics on the bike either; I removed them within a week of getting the LHT. They're not the easiest things to remove. I used an old credit card as a scraper, and mineral oil as a solvent (no, the paint didn't come off). Two hours later, I had a bike that looked much nicer.

And as for Surlys being overrated, it depends on what your expectations are. If you're looking for a solid, well-built frame with a decent paint job, and in the case of their complete bikes, decent components, all at a fair price, Surly is hard to beat. If you want something that's featherweight, fast, and that shows off your coolness while you ride around in tights, you're probably better off getting a Felt or Cervelo or something.

The latest post on the Surly blog says that in the face of the rough economy "We at Surly are sticking with our plan to design good stuff that's built to last and not cost you a ton of cash." Says it all. You can have fancier lighter tubing but it'll probably cost more and last less. Or you can have a bike with something akin to 4130 but probably not as thoughtfully designed and versatile as the Surlies. That, I would venture, is the "niche."

Surly makes a few bikes most mainstream bike manufacturers haven't touched.... fixed gear, snow/sand and cargo hauling. Simple utilitarian bikes made of steel. Who makes bikes like that these days of it? Aluminum is all the rage now.

You could build up a Surly 1X1 as a 650b. I wouldn't see a problem there. It seems like its born for it.

What Are Dropouts ... ???
 

I'm a dummy when it comes to bicycles ... What are dropouts? Aren't there vertical and horizontal dropouts? What is the difference?

Dropouts are the slots in the frame and fork where the axles fit.

Horizontal dropouts allow the rear axle to be moved forward or back to maintain proper chain tension on a fixed-gear bike.

http://sheldonbrown.com/gloss_dr-z.html#dropout

With all that said, what should I buy as my first do everything bike (commute, exercise) - Surly Steemroller or the Felt Dispatch?

... If you want a do EVERYthing on a bike I'd recommend a touring bike or a cyclocross bike.

Depends. Are you putting fenders on it? The carbon fork on the dispatch might not have clearance for much beyond tires. The surly fork and frame have quite a bit of clearance but no eyelets. The dispatch has an "integrated" headset which some people say isn't the best thing going although they're getting pretty prolific. Aluminum feels harsher in my experience but the carbon fork will help with that, but it might not be as friendly on the vertical compliance if you know what I'm sayin'.

You may want to look at the geometry specs. I think the LHT has 46 cm chainstays while the bikesdirect have 41 or 42 (in the case of the windsor tourist). I considered the windsor as a replacement commuter thinking it might reduce my heelstrike, but I would have actually gotten shorter chainstays than the cyclocross bike I'm currently riding.

I spoke with a few folks at different bike shops and they're recommending that I go with the Felt Dispatch over the Surly Steamroller. The opinions seem to be that the aluminum/carbon combo will be better for the time I'll log working out on the bike. The commuting usage will be less than other riding.

I have two Surlys, the Big Dummy and the Cross Check. The Cross Check is wonderfully versatile. I have it set up as a road bike at the moment (105 mostly with skinny tires) but if I wanted I could set it up as a single speed or with hub gears without the need to mess around with chain tensioners. Add to that I can run 45mm tires with fenders and I can fit a rear rack to it, I really don't think there's a bike like it.

The Big Dummy is a unique bike too. Obviously it wasn't their idea to make a cargo bike in the first place but I think they've done a really good job of adapting a bike to the Xtracycle idea.

I am trying to see if I can afford a Pugsley at some stage this year.

Aluminum is uncomfortable. It's wonderfully stiff if you're worried about putting lots of power out while climbing and it's inexpensive and light. But Aluminum is not comfortable. When my aluminum racing bike gets old it's going to be replaced with a steel framed bike. I'll lose performance (I'm slow anyway) and it'll cost me more (frames are cheap anyway) but it'll be more comfortable.

You should ride both and buy whichever one you like better. Ignore the salesmen they won't be riding with you.

I'm not trying to decide why Surly's are so special I'm trying to decide which Surly I want!

I would like a SR, LHT, and a CC!

If you can have only one: CrossCheck. It's just so damn versatile.

F Surlys. :)

Surlys F u

I'd definitley like to try both, but can't find an LBS with a Steamroller. Thanks for your thoughts on the subject.

Is it Surlys or Surlies?


F?

Fine Surlies?
Fabulous Surlies?
Fun Surlies?

:p

I just ordered a 62 Beef Gravy Brown Cross Check!

This will be my first ever "road" bike, I can't wait to crash it.

So THAT's what they carry around in those flasks? :roflmao2: I'd better get som'a that - my LHT should be in Friday.

I wish I could test ride a Surly! Our local bike shops don't ever stock Surlys. And if they order one, it would have to be special order, and I'd be stuck with paying for it, without test riding first. I have no way to get to the bike shops in Stockton or Sacramento.

I'm tempted to just order the Surly Cross Check anyway ....

Surly addresses this on their website by basically telling you to test ride other bikes with similar builds. It sounds like a cop-out but really it's not a bad idea--there is nothing about their bikes that will shock you in terms of fit or ride. If anything, they are meant to be supremely generic and will probably "feel" better than you might think. Go try a Bianchi Volpe or something like that--if you like that plus the idea of slightly wider tire clearance, then I'd say you've got the basic idea.

all these comments, so few pics... i say show your surly! (i'd show mine, but i need new pics...)

http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x...m/tomarket.jpg

http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x...um/deupk01.jpg

http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x...um/deupk03.jpg

http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x...bum/surly1.jpg

http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x...r/DSCN3776.jpg

http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x...E/lht06076.jpg

http://i187.photobucket.com/albums/x...E/lht06074.jpg

cyclaholic, that is a strange and awesome handlebar setup. It's rare to see something new, especially something that isn't a horrible idea.

+1 on the Bianchi Volpe test ride as a Cross-Check simulation. The San Jose (single-speed Volpe) was my runner-up bike when I went to buy and it rode quite similar to the single-speed CC I ended up with. In fact if the San Jose had come with better wheels and different tires stock I might've gone with it. I don't see the point of knobbies unless you're going off-road - they slow you down on clear pavement and where I live you really need studs for winter.

I want a Pugsley so bad. But the Cross-Check with Nokians attached is invincible enough on anything but sand or rocks; I can't justify two grand for a beach cruiser.

Thanks.