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Tire (not tube) Repair

Old 05-15-10, 09:51 PM
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Tire (not tube) Repair

No, I'm not asking about how to fix a flat. I actually want to fix a problem with my tire.

I'm going to tell the whole sad tale, but if you aren't interested, skip to the picture and read the question that follows....

Not long ago, I posted about how much I loved the ride of my new Schwalbe Ultremo R.1 tires. I said that I wasn't sure how much I'd be able to keep myself from commuting on them. Some sage BF member (achoo) forecasted that I would be cured of that when nasty commuting conditions started flatting my nice racing tires. Almost.

I have kept myself from using these tires when the roads are wet, but that wasn't enough. After about 150 miles, I hit a patch of glass that I couldn't safely avoid, and it took a chunk out of my tire. No big deal, I fixed the flat and rode home.

Fast forward to today. I pumped the tires up this morning and went out for a 50 mile ride. When I got home and was cleaning up, I noticed that the rear tire pressure was low. So, I felt around for something stuck in the tire -- nothing. So I decided to probe the place where the tire was previously ripped to see if anything was stuck in there. I grabbed an awl, and at the gentlest touch (really), I hear "pssssssssssssss....." Oops. That's bare tube there!

So, here's the picture:



I love these tires, and I haven't even put 300 miles on them yet, but I can't very well ride around with unprotected tube showing. So the question...

What can I do to repair this tire?

I thought about putting a tube patch on the back of it and then filling the hole with rubber cement. Does anyone have anything better than that?
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Old 05-15-10, 09:58 PM
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I think it is a goner.

You might try a boot:

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Old 05-15-10, 10:02 PM
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You can also try a piece of shipping envelop that has threads inside as in a dollar bill.

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Old 05-16-10, 07:37 AM
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I repair such damaged tires by placing a patch from inside the tire on the place of the hole, you can use the same patch as for the tube, just be sure to use plenty of glue, stick patch on and keep pressure on for at least 10 min. Then I usually mount the tire on the rim, put in a tube, and then pump it up to almost max pressure. Then I leave it like that for 24 hr before going on to the second part of the repair - that makes sure that the patch is properly vulcanized to the tire, pressure of the tube upon the patch makes sure it bonds good.

Other part is taking a piece of old tube, grinding it up into rubber dust with a rough file or something similar - then mix that rubber dust with rubber glue, and fill in the hole in the tire with that from the outside. Leave to set and dry out, then repeat two to four times until you have built up slightly over the surface of the tire, then leave to set for another 24 hr on normal room temp (approx 20 deg. C). All while you work on outer part of the tire, filling the hole, keep the tire inflated and on the rim - that ensures that the hole will also be stretched out and that rubber/glue mix will fill it all up nicely. Once 24 hr curing time has passed, you may dismount the tire to store it away or just keep it on the rim. I have repaired a couple of tires this way and never had a problem with them again, at least in the repaired spot. Other areas got some more punctures Off course, do this ONLY if there is no large casing/bead/wire damage in the thread. Structure is what keeps the tire together, and if enough of the casing is damaged, the tire still might fail even if repaired properly, so be careful when deciding what can be repaired and what can't. If it's unsafe, better to throw it away and buy a new one. Remember it is preferable to crashing because the tire was far too gone to repair and it exploded while in use. I had that happen (with a completely new and undamaged tire btw), and it was no fun.
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Old 05-16-10, 08:07 AM
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I'd replace the tire with a kevlar lined racing version rather than fix it, and have another flat out in BFE. I have some nasty gashes in my tires from some pretty bad road debris, but none go further than the kevlar lining.
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Old 05-16-10, 06:50 PM
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Use a product called shoe goo. It's a silicon glue that is meant to repair holes in shoes. Works great for tires. Put a boot behind it for good measure.
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Old 05-16-10, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by emperorcezar View Post
Use a product called shoe goo. It's a silicon glue that is meant to repair holes in shoes. Works great for tires. Put a boot behind it for good measure.

Winner!!
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Old 05-17-10, 06:53 AM
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If I were hell bent on salvaging a tire, I would use a radial tire patch and NOT a tube patch. They are markedly thicker and heavy duty. You can pick up a pack for cheap money at harbor freight.

In reality, what I do is get out the wire cutters and utility knife and make a couple of dozen boots out of the old tire to pass out to fellow riders.
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Old 05-17-10, 06:55 AM
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Originally Posted by DallasSoxFan View Post
If I were hell bent on salvaging a tire, I would use a radial tire patch and NOT a tube patch. They are markedly thicker and heavy duty. You can pick up a pack for cheap money at harbor freight.

In reality, what I do is get out the wire cutters and utility knife and make a couple of dozen boots out of the old tire to pass out to fellow riders.
Linky:

https://www.harborfreight.com/56-piec...kit-97215.html
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Old 05-17-10, 08:27 AM
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I've had decent luck repairing similar (though smaller) tire problems with duct tape. Definitely the easiest solution...
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Old 05-17-10, 10:01 AM
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Yeah, I'd try to repair it too. Plenty of good things to try here.

Why would you avoid using that tire when it's wet? Bike tires don't hydroplane.
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Old 05-17-10, 11:27 AM
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Old 05-17-10, 04:24 PM
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Originally Posted by ItsJustMe View Post
Why would you avoid using that tire when it's wet? Bike tires don't hydroplane.
Wet rubber is more easily cut than dry. It's not myself I'm trying to protect, it's the tire.

Thanks everyone for the suggestions. I'll probably try Shoe Goo with a boot if I can find the Shoe Goo locally. Otherwise, maybe the rubber cement and ground-up tube.
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Old 05-18-10, 10:07 AM
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I have used rim tape to protect the tube in the past.
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Old 04-02-20, 10:57 AM
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JB Weld

I just had an issue with a low-mileage Kenda 28-622. The Kenda's are stock from my 2010 Fuji Absolute.

Absolutely no abuse: I don't ride hard, city only, on well paved roads, always with full inflation. Maybe 300 total miles on the bike. Cheap stock tires and 10 years of aging rubber, methinks.

A small tear (1mm x 10mm) on the rear tire's wear-tread led to a flat just a few days ago. I got off lucky -- the tube burst like a balloon just as I was wheeling it back inside after a 5-mile ride.

After patching the tube, I cut a piece of thick patch cloth for the inside (the iron-on type, but I just used Scotch tape to affix it -- I might rubber cement later if I have issue). As far as the outside, with the tire deflated, I inserted a bit JB Weld into the tear and surrounding area. Just enough to seal and cover the surrounding area. I'll see how all this holds.

BTW: Any thoughts on replacement tires for the mostly-city-use hybrid bike? Are Kenda's okay? I've had good experience with Conti's. My $ range is max $25/each.
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Old 04-02-20, 11:25 AM
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I missed this thread when it started (it was going ot be a few years before I came on the forum) so I cannot see the pictures but I'll post what I have done to salvage big cuts in racing quality tires. Sailcloth. Real, dacron sailcloth like we used for the jibs on small racing dinghies before all the modern stuff happened. I've been out of the sailing world a few years but the dinghy I grew up racing is still raced in big numbers n its home country of England, so I know that sailcloth is still being made.

So, the repair: Get a scrap of Daron sailcloth (for a 12' racing dinghy jib, say). Cut a patch much bigger than the cut. Glue it in place with contractor's contact cement. (The stuff you glue countertops down with. Bad stuff, Use very good ventilation.) You now have a repair just as strong and durable as the rest of the tire. Ride it until the tread dies. (If you take the tire on and off, yo may have to lift the edges and re-glue them.)

I rode the mountain descents of one of the very tough Cycle Oregons on an Open Pave with a 1/2" slice in in the casing. Wasn't pretty but I never gave it a thought on those 50 mph descents.

PS - hi Andy! It was fun to go riding with you three? springs ago, years after you started this thread! I'd just started using the new Vittoria G+ tires so I wasn't riding sailcloth that day, but many of my old Open Paves were so repaired (with a piece of sailcloth someone gave me in the '80s when I was a boatbuilder).

Ben
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Old 04-02-20, 12:07 PM
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Originally Posted by elcyc View Post
I just had an issue with a low-mileage Kenda 28-622. The Kenda's are stock from my 2010 Fuji Absolute.
[...]
BTW: Any thoughts on replacement tires for the mostly-city-use hybrid bike? Are Kenda's okay? I've had good experience with Conti's. My $ range is max $25/each.
I just looked at the stock tires: Kenda Kwest 700x28c. If they are indeed the SAME Kenda Kwest's sold today ... $20 USD/each. Amazon: 4.5 stars w/ 529 ratings

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Old 04-02-20, 05:27 PM
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+1 to that old post about using shoe goo for the binder. It's basically the normal industrial synthetic tire rubber, mixed with some solvent to keep it until you need it. Home repair, though... not fast enough for the roadside.
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Old 04-02-20, 07:03 PM
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My JB Weld + fabric lasted 2/3 of my 5 mile bike trip today. And POP! Yup ... it blew at the tear, right thru the PATCH! When I examined, I noted no JB Weld in the tear, and also, the inside fabric had shifted away from the hole -- so it was as if I done NOTHING but patch the innertube. I also inflated the tire to my normal practice (85 psi, the max for the tire). So that may have been part of the issue.
On closer inspection, I noted that the rear tire (which was never rotated with from) is considerably more worn than the front (sidewall cracks, etc.). OTOH, plenty of tread on both tires, as well as those mold-release spikes.

I want to play this experiment out as far as it'll go! Hey, tires and tubes are a "dime a dozen". Experimental data is worth billions of $!
So here's the game plan:
I rotated tire/tube (all OEM) front << -- >> rear.
To the tear, I added 3 layers of Gorilla tape (duct tape) on the inside of the tire. I also added some Gorilla tape on the outside of the tire. It looks a bit ghetto, but the tape is black, so not too shabby!
I'm still going to use 85 psi. At that pressure, I note very slight bulge at the tear. Let's see how long this lasts.
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Old 04-02-20, 08:42 PM
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I don't like rotating rear tires to the front. Rear tires lead a far harder life; not just tread wear. Fronts go a long ways; until you no longer trust the sidewall. That failure (sidewall) is a blowout, almost always; not something that is fun and can lead to a bad, no control at all crash. So I do not knowingly put a former rear tire in front. Now this repair isn't in a sidewall and the siewall has seen only short miles, but you are still risking a blowout. Front blowouts with clinchers usually don't have good outcomes.

Here, your experimental data may cost you teeth as well as money.

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Old 04-02-20, 10:30 PM
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I should clarify that the loss of air pressure was rapid; but, not literally a catastrophic event, like a balloon pop.
In any case, yes the front is a worse position for a bad tire than the rear. My problem area is near the contact-area tread. I rarely ride above 12 mph, and 1/2 of it on exclusive bike paths.

I think I might add a cut out from a toilet paper tube -- taped in place. I've also heard bill currency (e.g., $1.00 bill) is a very good temp. fix for a torn tire.
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Old 04-03-20, 08:53 AM
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I don’t repair tires. Too many bad things can happen, the least bad of which is you are stranded without a way to fix. Temporary repairs to get you to your destination are fine, but they are temporary at best.
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Old 04-03-20, 12:16 PM
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Agreed.

But hypothetically... The reason to suggest Shoe Goo is that it cures about like tire rubber. JB Weld is very stiff, so it doesn't move with the tire distension. I guess you could try latex too, that's what tubeless sealant is, but then it isn't vulcanized, it's "green".. Duct tape doesn't cure. You'd still want a fabric patch that's about like the cords that were cut. I've seen somewhere about sewing it closed with a tubular repair kit.
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Old 04-04-20, 02:23 PM
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One issue to be aware of is even after patching (whatever method) the inside, the cut on the rubber tread will tend to get bigger. This is especially true in high psi road applications. I have a hard time envisioning any glues or epoxies being successful at filling the cut to prevent further tearing at the tread when pumped up to 100psi. Thoughts?
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Old 04-04-20, 03:16 PM
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^^^ that's why there needs to be a fabric patch or sewing
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